124 replies to this topic

[CowboyHatValor]

Zalikar, on 22 June 2012 - 10:45 AM, said:

I'm more than willing to take the risk. Just have to wait until next week to take it though. Damn bills....

Thankfully the rewards aren't immediately perishable. They'll be waiting for your next paycheck!

[Vander StarStrife]

Well, to me the risk

MinionJoe, on 22 June 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

So let's assume average risk on your $90 "investment". Ten percent of that is $9. Is the founder mech worth $9? Especially considering that there's no set value on the founder mech?

For me the risk is on how long I play the game .... if I lose interest in a few months then no, was a bad "investment" .... if I play for a year then it will be worth it

[XxZylonxX]

Lets see... Better chance at beta access, a sweet unique Mech and extra ingame currency to spend?
Yes please.

[CCC Dober]

What's the minimum buy-in at PGI anyway?

1k?
2k?
5k?
10k?
50k?

[Hayden]

Founder is also synonymous with glory.

[CowboyHatValor]

CCC Dober, on 22 June 2012 - 10:50 AM, said:

What's the minimum buy-in at PGI anyway?

1k?
2k?
5k?
10k?
50k?

Well...considering they made a minimum of half a mil within 24 hours of releasing the founders program...that number has likely gone up.

[Name48928]

Vander StarStrife, on 22 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

For me the risk is on how long I play the game .... if I lose interest in a few months then no, was a bad "investment" .... if I play for a year then it will be worth it

Yes, but as a non-Founder, I can also play for a month or a year. The time you may play the game is not a return on your investment.

The risk is your $90/$120. That's what you're risking. The reward on that risk is the Founder's mechs.

Everything else is considered a purchase because it doesn't require an "investment".

Edited by MinionJoe, 22 June 2012 - 10:58 AM.

[Corstis]

Well said, CowboyHatValor.

[CowboyHatValor]

MinionJoe, on 22 June 2012 - 10:38 AM, said:

Exactly. So what reward does a founder receive that a non-founder cannot? They receive a founder mech which a non-founder cannot receive. (Everything else in the Founders pack can be purchased by a non-Founder and cannot be considered a return on investment.)

So, is that reward worth the $90/120 risk?

Generally, when a person makes a risky investment, they have a set minimum accepted rate of return. As this number goes up, so does the risk. The minimum return with minimum risk (often accepted as no risk) is a 3 month U.S. Treasury bond. Anything above 10% is generally considered "risky". Anything approaching 25% should be viewed upon with suspicion.

So let's assume average risk on your $90 "investment". Ten percent of that is $9. Is the founder mech worth $9? Especially considering that there's no set value on the founder mech?

This pretty much ignores the primary "value" I saw. Founder's mech is cool, but $80 dollars of in game currency can't be ignored, from someone who has spent hundreds in F2P games.

Edited by CowboyHatValor, 22 June 2012 - 10:59 AM.

[Name48928]

CowboyHatValor, on 22 June 2012 - 10:58 AM, said:

This pretty much ignores the primary "value" I saw. Founder's mech is cool, but $80 dollars of in game currency can't be ignored, from someone who has spent hundreds in F2P games.

As a non-Founder, I can also purchase $80.00 of in-game currency. That's a purchase, not a return on an investment risk.

Sure, you're "getting back" more than you're "putting in", but exactly what is $80 if in-game currency worth? Eighty dollars of RL cash will keep gas in my car for a month. What will it buy in MWO?

IMO, the value of $80 of in-game cash is unknown at best and completely arbitrary at worst.

Edited by MinionJoe, 22 June 2012 - 11:01 AM.

[Lorien Benirus]

Im not gonna risk at least 30usd for a game i know nothing about except lore...I would wait until it becomes free...

[SP3CTREnyc]

CowboyHatValor, on 22 June 2012 - 10:23 AM, said:

If you invest early into something that turns out being big, you get a little more than someone who decided to join the game once success was obvious.

If you went through the process of playing the game, determining you like it, and then wanting to get the same terms as someone who "invested" early - that simply doesn't work. That's not founding something, that's just being a customer. That's seeing a product, liking the product, and paying for the product. It's extremely important for the long term success of that product, but it isn't helping to "found" anything.

Let's be honest: you're not investing in anything. You're consuming a product, not anticipating a return on your money. Also, what exactly are you getting? $80 in-game currency, only PGI said you won't be able to buy anything with real currency from the in-game store that will give you an advantage. You get a mech - or four - that earns you 25% more c-bills per battle, plus the additional 50% you get from the premium account. So you're going to reach the endgame faster than anyone, and then...

