165 replies to this topic

[Astrocanis]

PACoFist, on 24 October 2014 - 05:08 PM, said:

The other game modes will not disappear when we get CW. So you can continue to play the way you like best. What is the problem?

Perhaps because rewards and friends will go CW and he won't?

Have you played as a two man in group queue lately? CW is going to be that bad on steroids.

[King of the Woad]

I am trying to level my Battlemaster. The rewards for it are so low that I'm about to give up. I simply don't have it in me to grind for a month to get the tier 1 skills on it.

Am I a drag on my team in it? Of course. But, if I keep trying to level it, it's going to stay that way.

Imagine what new players go through.

[edit] Never been cored by teammates so much in my entire game time. It's always bad on weekends, but the tournament is rendering the game ridiculous and brutal.

Fix this crap.

Edited by King of the Woad, 25 October 2014 - 07:09 AM.

[AntleredCormorant]

Deathone, on 23 October 2014 - 06:53 AM, said:

Introduce some rewards for following commands. The whole commander and command system is useless since years. Organized groups use TS, lonewolfs dont use or follow the command system. 'Attack this' .. why should i ?

This x1000. Getting people to use & follow the command system would add to the quality of gameplay tremendously.

As a relatively new player (to this version of MW anyway) & a fan of sim/tactical-type games in general, the biggest gripe I've had with the game so far is the amount of grabassing & lack of strategy.

It's unfortunate, because IMO the command system itself is very easy to use.

[GreyNovember]

A thought with regards to Conquest and assault rewards.

Suppose if you were to win by cap, you would gain a ransom bonus on all surviving enemy mechs, one that outweighs trying to find and destroy them.

[senaiboy]

This is seriously a way heavy grind at the moment. I've mentioned it in another post, the C-bills earning have already taken a hit when we move from 8v8 to 12v12. When you say it is within 5-10% difference in earnings compared to the previous system, I seriously cannot believe that - a whole weekend of playing proved otherwise.

At the current rate I can't really convince myself it is worth my time playing at all. And that is me already using my Hero mechs trying to grind C-bills. I can't imagine how new players would felt considering if you don't play it the way the game rewards you to, you get pittance.

For the love of Battletech, find another way to keep people playing the game. Increase the C-bills costs of CW if you have to. Prolonging the grind will only serve to drive everyone away.

[Alexander MacTaggart]

senaiboy, on 26 October 2014 - 04:39 AM, said:

Prolonging the grind will only serve to drive everyone away.

The core of the problem and the reason why "I'm doing fine, you just need to get good" type replies entirely miss the point.

[mmstahlman]

45% off sale, while cutting rewards so bad it is almost not worth playing... Smart. It's like raising the price of everything by 35% and putting shadowhawk and stormcrow on 10% sale.

Honestly, I am pissed because I would grind for the stormcrow - but it isn't worth it with these pathetically low rewards.

I LOVE THE NEW MODEL of new goals and role based rewards.
I HATE the reduction in amount of c-bills...

About to buy the resistance pack... But...
If rewards stay this low, I will be playing much less often.

Edited by mmstahlman, 26 October 2014 - 09:22 AM.

[The Boz]

I just have two questions, and noone has yet answered them to my satisfaction:
1. Why does League of Legends have the same rewards for the entire team, win or lose?
2. Why has this not resulted in massive afk farming in League of Legends?

[senaiboy]

The Boz, on 26 October 2014 - 12:19 PM, said:

I just have two questions, and noone has yet answered them to my satisfaction:
1. Why does League of Legends have the same rewards for the entire team, win or lose?
2. Why has this not resulted in massive afk farming in League of Legends?

I've only played LoL a long time ago, and not very often. But I did encounter those 'AFK' players a few times and it's very annoying. If it returns to MWO, it'll put even more players off than it already has by this point.

If you've been playing this game since Closed Beta you would have met a few farmers as well before their attempts to curb it - those who overheats at the beginning, those who run out of bounds, those who run towards enemies then disconnect after they get killed in the first minute, etc. Everyone used to get 100k+ regardless if you 'contributed'.

