226 replies to this topic

[UnofficialOperator]

If you are in the bottom 20% of the players.

Its frequently just wrong.

[Bombast]

Honestly, I'm not sure someone is qualified to command until they're better than 99.84% of the population.

[Relishcakes]

I mean..at least they are communicating.

[UnofficialOperator]

Relishcakes, on 25 September 2018 - 05:06 PM, said:

I mean..at least they are communicating.

[Funky Bacon]

I would rather have my team follow a bad order than have no direction at all.

[Kanil]

Funky Bacon, on 25 September 2018 - 05:22 PM, said:

I would rather have my team follow a bad order than have no direction at all.

... I'd think that would depend a lot on just how bad the order is. Teams just aimlessly wandering around HPG doing their own thing tend to do better than ones that actively try to get people to go basement.

[MrXanthios]

Relishcakes, on 25 September 2018 - 05:06 PM, said:

I mean..at least they are communicating.

Yep. Not saying that communicative teams always win, but usually when noone talks from the beginning, it usually end up in a shameful stomp.

[Dragonporn]

Kanil, on 25 September 2018 - 05:25 PM, said:

... I'd think that would depend a lot on just how bad the order is. Teams just aimlessly wandering around HPG doing their own thing tend to do better than ones that actively try to get people to go basement.

Just recently I managed to talk folks into going basement on HPG (Skirmish), we literally murdered enemy team, rolled over them and stomped into the ground. However, most challenging part was to keep trigger-happy folks from leaving the deathball. Every time people try to take top on HPG, it ALWAYS turns into big, fat disorganized s***show, and either team can only win purely by luck.

[Moldur]

Part of leadership is knowing when to be a follower.

[Bombast]

Funky Bacon, on 25 September 2018 - 05:22 PM, said:

I would rather have my team follow a bad order than have no direction at all.

That's a recipe for HPG basement camping.

Dragonporn, on 25 September 2018 - 05:39 PM, said:

Just recently I managed to talk folks into going basement on HPG (Skirmish), we literally murdered enemy team, rolled over them and stomped into the ground. However, most challenging part was to keep trigger-happy folks from leaving the deathball. Every time people try to take top on HPG, it ALWAYS turns into big, fat disorganized s***show, and either team can only win purely by luck.

See?

You have it backwards, by the way. Taking top allows for offensive options. Taking bottom enters you into a "Who gets bored first" contest. Bottom is luck, top is not.

Edited by Bombast, 25 September 2018 - 05:58 PM.

[UnofficialOperator]

Dragonporn, on 25 September 2018 - 05:39 PM, said:

Just recently I managed to talk folks into going basement on HPG (Skirmish)

Spotted the problem guys!!! Live one here!

[Dragonporn]

Bombast, on 25 September 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

That's a recipe for HPG basement camping.



See?

You have it backwards, by the way. Taking top allows for offensive options. Taking bottom enters you into a "Who gets bored first" contest. Bottom is luck, top is not.

We're talking about QP here, people are impatient, so it doesn't take much for enemies to start pouring into your well positioned deathball with craploads of cover. It can go sideways, if your teammates start poking out too much, other than that, there's no possible way to coordinate team in QP, to be able to successfully assault from several different entrances, and have precise target callouts to pull it off. They usually come disorganized from 2 tunnels tops, while defense in this case is always way more advantageous, since all your backsides are safe and guns point out in enemy direction. But enemies forced to come in a line, which makes literally 3-5 mechs from your team shoot one from the enemy, you don't even need to call anything, so rather quickly you get numbers advantage, and than it doesn't matter what your team does, you just win.

When either team pushed the top, nobody stays there for more than few seconds, because every time they do, they get killed (or turned into sticks) very quickly by backshots, since, again, in QP there's no possibility to coordinate team to cover each others' flanks. People just aimlessly climb up, pick random targets, don't consider teammates and personal position. So in 100% of cases, first team who gets to the top, drops down on opposite side, and leaves slower mechs behind, to be munched on by faster ones. So it always comes down to who nascars into who sooner. Crap like that doesn't happen in the basement, but yeah, talking everyone going there and, most importantly, staying in one place is quite a feat on its own.

