20517 replies to this topic

[RebJohhny]

Karmen Baric, on 11 May 2016 - 12:30 AM, said:

That version looks really good, especially as the head gear part doesnt stick out too much like in the original TRO design. With the new generic quirks being added to mechs recently giving it an interesting targetting or tracking bonus would be a way to make it stand out and a reason to have that head gear predominant.

[Seal Farmer]

Odanan, on 10 May 2016 - 08:10 AM, said:

There are still some "essential" IS mechs of the 3025 era:

• Wasp
  
• Stinger
  
• Javelin
  
• Assassin
  
• Vulcan
  
• Ostroc
  
• Crusader
  
• Charger
  
• Longbow

And there are many Clan mechs that could be added in between:

• Fire Moth
  
• Fire Falcon
  
• Pouncer
  
• Mongrel
  
• Huntsman
  
• Black Lanner
  
• Linebacker
  
• Kingfisher
  
• Turkina

The former omnis have plenty of variants, leaving the following battlemechs for after the time jump:

• Piranha
  
• Incubus
  
• Conjurer/Hellhound
  
• Vapor Eagle
  
• Grizzly
  
• Black Python
  
• Bane
  
• Stone Rhino

And the IIC:

• Locust IIC
  
• Commando IIC
  
• UrbanMech IIC
  
• Shadow Hawk IIC
  
• Griffin IIC
  
• Rifleman IIC
  
• Warhammer IIC
  
• Phoenix Hawk IIC
  
• Marauder IIC

And the newer omnimechs:

• Hellion
  
• Cougar
  
• Nova Cat
  
• Blood Asp

And of course the Mad Cat MK II...

If those are all essential mechs it will be years (real life time) before we see any mechs designed post 3055.
And i disagree with a number of these being essential.

[Odanan]

Seal Farmer, on 11 May 2016 - 12:48 AM, said:

If those are all essential mechs it will be years (real life time) before we see any mechs designed post 3055.
And i disagree with a number of these being essential.

There are 18 mechs in the list pre-jump, 9 IS, 9 Clan (agreed, some Clan omnimechs there are NOT essential). That would be 18 months...

Before introducing new tech (the right way to do the time jump), we know PGI has some plans, like Solaris and PVE.

Considering we have mech releases up to September, would it be almost 2 years too much time for we to wait for the time jump?

Before answering that, have in mind MWO might keep active development for the next 5 (or more) years.

[Strum Wealh]

Bishop Steiner, on 10 May 2016 - 08:56 PM, said:

Battletech Engineer is a canon source?

Itself, no.
Nether were/are Solaris7, Sarna, MegaMek, and others where one could find reproductions of canonical information originally presented in other sources.

My computer shows the Butterbee's record sheet on the 255th page of the 500-page PDF of RS 3039 Unabridged, and it matches the version displayed on BTE.
The information is the same, and it's a lot easier to link the BTE page than to screenshot, upload, and link an image of the page from RS 3039.

[MeiSooHaityu]

I'm not a fan of the Butter Bee really. It is a Catapult C1 with 4 missile slots in the arm instead of 2. It just seems to step on the toes of the C1 and C4 and one-ups them.

If there was going to be a Butter Bee, I'd be more inclined to have them move the launchers from the arms to the side torsos and have it use K2/Jester arms. Them mech is an SRM platform, so missiles more central and closer to the POV would make a bit more sense to me. Besides, it makes it more unique compared to the existing variants.

I'd go 1 energy in each arm, 2 SRM launchers in each side torso, and 2 energy in the CT.

It still doesn't quite address hardpoint inflation vs the other chassis variants, but placing 2 energy in the CT does restrict that hard point a bit.

Another possibility could be 2 missile in the CT, 1 missile and 1 energy each side torso, and 1 energy arm, but I think I like the previous better.

Lastly, they could make the CT have 1 energy and 1 missile hard point. Do you run SRM4 + Art and lose the Energy hard point, or run a LLaser and lose the missile hard point? You could run both energy and missile in the CT, but you limit the missile to an SRM4 (no Artemis) and the energy to a MPLaser. So basically 1 energy in each arm, 1 missile in each side torso, and 1 energy and 1 missile in the CT.