Although to answer your question, I guess it's because C-bills in MWO = better mechs (upgrades, modules, etc)? I can't remember what rewards LoL give you, but I'm guessing it's not to get better heroes than others.

Edited by senaiboy, 26 October 2014 - 01:59 PM.

[Hoax415]

The Boz, on 26 October 2014 - 12:19 PM, said:

I just have two questions, and noone has yet answered them to my satisfaction:
1. Why does League of Legends have the same rewards for the entire team, win or lose?
2. Why has this not resulted in massive afk farming in League of Legends?

Well firstly LoL has tons of anti-afk tools/scripts running.

Secondly they have a robust and incredibly complex player reporting system that only functions because they are a MASSIVE playerbase. That system was developed out of necessity in part because players were so willing to go to great lengths to abuse the system.

Also in LoL if you afk/quit out and are caught by the system you take a penalty that prevents you from playing for at least 15 minutes I believe? They have changed the values many times and I think it escalates? I stopped playing it after Dota2 got close to being done can't say for sure. Regardless there are HARSH penalties for being a leaver.

In LoL, a team is five players, which means much more responsibility per player. And the games are 20+ minutes not 5 minutes like a stomp is in MWO, again much more responsibility per player to not abandon teammates and if you do abandon them you are in all likelyhood causing a loss. Players in MWO can justify suiciding a light mech because its just 1/12th of the team's forces and less than that in terms of tonnage so who cares they can still win and earn you a win bonus.

Most importantly in LoL your account can't be in two games. In MWO you can be in as many games as you have mechs.

So the most major fundamental trade off, that you need to convince the community and PGI is worth it would be that in order for all players to make good rewards no matter what: once you drop in a match you can never drop in another match until the first match ends.

I do not think that's a trade the playerbase is willing to make.

Edited by Hoax415, 26 October 2014 - 04:20 PM.

[The Boz]

senaiboy, on 26 October 2014 - 01:57 PM, said:

I've only played LoL a long time ago, and not very often. But I did encounter those 'AFK' players a few times and it's very annoying. If it returns to MWO, it'll put even more players off than it already has by this point.

Although to answer your question, I guess it's because C-bills in MWO = better mechs (upgrades, modules, etc)? I can't remember what rewards LoL give you, but I'm guessing it's not to get better heroes than others.

Damn, that must have been a VERY long time ago. The only place you can find an afker today is in Coop vs AI.
And IP in LoL gives you heroes, runes, runesets, mastery pages... think of them as mechs, modules, mechbays, and variants.

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

Well firstly LoL has tons of anti-afk tools/scripts running.

And we can't have afk detection tools and scripts because..? And don't say these tools are "incredibly taxing on the hardware" or some such nonsense, because they're not. Firstly because "the tools" aren't just one set, and secondly, because you can customize who they track and when, limiting uptime.

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

Secondly they have a robust and incredibly complex player reporting system that only functions because they are a MASSIVE playerbase. That system was developed out of necessity in part because players were so willing to go to great lengths to abuse the system.

"In part" being a very, very small part. The reporting system was primarily made for feeders and griefers and what not.

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

Also in LoL if you afk/quit out and are caught by the system you take a penalty that prevents you from playing for at least 15 minutes I believe? They have changed the values many times and I think it escalates? I stopped playing it after Dota2 got close to being done can't say for sure. Regardless there are HARSH penalties for being a leaver.

Here, read up. http://leagueoflegen...i/Leaver_Buster
So, if the system detects you're afk or have left the game while still alive, you get no CB or XP, and all your mechs are locked out for 6 minutes (15 if you repeat within 24 hours). You also take an Elo hit equal to a "significant loss" (ie, you were greatly expected to win the match-up).

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

In LoL, a team is five players, which means much more responsibility per player. And the games are 20+ minutes not 5 minutes like a stomp is in MWO, again much more responsibility per player to not abandon teammates and if you do abandon them you are in all likelyhood causing a loss. Players in MWO can justify suiciding a light mech because its just 1/12th of the team's forces and less than that in terms of tonnage so who cares they can still win and earn you a win bonus.

You say "more responsibility" because a match lasts longer, but that can also translate into "more incentive to leave and end the pain".

