134 replies to this topic

[TheGallows]

There are 4 reasons you got killed by a firestarter.

1) You got swarmed by multiple mechs, which is either your fault for being out of position or your teams fault for dying.
2) You got shot in the rear, which is your fault for not backing up against solid cover.
3) You get straight up dpsed from the front, which is your fault for being unable to hit a mech at 138meters.
4) You are driving a <35 ton light, which is PGIS fault for not buffing underperforming mechs.

Lights make up <10% of the queue, making any claim they are overpowered ridiculous. If you can't handle a light, the only problem is you.

[GalmOne]

FS9-A is probably one if not THE best light atm
Lots of weapons, nice speed, good arm tanking when needed ( so many times you can avoid dieing to double gauss just by twisting to the side) and JJ is basicaly all you want on a light

I also prefer it over the K becouse you are less penalized for losing your arms since you lose only 4 lasers instead of 8

I love it, every pixel of it

[KraftySOT]

Its strong, but still weaker than a Wubshee, Wubcada, etc...its got a nasty bite, but its also just a Firestarter. Dies real easy if you have a good connection <100ms. More and it gets wonky.

[Satan n stuff]

CapperDeluxe, on 14 November 2014 - 09:14 AM, said:

Especially the range part is of note. I'd still rather take a medium laser any day over a small pulse because getting in that close to the enemy greatly increases the risk of dying an early death.

The small pulses are definitely good against other lights, but it is extremely risky to get that close to anything over 50 tons.

[Zoid]

The only thing wrong with the Firestarter right now is hit registration. You don't see them running in and out of 3 assaults and 3 heavies while taking less than 10% damage because they're just that good or the enemies are just that bad, you see it because the hits just don't register.

So let's not nerf a 'mech because a core game mechanic isn't working properly, let's try to get that core mechanic working.

[AssaultPig]

FS9s will always have some hitreg issues as a result of how fast they move, but they don't seem to be any worse than any other light. Those of us who remember the invincible spider days know what bad hitreg really looks like, and firestarters don't suffer from it.

I've driven every FS9 other than the H; they're a lot of fun and the new quirks have made them more effective, but I don't really think any mech that's as short-ranged as they are can be considered overpowered. You can carve mechs up if you get close to them, but getting within ~150m in a light mech is often pretty dangerous.

Edited by AssaultPig, 28 November 2014 - 12:55 PM.

[Octantis]

Zoid, on 28 November 2014 - 12:46 PM, said:

You don't see them running in and out of 3 assaults and 3 heavies while taking less than 10% damage because they're just that good or the enemies are just that bad, you see it because the hits just don't register.

I will disagree on this one. I find the reason I don't get lit up my running through the enemy is that I do it from odd angles. Most mechs don't bother to look left or right from the blob. If you can hold your Nut in a light and wait until 200 m or less to fire a shot you are within 80m by the end of the first recycle. Most mechs won't even bother to turn until something goes critical thinking it is a errant gauss round or something. Finally weapons with long recharge times like ERLL or even some ACs can't get another shot off by the time the light has rounded the corner. So at most I may have to face one alpha from a mech during a strafe run. If you can pop the leg off a light going 150 kph under 100 m at a 90 degree cross with an ac 20 round you deserve that kill. Personally I don't think there are many people that good.

Lights get into trouble when they get greedy. If they start circling an assault they are probably going to get nailed by a teammate.

[YueFei]

Mechs with short range weapons *ought* to be deadly dangerous.

They take huge risks to get that close. They have to close in unobserved, totally unable to retaliate against any enemy fire at range.

And finally, when they do close in, if their selected target has friends, the danger level amps up even more. An observant enemy standing 200 to 300 meters away has a much more relaxed, lower deflection angle shot to make. God knows that a crackshot from a skilled teammate has peeled more than 1 Light mech off of me.

Let's not cry tears over a mech that can finally make formidable use of small pulse lasers, please.

[Telmasa]

Hit registration fixes would be lovely....

And, I think any quirks that sum up to more than 25% are too much.

Combine the amazing quirks with a zombie-light that is notorious for tanking damage like it's a 75+tonner, and you have an OP mech.

Same issue as the Spider, except that trades in some quirks for having an ECM variant.


Yeah, the Firestarters should be able to use small pulse effectively - they shouldn't be all-feared monstrosities that are the king of all these close-quarters maps, either.

(double post ahead, the forums used to add my posts together if I posted consecutively...oh well)

Edited by Telmasa, 29 November 2014 - 09:00 PM.

[Telmasa]

Like, the one reason I'm not getting into a Firestarter right this second is because I know, the minute I do and get it tricked out and elited, it'll be hit with the nerfbat to be on par with all the other IS light mechs, making it another "funzies" hangar queen (when instead I could save up those c-bills and get my hands on more clan mechs...I have alot of fun with the trial Adder and Nova, for instance - and yes, I'm a masochist sometimes).

[Y E O N N E]

Telmasa, on 29 November 2014 - 08:56 PM, said:

Hit registration fixes would be lovely....

And, I think any quirks that sum up to more than 25% are too much.

Combine the amazing quirks with a zombie-light that is notorious for tanking damage like it's a 75+tonner, and you have an OP mech.

Same issue as the Spider, except that trades in some quirks for having an ECM variant.


Yeah, the Firestarters should be able to use small pulse effectively - they shouldn't be all-feared monstrosities that are the king of all these close-quarters maps, either.

(double post ahead, the forums used to add my posts together if I posted consecutively...oh well)

The FS9-A is actually hindered greatly by cramped quarters. It needs a lot of room to run around and get a good angle. It also needs that room to give you distance to get convergence working properly if you've got arm-lock off.