Options...options.

In any case, I like the idea of moving missiles into the torso for the sake of uniqueness vs other variants (plus again I feel it is a better position for SRMs).

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 11 May 2016 - 04:29 AM.

[Seal Farmer]

Odanan, on 11 May 2016 - 02:51 AM, said:

There are 18 mechs in the list pre-jump, 9 IS, 9 Clan (agreed, some Clan omnimechs there are NOT essential). That would be 18 months...

Before introducing new tech (the right way to do the time jump), we know PGI has some plans, like Solaris and PVE.

Considering we have mech releases up to September, would it be almost 2 years too much time for we to wait for the time jump?

Before answering that, have in mind MWO might keep active development for the next 5 (or more) years.

2 years is a long time, who knows what happens with regards to MWO in that time, but if it does go for that long youre right PGI have to think what mechs can they offer for the whole time, but there are still many more mechs in future timeline they can add and can still add old mechs later if they need to.

As for the IS mechs you mention, my thoughts.

Wasp & Stinger are essentially the same mech with different wepon points. Dont mind if their is another 20 ton mech and a humanoid one is at least different to the Locust.

Javelin is another mech i actualy like, a 30 ton srm or laser boat. Not a must have but cool none the less

Assassin looks different but runs like a poorer cicada & would need hardpoint inflation to be decent.

Vulcan looks different again but runs cicada esque builds with JJ, nothing much to add to the game imo

Ostroc play much like a Quickdraw and the mech silhouette wouldnt be that much different either, so dont see its value apart from nostalgia.

Crusader is an elongated Catapult for the msot part, another mech i see no real reason to introduce.

Charger looks a lot like a Banshee to me. Not really iconic and see no reason to be included.

Longbow is a larger Catapult - Awesome mix mech

As for Clan mechs, my take

Fire Moth is the Clan 20 tonner many people want but i personally dont care about.

Fire Falcon is a good light mech for Clan side. Fast good wepons load and good tonnage.

Pouncer is a slightly larger Adder, not much to see heere.

Mongrel is very much liek a Shadow Cat i think.

Huntsman now this is one decently powerfull medium mech, probably good mech for the Clans to have.

Black Lanner looks to be very popular for some reason so likely coming

Linebacker also looks to be very popular and so likely coming as well

Kingfishers standard engine looks to hamper its firepower somewhat but its also what makes it unique and it has decent speed and decent fireppower using lazors.

Turkina is a strong Assualt from what i can see if slow.

Edited by Seal Farmer, 11 May 2016 - 05:16 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

MeiSooHaityu, on 11 May 2016 - 04:25 AM, said:

I'm not a fan of the Butter Bee really. It is a Catapult C1 with 4 missile slots in the arm instead of 2. It just seems to step on the toes of the C1 and C4 and one-ups them.

If there was going to be a Butter Bee, I'd be more inclined to have them move the launchers from the arms to the side torsos and have it use K2/Jester arms. Them mech is an SRM platform, so missiles more central and closer to the POV would make a bit more sense to me. Besides, it makes it more unique compared to the existing variants.

I'd go 1 energy in each arm, 2 SRM launchers in each side torso, and 2 energy in the CT.

It still doesn't quite address hardpoint inflation vs the other chassis variants, but placing 2 energy in the CT does restrict that hard point a bit.

Another possibility could be 2 missile in the CT, 1 missile and 1 energy each side torso, and 1 energy arm, but I think I like the previous better.

Lastly, they could make the CT have 1 energy and 1 missile hard point. Do you run SRM4 + Art and lose the Energy hard point, or run a LLaser and lose the missile hard point? You could run both energy and missile in the CT, but you limit the missile to an SRM4 (no Artemis) and the energy to a MPLaser. So basically 1 energy in each arm, 1 missile in each side torso, and 1 energy and 1 missile in the CT.

Options...options.

