108 replies to this topic

[Malcolm Vordermark]

After a decent amount of experience in the Adder I think heavily armed but slower light mechs can do just fine. You won't be seeing them in competitive play but for general use they'll be fine.

[Krivvan]

For a "Lord's Light" it doesn't seem too great yet.

But in all seriousness, the hardpoints are a pretty big downfall when there are less than all the decent lights. The question is simply, what can the Panther do better than a Spider, Commando, Jenner, and Firestarter can't? And I don't see an answer to that.

If they want to keep to the idea of a Light that is slower but still viable, then it either needs more hardpoints than the fast lights are capable of having or it needs some seriously dramatic quirks.

[Deathlike]

The only way I see it getting any real play, is if it had Griffin-like torso twist capabilities. Outside of that, it wouldn't have a shot of surviving at the speed given to it.

If the engine cap were to be raised to 260 or 265, I could be OK with that. It happens to be the only engine cap (currently) that isn't in use IIRC (used to be owned by old Centurion and Hunchback caps) and it's an excuse to reuse the old Jagermech XL engine in one of the variants.

[Sergeant Random]

Low speed, hardpoints few and oddly distributed... likely tier 4 or 5. Pretty sure it's gonna get quirks.

[AssaultPig]

won't be fast enough

I guess we'll see what quirks it gets, but it doesn't have any interesting hardpoint layouts or ECM so it's hard to see why you wouldn't rather just use a jenner or firestarter.

[MeiSooHaityu]

It will be quick enough.

An ERLLaser sniper doesn't need to be fast.

Even if you go a route like...2MPLasers and 2SRM4+Art (or a blend of SRM4 and SRM6s), you can stick near cover and jump out behind an enemy and back stab him.

Plus, isn't 127 before speed tweak? it will probably hit mid 130s after that.

[stjobe]

As someone who used to run and have fun (and a fair amount of success) in a Ghetto Panther PNT-10K, I can safely say that the real deal will also be fun.

Speed isn't everything - once you get to a certain level of light 'mech battlefield awareness you can start dialling down on speed in favour of other things. Of my five Commandos, only one goes 171, the rest have lower-than-max engines.

The biggest problem with the Panther isn't going to be its speed, it's going to be its loadout - the PPC was a terrifying weapon on a light in TT, in MWO it's outdone by three MLs due to instant convergence.

I'm sure as hell going to master mine though - been waiting for the Panther for the longest time

[Elizander]

MeiSooHaityu, on 23 October 2014 - 02:01 AM, said:

It will be quick enough.

An ERLLaser sniper doesn't need to be fast.

Even if you go a route like...2MPLasers and 2SRM4+Art (or a blend of SRM4 and SRM6s), you can stick near cover and jump out behind an enemy and back stab him.

Plus, isn't 127 before speed tweak? it will probably hit mid 130s after that.

It's 127 with tweak. You can test it out by putting a 250 on a Jenner on Smurfy.

[Tahribator]

127KPH is not that bad. From the looks of it, it'll actually be slimmer than a Firestarter which means better survivability.

I don't think it'll be a sniper though. Looks like that arm-PPC is going to be underslung, which means you have to expose yourself fully to shoot.

It has both E and M hardpoints, why not make it a brawly 'Mech with PPC heat(like 50% off from ERPPC) and missile heat quirks? That'd fit a unique role with heavy hitting weapons on a light.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Elizander, on 23 October 2014 - 02:06 AM, said:

It's 127 with tweak. You can test it out by putting a 250 on a Jenner on Smurfy.

Ok, still quick enough IMO.

[MonkeyCheese]

I will preorder it for the same reasons that I preordered the mist lynx. I like the design, they have jumpjets and all the negativity just makes me want to drive em and show that they are perfectly usable.

I have known well from closed beta up to now that the raven 4x works great as a ppc sniper. The panther has more jumpjets, arm actuators amd will obviously get ppc quirks.

[SweetJackal]

A 'slow' light is only a death sentence if you are trying to use speed to weave through the enemy team. The slower you are the more you have to use terrain and be aware of your positioning. This isn't just true of lights but all weight classes. Speed lets you be further away from the team and be safe.

[LordKnightFandragon]

It will be a decent enough light. Just if players would stop relying on their speed to avoid the entire enemy team when they go on thier 10 seconds in suicide runs, maybe they would think mechs like the Panther are actually pretty good, seeing how it comes with a PPC..pretty good firepower for a light.....

