946 replies to this topic

[Sandpit]

Roland, on 27 August 2014 - 06:19 PM, said:

Errr.. They wouldn't really get any worse for anyone other than folks trying to sync drop.

?

If those players aren't getting dropped into games and having to wait then everyone who's waiting for a slot they could fill is stuck waiting as well. Can't treat it like it's in a vacuum.

[Roland]

Sandpit, on 27 August 2014 - 06:28 PM, said:

?

If those players aren't getting dropped into games and having to wait then everyone who's waiting for a slot they could fill is stuck waiting as well. Can't treat it like it's in a vacuum.

But it's the fact that it isn't a vacuum is what makes it not really matter.

You just put those two people in two different games. It's not like there is only one game in existence at any given point of time.

[SixstringSamurai]

So basically how I understand it and it appears is that say for example Marik Monday. We have a large group trying to get a game by flooding the queue. Not maliciously, but flooding the queue. The game creates a match and then just does first come first serve to the teams:

The ones with red on the right are the same unit doing a countdown sync drop.

A simple fix is create 2 games for the queue at a time and then alternate between the 4 team assignments:
I use colored boxes to demonstrate the movement instead of drawing lines all over the place but now we have 2 goals achieved. One is that the guys trying to just have some fun with friends can while not stacking either team or the other. The other is solo players no longer have to face a pure onslaught of some team trying to troll the solo queues for evil purposes.

If we expand it further by increasing the number of games it thins it even further.

Edited by SixStringSamurai, 27 August 2014 - 06:34 PM.

[Sandpit]

Roland, on 27 August 2014 - 06:31 PM, said:

But it's the fact that it isn't a vacuum is what makes it not really matter.

You just put those two people in two different games. It's not like there is only one game in existence at any given point of time.

then you have to deal with Elo and MM stretching even further and adding even more calculations in. The MM is mediocre at best now, adding stuff liek that to it is just asking for trouble. You're also working off the assumption that PGI feels it needs to eb "fixed" which we don't even know yet.

Regardless I don't see this as a viable fix, there's got to be a better way if they do decide to call it cheating

[beerandasmoke]

Kjudoon, on 27 August 2014 - 06:23 PM, said:

And how will this be obeyed come CW when solo droppers even of the same unit will end up together. Or how about groups the size of the FWLM? What're you at now 2500? Really? You're going to alienate that size of a group?

I think some people estimate the value of their lone wolf contribution to this game.

You seem to be awful worried about CWs and LNWs. Whats your unit going to do when CW pops? Youve already said your not competitive when it comes to group warfare yet you want to mock and ridicule LNWs saying they will be dragged in. You know "solopurists" too quote. Yet if your going to be supporting House Marik then you will have too fight groups on even terms instead of syncdropping and crying that its not fair that PGI split the ques. I guess you could always cheerlead from the sidelines. Good luck with that.

Edited by beerandasmoke, 27 August 2014 - 06:45 PM.

[Roland]

Sand, unless sync droppers constitute some significant portion of the queue, there is no way that forcing them to be in separate games if they are in the same unit could have any noticeable impact on search times.

Making such a change would just prevent the small number of cases where it happens, and prevent people from trying it... And it would be pretty trivial to implement.

[beerandasmoke]

SixStringSamurai, on 27 August 2014 - 06:31 PM, said:

So basically how I understand it and it appears is that say for example Marik Monday. We have a large group trying to get a game by flooding the queue. Not maliciously, but flooding the queue. The game creates a match and then just does first come first serve to the teams:

The ones with red on the right are the same unit doing a countdown sync drop.

A simple fix is create 2 games for the queue at a time and then alternate between the 4 team assignments:
I use colored boxes to demonstrate the movement instead of drawing lines all over the place but now we have 2 goals achieved. One is that the guys trying to just have some fun with friends can while not stacking either team or the other. The other is solo players no longer have to face a pure onslaught of some team trying to troll the solo queues for evil purposes.

If we expand it further by increasing the number of games it thins it even further.

I like this gj

[Kjudoon]

Quote

[color=#959595]If we expand it further by increasing the number of games it thins it even further. [/color]

This is what happens without doing anything. The more people playing, the less likely a sync will occur

Therefore this is unnecessary.