[UnofficialOperator]

Dragonporn, on 25 September 2018 - 06:16 PM, said:

We're talking about QP here, people are impatient, so it doesn't take much for enemies to start pouring into your well positioned deathball with craploads of cover. It can go sideways, if your teammates start poking out too much, other than that, there's no possible way to coordinate team in QP, to be able to successfully assault from several different entrances, and have precise target callouts to pull it off. They usually come disorganized from 2 tunnels tops, while defense in this case is always way more advantageous, since all your backsides are safe and guns point out in enemy direction. But enemies forced to come in a line, which makes literally 3-5 mechs from your team shoot one from the enemy, you don't even need to call anything, so rather quickly you get numbers advantage, and than it doesn't matter what your team does, you just win.

When either team pushed the top, nobody stays there for more than few seconds, because every time they do, they get killed (or turned into sticks) very quickly by backshots, since, again, in QP there's no possibility to coordinate team to cover each others' flanks. People just aimlessly climb up, pick random targets, don't consider teammates and personal position. So in 100% of cases, first team who gets to the top, drops down on opposite side, and leaves slower mechs behind, to be munched on by faster ones. So it always comes down to who nascars into who sooner. Crap like that doesn't happen in the basement, but yeah, talking everyone going there and, most importantly, staying in one place is quite a feat on its own.

It doesn't work. This is advice I heard in T5 when I started out years back. 99% of the time it doesn't work. When I went up in tiers, the winning strategy was always to get top. Then you realize why the same guys are still stuck in T5

Edited by UnofficialOperator, 25 September 2018 - 06:39 PM.

[Dago Red]

Bombast, on 25 September 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

Honestly, I'm not sure someone is qualified to command until they're better than 99.84% of the population.

I am concerned that with this community it is 100% impossible to tell if this statement is some kind of satire or deadly serious.

[Novakaine]

I would be remiss if denied people the smooth silky tones of my voice.

[LordNothing]

Relishcakes, on 25 September 2018 - 05:06 PM, said:

I mean..at least they are communicating.

yes but maybe say something better than how much lrm ammo they are carrying and how many tubes they have and to hold locks so they can single handedly kill the entire enemy team. and if they would stop talking maybe i could warn them about the piranha chewing through their back armor. "stupid team".

Edited by LordNothing, 25 September 2018 - 07:32 PM.

[Shadowomega1]

Bombast, on 25 September 2018 - 05:57 PM, said:

That's a recipe for HPG basement camping.



See?

You have it backwards, by the way. Taking top allows for offensive options. Taking bottom enters you into a "Who gets bored first" contest. Bottom is luck, top is not.

Yet people still complain every time I say take the top. I end up taking it by myself, then getting bent over as their assaults, all come up and forced off while 1 of our slowest assaults goes around the outermost ring against the wall, and the rest of the team goes around the mid ring. The outer ring assault starts whining about lights, and one of the other slow assaults that didn't even poke the top of the ramp is now yelling about NASCARing.

*facepalm*

Looks at the end of the match score and is the only one to breach 400 damage in a mech that was in tatters from attempting to hold the top till backup arrived. (In a medium mech no less) and I see charlie lance with a grand total around 400 damage between the 4 mechs. Getting real tired of people who can not use assaults properly, wasting time, and space for those who can.

Edited by Shadowomega1, 25 September 2018 - 07:34 PM.

[LordNothing]

Bombast, on 25 September 2018 - 05:04 PM, said:

Honestly, I'm not sure someone is qualified to command until they're better than 99.84% of the population.

this. i could probably count all the good drop callers i know without using my toes.

[Mr Steinbrenner]

If you positive and passionate about your strat there is almost zero change you are below top 20% in QP match score. The people who communicate positively are usually people that have a will to win the video game, and when 50% of your community barely gives a **** about winning and just likes staring in 3rd person at their pretty robot back before putting out under 200 damage and dying, theres a good chance they win more than they lose.

Edited by Mr Steinbrenner, 25 September 2018 - 08:01 PM.

[Judah Malganis]

The contrast between Dragonporn's HPG basement and Shadowomega1's HPG top stories pretty much sum up my thoughts on the matter: in QP, everyone following a bad plan is usually better than one or two guys doing the right thing and everyone else dragging their knuckles on the ground.

It's amazing how participation is so disincentivized in MWO. "I don't press R because I hate LRM boats", "I don't use VOIP because nothing good comes of it", " I don't follow calls because reasons", among other selfish streaks shown by players in this game. We all have self-interest, but somehow, the devs don't reward participation (or punish failure to participate) in such a way that it overrides that self-centeredness.

Edited by Judah Malganis, 25 September 2018 - 08:59 PM.