In any case, I like the idea of moving missiles into the torso for the sake of uniqueness vs other variants (plus again I feel it is a better position for SRMs).

can't fit 2 SRM6 in the CT, thus the stock butterbee load-out would not be doable.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Can't forget the Champion!

Well, I guess in all reality you can lol. Still, i'd like to have that mech in this game. It just needs the Alex treatment.

[Bishop Steiner]

Seal Farmer, on 11 May 2016 - 05:00 AM, said:

Assassin looks different but runs like a poorer cicada & would need hardpoint inflation to be decent.

virtually all Battlemechs get hardpoint inflation.

As for the Charger, good hitbox potential, a lot faster than the banshee, and the variants are interesting.

One could make an argument that there is nothing new to add at all. Wont get your time jump any sooner because Russ has already outlined the foreseeable agenda, with Cryengine Upgrade, Solaris 7 and PvE all being on the docket, and new tech not. Accomplishing those 3 things is going to take a considerable amount of time, and then whenever (if ever) PGI does jump timeline, it will take 3-6 months to plan, build, test and execute, just liek the Clan Invasion.

So people can continue to frustrate themselves, and all forced to hear about it constantly, about something that ISN'T GOING TO HAPPEN ANYTIME SOON, no matter how much people QQ, or they can deal with it. But since it's going to be a minimum of 2017, and quite likely 2018 before it happens, and PGI does need to keep the lights on thru then, there will be more current tech mechs whether you like them, or feel we need them or not.

[Bishop Steiner]

MeiSooHaityu, on 11 May 2016 - 05:02 AM, said:

Can't forget the Champion!

Well, I guess in all reality you can lol. Still, i'd like to have that mech in this game. It just needs the Alex treatment.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Bishop Steiner, on 11 May 2016 - 05:00 AM, said:

can't fit 2 SRM6 in the CT, thus the stock butterbee load-out would not be doable.

I thought it was quad 4s and not 6s. My bad.

Honestly though, once you move missiles into the torso, it really isn't a Butter Bee in anything but name anyway.

I honestly don't mind any of my listed configs (even 2 missile per side torso which would allow for quad SRM6s).

I just can't see keeping SRMs in a Catapult's arms for short range SRM duty. Even with durability quirks, those arms would get blown off in a heartbeat. If it stands any chance of being a short range SRM machine, I think it needs better guarded missile hard points and possibly a nice Jester like engine cap.

The Catapult's arms just aren't cut out for MWO style play. It can get away with big box arms when LRMs are being fired at standoff ranges, but closing in on an opponent within 300m, and those arms are gone...fast.

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 11 May 2016 - 05:13 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

MeiSooHaityu, on 11 May 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

I thought it was quad 4s and not 6s. My bad.

Honestly though, once you move missiles into the torso, it really isn't a Butter Bee in anything but name anyway.

I honestly don't mind any of my listed configs (even 2 missile per side torso which would allow for quad SRM6s).

I just can't see keeping SRMs in a Catapult's arms for short range SRM duty. Even with durability quirks, those arms would get blown off in a heartbeat. If it stands any chance of being a short range SRM machine, I think it needs better guarded missile hard points and possibly a nice Jester like engine cap.

The Catapult's arms just aren't cut out for MWO style play. It can get away with big box arms when LRMs are being fired at standoff ranges, but closing in on an opponent within 300m, and those arms are gone...fast.

hence why I wont buy it.

[Juodas Varnas]

MeiSooHaityu, on 11 May 2016 - 05:12 AM, said:

I thought it was quad 4s and not 6s. My bad.

Honestly though, once you move missiles into the torso, it really isn't a Butter Bee in anything but name anyway.

I honestly don't mind any of my listed configs (even 2 missile per side torso which would allow for quad SRM6s).

I just can't see keeping SRMs in a Catapult's arms for short range SRM duty. Even with durability quirks, those arms would get blown off in a heartbeat. If it stands any chance of being a short range SRM machine, I think it needs better guarded missile hard points and possibly a nice Jester like engine cap.

The Catapult's arms just aren't cut out for MWO style play. It can get away with big box arms when LRMs are being fired at standoff ranges, but closing in on an opponent within 300m, and those arms are gone...fast.