Maybe you could try supporting your allies over suiciding at the start......which I swear, no joke, is what I see every single game....lights go out first and die....Lights UP right?

SuckyJack, on 23 October 2014 - 02:25 AM, said:

A 'slow' light is only a death sentence if you are trying to use speed to weave through the enemy team. The slower you are the more you have to use terrain and be aware of your positioning. This isn't just true of lights but all weight classes. Speed lets you be further away from the team and be safe.

Or lets you get further away from the team and gives you a false sense of security that the enemy team cant aim well enough to wax you.....

[AssaultPig]

if you use an STD250, you have about eight tons for weapons/equipment. An XL250 leaves you with about 14 tons. You're not gonna pack 'a lot of firepower' onto that with IS weapons, especially given the rather limited hardpoints.

[SweetJackal]

LordKnightFandragon, on 23 October 2014 - 02:27 AM, said:

Or lets you get further away from the team and gives you a false sense of security that the enemy team cant aim well enough to wax you.....

Actually it's a very simple formula. Less time exposed means less time to be damaged. Less time to be damage means taking less damage. More speed means crossing ground between cover faster and spending less time exposed. Meaning more routes open up as you can either get farther on the same amount of risk or cover the same ground as before with less risk.

Risk is always relative to positioning. No matter the speed it is always a high risk environment for a light if the enemy team is facing your direction and has firelines on your path. Since weaving requires you to move through the enemy firelines it is always a high risk action, the positioning of enemy mechs, their relative facing and your own speed and ability to maintain it can severely mitigate that risk. Trying rush 4 heavies head on to weave through them is normally asking to suck down some big hits.

Saying speed confers safety away from the team isn't saying speed makes it impossible for the enemy to hit me. It is saying it allows me to provide less opportunities for the enemy to hit me. Proper use of speed is to use it to deny the enemy the chance to aim at you. Improper use of speed is to try to use it to counter the enemy's ability to aim.

Edited by SuckyJack, 23 October 2014 - 03:01 AM.

[LordKnightFandragon]

SuckyJack, on 23 October 2014 - 02:59 AM, said:

Actually it's a very simple formula. Less time exposed means less time to be damaged. Less time to be damage means taking less damage. More speed means crossing ground between cover faster and spending less time exposed. Meaning more routes open up as you can either get farther on the same amount of risk or cover the same ground as before with less risk.

Risk is always relative to positioning. No matter the speed it is always a high risk environment for a light if the enemy team is facing your direction and has firelines on your path. Since weaving requires you to move through the enemy firelines it is always a high risk action, the positioning of enemy mechs, their relative facing and your own speed and ability to maintain it can severely mitigate that risk. Trying rush 4 heavies head on to weave through them is normally asking to suck down some big hits.

Saying speed confers safety away from the team isn't saying speed makes it impossible for the enemy to hit me. It is saying it allows me to provide less opportunities for the enemy to hit me. Proper use of speed is to use it to deny the enemy the chance to aim at you. Improper use of speed is to try to use it to counter the enemy's ability to aim.

And an even better way to mitigate damage taken as a light.....be near bigger targets......guys will probably be more apt to shoot that Timby bearing down on them over the little commando....

[Training Instructor]

It will be okay. Not great, but okay. Fewer heat problems than the Firestarter or Jenner.

The energy beams will automatically converge since they're all on the same arm.

[STEF_]

Let's discuss about how PGI is good to grab my money

Since clan wave 1 I began to open my wallet, and it turns out to be like a drug

About the panter, I would like to pilot a viable ppc based build with enought speed; something that reminds me the panters I used in TT.
Quirks will be very important, and hitboxes too.

[The Boz]

Is any Panther variant going to be ECM-compatible?

[Joseph Mallan]

Bishop Steiner, on 22 October 2014 - 04:40 PM, said:

Max Engine: 250
2 AMS
2 Energy (RA)
2 Missile (CT)

Will it be fast enough, weapons versatile enough to compete?

8Z
250 engine
3 Energy (RA)
2 Missiles (CT)
1 AMS

9R
250 engine
4 Energy (RA)
1 Missile (CT)
1 AMS

and of course, no ECM.

Debate.

As a Design, The Panther was meant to be Medium/Long range support for Jenners. The speed was compensated for by armor and range. I would thing 124 KpH would be fine.

Dear god that is a sexy Mech.

Edited by Joseph Mallan, 24 October 2014 - 04:01 AM.