[Kjudoon]

beerandasmoke, on 27 August 2014 - 06:37 PM, said:

You seem to be awful worried about CWs and LNWs. Whats your unit going to do when CW pops? Youve already said your not competitive when it comes to group warfare yet you want to mock and ridicule LNWs saying they will be dragged in. You know "solopurists" too quote. Yet if your going to be supporting House Marik then you will have too fight groups on even terms instead of syncdropping and crying thats its not fair that PGI split the ques. I guess you could always cheerlead from the sidelines. Good luck with that.

Do you have to go onto the ignore pile too?

[SixstringSamurai]

Kjudoon, on 27 August 2014 - 06:44 PM, said:

This is what happens without doing anything. The more people playing, the less likely a sync will occur

Therefore this is unnecessary.

Yeah no idea, I have no access to the exact programing or the process as it happens but it appears on the user end that this is not what it does. It seems to take the players as they enter the queue and throw them into the first available slot after some hasty Elo filtering at the low to mid range and taking seemly forever at the higher end. This leads me to believe that it is not in fact creating multiple games rather spawning a match, filling it, spawning another match, and filling. As to creating too many games a simple instruction like telling the lobby to close after X amount of time frees up the resource.

[Kjudoon]

I'm just telling you from practical experience that what you propose is often what happens. What happens mostly goes like this.

The Sync and elo lines up to have 6 members of the drop in the same match. It then randomly puts them on both sides but never are all of them on the same side. Very frequently it's 2/4 or 3/3 but rarely is it anything else, and I've never seen it where all are on one side. Since we often run a contest to 'kill the colonel' during our sync drops, one side tries to protect him as the other focuses on killing him for the points. Love that meta game.

[SixstringSamurai]

Kjudoon, on 27 August 2014 - 07:01 PM, said:

I'm just telling you from practical experience that what you propose is often what happens. What happens mostly goes like this.

The Sync and elo lines up to have 6 members of the drop in the same match. It then randomly puts them on both sides but never are all of them on the same side. Very frequently it's 2/4 or 3/3 but rarely is it anything else, and I've never seen it where all are on one side. Since we often run a contest to 'kill the colonel' during our sync drops, one side tries to protect him as the other focuses on killing him for the points. Love that meta game.

That's part of why I like MRBC One of the drops has a Battlemaster VIP.

[RussianWolf]

another thought, have the match maker combine any available solo dropper from the same unit into a group and drop them in the groups...lol

[Kjudoon]

RussianWolf, on 27 August 2014 - 07:05 PM, said:

another thought, have the match maker combine any available solo dropper from the same unit into a group and drop them in the groups...lol

So... deliberately force them into a game queue they specifically don't want to be in?

By this logic why don't we make the 'solo' queue only available for those with lonewolf tags (and make sure they've never had another tag ever) able to use the solo queue?

[beerandasmoke]

Kjudoon, on 27 August 2014 - 07:01 PM, said:

I'm just telling you from practical experience that what you propose is often what happens. What happens mostly goes like this.

The Sync and elo lines up to have 6 members of the drop in the same match. It then randomly puts them on both sides but never are all of them on the same side. Very frequently it's 2/4 or 3/3 but rarely is it anything else, and I've never seen it where all are on one side. Since we often run a contest to 'kill the colonel' during our sync drops, one side tries to protect him as the other focuses on killing him for the points. Love that meta game.

So you have an even split of grouped players on both sides using Voip correct? What about the soloplayers who you are dropping against who think they are fighting against individuals instead of what amounts to a premade using coms? Is that an even playing field for the soloque? But then again they dont matter right? Its all about your "fun."

[MischiefSC]

Kjudoon, on 27 August 2014 - 07:09 PM, said:

So... deliberately force them into a game queue they specifically don't want to be in?

By this logic why don't we make the 'solo' queue only available for those with lonewolf tags (and make sure they've never had another tag ever) able to use the solo queue?

And... remind me, please. Why don't they want to be in that queue when they're grouped up?

[beerandasmoke]

MischiefSC, on 27 August 2014 - 07:13 PM, said:

And... remind me, please. Why don't they want to be in that queue when they're grouped up?

Because its "no fun"

[MischiefSC]

beerandasmoke, on 27 August 2014 - 07:15 PM, said:

Because its "no fun"

Yes, but why again?

[Roland]

Because it is harder than killing disorganized solo players as a group?

[beerandasmoke]

MischiefSC, on 27 August 2014 - 07:25 PM, said:

Yes, but why again?

Group que is too hard. I need the easy way too grind. Why cant PGI bring back premades against LNWs? They took that away from me.