Maybe the missile boxes will be smaller if you're running SRMs?

I mean, if PGI didn't take the lazy way out re-doing the dynamic geo on the CAT, hopefully it'll be that way

[MeiSooHaityu]

Bishop Steiner, on 11 May 2016 - 05:11 AM, said:

I like it!

Reverse knee joint legs, shield arms, and it still looks like a Champion. Overall very nice!

I like this rendition too...


The torso and legs are good, but I feel the arms are a miss. I like how you kept the spirit of the arms intact.

There might even be a way to make a forward knee joint leg look good too, but I can't imagine it. Maybe something in between like the Crab's legs, but much slimmer.

In any case, I like your Champion, Bishop.

Bishop Steiner, on 11 May 2016 - 05:13 AM, said:

hence why I wont buy it.

If SRMs are in the arms, I wouldn't buy it either.

[Bishop Steiner]

dervishx5, on 06 May 2016 - 02:21 PM, said:

When we reach page 666 the first person to post a picture of the Dervish along with a short paragraph of why it should be in the game gets a free $40 mechpack of their choice.

Why the dervish?
Potential for a cool looking design is always crucial, since when playing stompy robots, "rule of cool" beats all. But it also has a good hardpoint spread allowing for potentially good KTO style multi-LRM5 or SRM builds. But unlike the KTO you are also going to see Griffin like JJ capability. Some may call it redundant compared with the GRF and SHD in game already, and there is some truth to that, but the devil is always in the details, and really it depends on quirks, hardpoint inflation and such which we really can't predict. At the end of the day it really boils down to whether it will be fun to play, and I think it indeed can deliver on that promise.

And really, this game, like any, needs more options, not less.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 11 May 2016 - 06:09 AM.

[Seal Farmer]

Bishop Steiner, on 11 May 2016 - 05:11 AM, said:

Not sure anyone can make the Champion mech look good.

[Karmen Baric]

Reasons for the Dervish to be in this game. An original Star League era design of iconic nature which was among the first mass-produced battlemechs of the Great Houses. Its a 55 ton LRM/SRM, jump capable mech that can position itself high and rain down LRM pain in support of its frontline comrades or jump around cover with brutal SRM pepper shots.

Edited by Karmen Baric, 11 May 2016 - 05:22 AM.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Juodas Varnas, on 11 May 2016 - 05:17 AM, said:

Maybe the missile boxes will be smaller if you're running SRMs?

I mean, if PGI didn't take the lazy way out re-doing the dynamic geo on the CAT, hopefully it'll be that way

Maybe, but I still think the arms would be stripped too fast. Even smaller arms up close look bigger and therefore easy to target .

[Bishop Steiner]

MeiSooHaityu, on 11 May 2016 - 05:20 AM, said:

I like it!

Reverse knee joint legs, shield arms, and it still looks like a Champion. Overall very nice!

I like this rendition too...


The torso and legs are good, but I feel the arms are a miss. I like how you kept the spirit of the arms intact.

There might even be a way to make a forward knee joint leg look good too, but I can't imagine it. Maybe something in between like the Crab's legs, but much slimmer.

In any case, I like your Champion, Bishop.




If SRMs are in the arms, I wouldn't buy it either.

thx!

the other take is interesting, but really not a champion, IMO. The arms kill it. But also the legs, while well done, appear massive compared to the torso, which really throws the feel off for me.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Seal Farmer, on 11 May 2016 - 05:21 AM, said:

Not sure anyone can make the Champion mech look good.

I thought that about the Black Knight. Alex can work wonders .

There is lot of mechs he had made cool for MWO.

Bishop Steiner, on 11 May 2016 - 05:25 AM, said:

thx!

the other take is interesting, but really not a champion, IMO. The arms kill it. But also the legs, while well done, appear massive compared to the torso, which really throws the feel off for me.

I agree about the legs, but they didn't bother me much.

Yeah, the arms are WAY off though. It does need arms closer in idea to the original (basically something similar if not identical to what you did).

Edited by MeiSooHaityu, 11 May 2016 - 05:28 AM.