I've utterly destroyed many 8x SPL-equipped FS9-As in my 5x SPL-equipped LCT-3M or 2x SRM2 + 2x ML - equipped LCT-1M. And it's not necessarily because the FS9-As were shoddy pilots, it's because I know how that 'Mech works and where it falls short and I know how to exploit it.

Even if it gets hit with the nerf-bat to make it run a little hotter...it will still be a terror to those who don't know how to defend against it. It's like the LCT-3M with 5x SPL: if you think the quirks are what's making it so dangerous, then you've got some other issues to consider.

[The Boz]

Cramped quarters are good for a fast light, movement is less predictible, and the terrain offers fewer opportunities to intercept.
Playing 150kph lights with arm-lock off is doing it wrong.

[NextGame]

Crunk Prime, on 14 November 2014 - 02:04 AM, said:

-150kph
-JJ's
-8 small pulse lasers/8 small lasers
-32 damage alpha strike for pulse/24 damage for regular
-can fire about every 2 seconds with cooldown modules and pilot tree skills
-very little heat generated

Its a little too good.

Or you are a little too bad.

[xXBagheeraXx]

Crunk Prime, on 14 November 2014 - 02:04 AM, said:

-150kph
-JJ's
-8 small pulse lasers/8 small lasers
-32 damage alpha strike for pulse/24 damage for regular
-can fire about every 2 seconds with cooldown modules and pilot tree skills
-very little heat generated

Its a little too good.

If a small pulse laser build gets close to me in an assault or a ranged heavy I just get ready to go back to hanger. They are a definitively too good. They should probably remove the heat generation buffs to them.

Who actually complained about firestarters not being good? IS lights in general are far superior to clan lights. Ill take a firestarter with 4 mediums and 4 machine guns and a pilot that knows what hes doing over a Fenris or a Puma for a wingman any day. The only clan mech that remotely has an advantage over a firestarter is the Kitfox, and only because of ECM. Pumas can...lrm..or SRM boat...bout it...

[Satan n stuff]

Yeonne Greene, on 29 November 2014 - 09:17 PM, said:

The FS9-A is actually hindered greatly by cramped quarters. It needs a lot of room to run around and get a good angle. It also needs that room to give you distance to get convergence working properly if you've got arm-lock off.

I've utterly destroyed many 8x SPL-equipped FS9-As in my 5x SPL-equipped LCT-3M or 2x SRM2 + 2x ML - equipped LCT-1M. And it's not necessarily because the FS9-As were shoddy pilots, it's because I know how that 'Mech works and where it falls short and I know how to exploit it.

Even if it gets hit with the nerf-bat to make it run a little hotter...it will still be a terror to those who don't know how to defend against it. It's like the LCT-3M with 5x SPL: if you think the quirks are what's making it so dangerous, then you've got some other issues to consider.

I can beat them in close quarters with my SRM Oxide quite easily. Line up the SRMs just right and any missiles that miss one leg will hit the other.

[xXBagheeraXx]

TheGallows, on 28 November 2014 - 11:35 AM, said:

There are 4 reasons you got killed by a firestarter.

1) You got swarmed by multiple mechs, which is either your fault for being out of position or your teams fault for dying.
2) You got shot in the rear, which is your fault for not backing up against solid cover.
3) You get straight up dpsed from the front, which is your fault for being unable to hit a mech at 138meters.
4) You are driving a <35 ton light, which is PGIS fault for not buffing underperforming mechs.

Lights make up <10% of the queue, making any claim they are overpowered ridiculous. If you can't handle a light, the only problem is you.

Kay. If i see you in a pug came and a small laser firestarter is sneaking up behind you and ct coring you before you even notice I can sum that up to your being bad right? Or ill just let you solo it. Cause U that guud.

[Sarlic]

I can't wait to see this chassis gets nerfed into oblivion.

You should see the amount of players running the SMPL build. It's insane nowdays. Too many copies.

Oh, and their ego's.... big ego's...

Edited by Sarlic, 02 December 2014 - 02:20 AM.

[Ascaloth]

Sarlic, on 02 December 2014 - 02:12 AM, said:

I can't wait to see this chassis gets nerfed into oblivion. You should see the amount of players running the SMPL build. It's insane nowdays. Too many copies. Oh, and their ego's.... big ego's...

Quirks leaves little room to escape "copies".
You can run 8 ML on FS9-A, sure, but you will overheat on every single alpha and the damage increase is too little to make it worthy. Range increase? Well... when you run faster than your enemy, it's you who dictate range, so no real gain. Less then 8 ML? Go play a Jenner, it has quirks for that
You can run a LL and 2 SPL. Whoa! So horrible.
4 MPL? Nope.
8 SL? Nope,
See? You can't escape the 8 SPL build. The customization goes to motor size x JJ's x Heatsinks. I run mine this way:
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...76f9d79977cdd9c

Fast. Hot. Deadly.

[MeiSooHaityu]

The 8 SPLaser Firestarter will probably be getting "adjusted" in an upcoming patch with the Thunderbolt 5SS.

I know people are trying to make a case for why it is fine as is, but it is a we bit too strong.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 02 December 2014 - 03:52 AM.

[Macster16]

I don't get all the fuss over the A and K variants when it's the H one that is actually the best.

Being primarily an FS9-H pilot though, I'll just keep my mouth shut as this will mean the H is less likely to get nerfed since it's causing less QQ.

Seriously though, I don't know why so many people are having so many issues with sl/spl FS9s. The number of As and Ks I've legged and blasted away because they thought they were king **** in their cheesy FS9 is too many to count. It just takes a bit of awareness. Only time I get cored out by these builds is when I get surrounded and distracted by the other team which means I'm gonna die anyway, with or without the FS9 wubbing me in the back. I fear an H with a pilot who knows what they're doing way more than any A or K.