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

Most importantly in LoL your account can't be in two games. In MWO you can be in as many games as you have mechs.

...so? If you die, you get to leave with no penalty, and play another match in another mech. I do not see the problem with this. Unless you're claiming that it is somehow impossible to differentiate intentional suicide farmers from legitimate early deaths.

Hoax415, on 26 October 2014 - 04:17 PM, said:

So the most major fundamental trade off, that you need to convince the community and PGI is worth it would be that in order for all players to make good rewards no matter what: once you drop in a match you can never drop in another match until the first match ends.

I do not think that's a trade the playerbase is willing to make.

Why? How did you get to this conclusion? What are you basing this off of?

- - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - - -

Now, with that answered, does anyone who actually knows what I'm talking about want to try and answer the question?

[Jabilo]

I have given it another go tonight and tried to be fair.

Rewards are a joke and I can not even be bothered to play.

Not too constructive perhaps, but there it is - too frustrated to write a long post right now.

Just put the damn things back to how they were.

Edited by Jabilo, 27 October 2014 - 02:09 PM.

[Inti Raymi]

Jabilo, on 27 October 2014 - 02:08 PM, said:

I have given it another go tonight and tried to be fair.

Rewards are a joke and I can not even be bothered to play.

Not too constructive perhaps, but there it is - too frustrated to write a long post right now.

Just put the damn things back to how they were.

Add to my dismay the fact that "teamwork" now largely consists of tagging and lrming everything in sight with no thought, for the most part, about objectives. What's worse is that skirmish now consists practically solely of mechs hiding without fighting or being tagged, narced and destroyed within seconds - and the game now REWARDS the "hide or run away" playstyle.

I'm to the point where I can hardly stand to login and play a round any more. The weapons systems aren't the problem. The problem is a reward system that compensates single minded abuse and NOT what it was supposed to reward - team play.

[Mad Pig]

I like it. Can we bring back re-arm and repair now?

[Astrocanis]

Airox, on 22 October 2014 - 11:14 AM, said:

To go off an earlier post I made in this thread, I don't believe the intention or even necessarily the values are bad. I believe the implementation of intention is bad. An example:

Lance Formation bonus gives cbills if all members of a lance stays within 130m of each other. The goal as I understand it is to encourage players to stick together and not run off. This reward however doesn't take into account scouts, disconnects, friends wanting to play together in different lances, or even tonnage/speed differences within a lance. Further it encourages players to worry about an imaginary line of distance from lance mates instead of actually pursuing the goal of winning.

My revised rule:
Every [5] seconds you receive [15] cbills for every allied mech within [100]m. Every [5] seconds you receive [10] cbills for every allied mech [101] to [150]m. Every [5] seconds you receive [5] cbills for every allied mech [151] to [200]m. [Numbers] subject to change.

Why not just rename the game Murderball Online?

I'm actually not shooting at you. I've just had it. The rewards are making it nigh impossible for new players to level. A friend started with me on Friday and quit Saturday after he figured out what it would take just to make his mechs bearable. Because the vanilla mechs are ~not~ bearable.

Until they figure out what to do with rewards, please take my share and distribute it among yourselves. I won't be on to collect any.

[Astrocanis]

Mad Pig, on 29 October 2014 - 06:25 PM, said:

I like it. Can we bring back re-arm and repair now?

Make it opt-in and it's a deal. Because I can't afford consumables on a loss right now. And the thought of having rnr added to the costs would drive me completely (er) away from this game.

[Gattsus]

If I didn't have hero mechs or PT, the grinding would be insurmountable. It would feel like the tale of Sisyphus.

The CB grinding rate would be so slow!

[That Dawg]

Whatever happened to the "fixes" planned?
I'd forgotten about this thread or wouldn't have started a new one.

Cbills are down, and yes, I quantitatively understand how to make money.
XP seems higher than it used to be, but CBILLs are surely down
Comparing screens around the start of this thread, to several in the last few nights, its down.

[Gattsus]

I'm still waiting for rewards 3.0
Ams/ecm rewards
Higher assist reward

[Yokaiko]

2.0 sucked from the get, and still does