Sorry if I'm skeptical of the founder's program, but I play World of Tanks and I saw what a minimal leveling experience looks like with Star Trek Online.

[Todd Lee]

The problem with risk is that this year, and part of last have shown that taking risk isn't exactly in the players benefit. Some examples being: SW:TOR which will be going Free-to-play soon since they can't maintain a steady player base, Mass Effect 3 which largely let down it's entire player base, Diablo 3 for the same reasons as Mass Effect 3, and I'm sure there are other examples I'm not touching up on.

While I'm for supporting companies, especially small independent ones such as CD Projeckt and Valve, there are to many glaring issues that are standing out. The first being the lack of information, which I do understand that it's in beta, the lack of information on the total mech loadout for just the first year is a bit of a turn off. Another issue is, and I've said it time and time again, is buying power. If people are burning holes in their wallets and getting an obvious and overwhelming advantage, then there is a HUGE problem. The game no longer becomes free to play, it becomes who can spend the most and win.

Lastly, as someone who only likes 4-5 CLAN Heavy Mechs, what would this package do for someone like myself? Absolutely nothing.

[Name48928]

Telemakhos, on 22 June 2012 - 11:01 AM, said:

Im not gonna risk at least 30usd for a game i know nothing about except lore...I would wait until it becomes free...

You're unwilling to risk your cash. Other's are willing to take that risk on the chance of greater returns. Either option is perfectly acceptable.

I'm really only posting because I feel like I should be exercising my accounting degree at some point today instead of just pulling bank statements for auditors.

Edited by MinionJoe, 22 June 2012 - 11:06 AM.

[MetaTron7]

CowboyHatValor, on 22 June 2012 - 10:53 AM, said:

Well...considering they made a minimum of half a mil within 24 hours of releasing the founders program...that number has likely gone up.

Even if they made a million, that's really not that much. By the time you factor in salaries, Lic., Utilities, Lease, Hardware Infrastructure, blah blah blah...I'm kind of worried. Hey Piranha you guys going to be able to keep the lights on until 6 months after launch?

[Name48928]

SP3CTREnyc, on 22 June 2012 - 11:03 AM, said:

... Star Trek Online.

Half the time I logged into STO I encountered broken code. After two years, they still hadn't gotten the game running right.

And the cherry on the cake: Daily spam email from Perfect World.

Yet another F2P experience that I feverently hope PGI does not duplicate.

[Moobius]

Lord Exalted, on 22 June 2012 - 10:49 AM, said:

risk is worth it to me. and i agree the point of the founders is investing a game you hope you will enjoy kinda like kickstarter

Exactly. Getting in on the ground of something with great potential. I have high hopes for this to pan out. I'm looking forward to August now.

[William McNab]

Risk is relative - if you know someone playing the beta and have seen it in action ... not so much risk. :-)

[CowboyHatValor]

MinionJoe, on 22 June 2012 - 11:00 AM, said:

As a non-Founder, I can also purchase $80.00 of in-game currency. That's a purchase, not a return on an investment risk.

Sure, you're "getting back" more than you're "putting in", but exactly what is $80 if in-game currency worth? Eighty dollars of RL cash will keep gas in my car for a month. What will it buy in MWO?

IMO, the value of $80 of in-game cash is unknown at best and completely arbitrary at worst.

As a non-founder, you can't purchase $80 in in-game currency for $60. That simply is a return - I can't clarify that any further.

Regardless, I don't understand the discussion. I provided a distinction for the Founder status, and why "Founder," by definition, should come with risk.

I also said I respect anyone's decision not to take that offer. Why don't you respect mine to take it?

[SideSt3p]

I invested because this isn't a risky investment for me. Why? Because frankly this is money I have budgeted into my monthly expenses which I can spend on video games however I want.

I also think that a product can only be great if given a chance. All products require some initial risk.

I don't personally care if people do or don't buy the Founders Packages. It's a way you can contribute to PGI if you so wish and those that are skeptical don't have to. Honestly, the less people who buy, the more unique my 'Mech will be

From what I have seen and experienced with this game, I am a believer that given a little bit of time after launch we'll have a FANTASTIC F2P game which can compete with LoL and WoT in terms of player base. And probably surpass both in terms of longevity and depth of detail oriented play. It's gonna be great, and if you don't believe me, I'll be around to tell you, "I told you so."

Edited by SideSt3p, 22 June 2012 - 11:10 AM.