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Ultimate Mech Discussion Thread

BattleMech Balance

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#13681 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 01:03 PM

View Postwanderer, on 19 June 2016 - 10:07 AM, said:

Which was the whole idea- they couldn't build new Thugs, but as a knockoff version, they had Charger chassis to work with instead, taking one of the worst assaults in 3025-era production and remaking it into a decent one.

Which makes sense for lore reasons, but I'm gonna be the unpopular one and say I hate it because of the stupid 90s anime craze lets make a Getter Robo/Power Ranger Samurai bot......

Same reason, I have "Totem Mechs" overall, etc......

they are just abjectly silly. (And the reason my KDKs are pink)

#13682 Strum Wealh

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 01:34 PM

View PostArchangel.84, on 19 June 2016 - 09:30 AM, said:

My problem with the Hatamoto - and I know it's a minor one, but still - is that the classic one's loadout is exactly the same as the Thug, and i like the Thug better.


There's nothing that says we can't ultimately have both. Posted Image

That being said, the Thug would need more help to make it a viable option compared to the Hatamoto.

The Thug is rather variant deficient as of 3053-ish, offering only the THG-11E and THG-10E until the 3067 introduction of the THG-12E.
On top of that, the 11E & 10E are largely identical to each other - the latter is the LosTech-deficient version of the former, losing its CASE and swapping out the DHS & Endo-Steel components for SHS & standard structure.
Both also have the same minimum hardpoints: an energy weapon in each arm and a missile launcher in each side-torso.
Even adding the SLDF Royals variant, the THG-11Eb, doesn't help with the homogeneity issue; the 11Eb merely replaces the 11E's standard PPCs with ER-PPCs.

IMO, the Thug could be made more workable with focused hardpoint inflation.
As most of the other IS 80-tonners in game thus far have 7-9 hardpoints, the Thug could be reasonably endowed with 7-8 hardpoints per variant.
Then, the 10E and 11E could be focused on different weapon types. For example, the 10E could have a 6E/2M setup (three energy hardpoints in each arm, one missile hardpoint in each side-torso) and the 11E could have a 2E/6M setup (one energy hardpoint in each arm, three missile hardpoints in each side-torso).
PGI could then make up a third variant and a Hero 'Mech (either or both of which, for diversity's sake, could be any of: all-energy, energy/ballistic, ballistic/missile, or three-weapon-type loadouts).

Thoughts?

#13683 FLG 01

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 01:45 PM

View PostStrum Wealh, on 19 June 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

Thoughts?


I agree that the Thug definitely is a one trick pony and lacks variety. But then, some Mechs are just like that. And I can very well imagine that a combination of 2xERPPC and 2xSRM6 works really well in game. In fact I had hope that the MAD-5D could do this, but in the absence of PPC quirks it can't.

Anyway, I am not a Kurita fan, but I can totally see the validity of your argument. Scrolling through the HTM-variants there are surely some beauties...


View PostBishop Steiner, on 19 June 2016 - 01:03 PM, said:

Which makes sense for lore reasons, but I'm gonna be the unpopular one and say I hate it because of the stupid 90s anime craze lets make a Getter Robo/Power Ranger Samurai bot......

Same reason, I have "Totem Mechs" overall, etc......

they are just abjectly silly. (And the reason my KDKs are pink)


What's wrong with Totem Mechs? I mean I can see what you mean about the Samurai-bot craze, and some DCMS designs clearly fill that bill, just like many of the Xin Sheng designs scream "China-in-Space!!!".

However it is not unreasonable that some Mechs gain popularity in certain factions, and that some Mechs are meant to gain popularity and instill patriotism. The Defiance was a failed attempt at that; the Fafnir one that worked. This kind of signature Mech makes sense. And sometimes you just expect designs to serve that purpurse even if in name only.
In the real world, KMW named its tank Leopard simply because German tanks were known for their Big Cat names from WWII; I can assure you the German army had zero intrest in naming tanks after the Big Cats (Tiger, Panter, etc.), but KMW needed to sell their tanks and the Big Cat name had a good reputation.

#13684 Imperius

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 01:52 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 19 June 2016 - 01:03 PM, said:

Which makes sense for lore reasons, but I'm gonna be the unpopular one and say I hate it because of the stupid 90s anime craze lets make a Getter Robo/Power Ranger Samurai bot......

Same reason, I have "Totem Mechs" overall, etc......

they are just abjectly silly. (And the reason my KDKs are pink)


This coming from someone who pushed for the Urbie... Yeah ok

#13685 Bishop Steiner

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 01:55 PM

View PostFLG 01, on 19 June 2016 - 01:45 PM, said:


I agree that the Thug definitely is a one trick pony and lacks variety. But then, some Mechs are just like that. And I can very well imagine that a combination of 2xERPPC and 2xSRM6 works really well in game. In fact I had hope that the MAD-5D could do this, but in the absence of PPC quirks it can't.

Anyway, I am not a Kurita fan, but I can totally see the validity of your argument. Scrolling through the HTM-variants there are surely some beauties...




What's wrong with Totem Mechs? I mean I can see what you mean about the Samurai-bot craze, and some DCMS designs clearly fill that bill, just like many of the Xin Sheng designs scream "China-in-Space!!!".

However it is not unreasonable that some Mechs gain popularity in certain factions, and that some Mechs are meant to gain popularity and instill patriotism. The Defiance was a failed attempt at that; the Fafnir one that worked. This kind of signature Mech makes sense. And sometimes you just expect designs to serve that purpurse even if in name only.
In the real world, KMW named its tank Leopard simply because German tanks were known for their Big Cat names from WWII; I can assure you the German army had zero intrest in naming tanks after the Big Cats (Tiger, Panter, etc.), but KMW needed to sell their tanks and the Big Cat name had a good reputation.

Sure big cat names.

Now imagine can you imagine them crafting a tank that looks liek a Cat's head?

Highly stylized armor becomes shell catchers, and not only enhances damage to the target, but is a lot more work to repair in the field. Especially with the Clans being all about no waste, having Wolf and Coyote and CareBear shaped mechs, and little jade Pigeons and Robo Scorpions and Spiders, literally makes ZERO sense, even above the usual "giant robots make no sense".
Posted Image
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Posted Image
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all just...stupid. Capellans also have quite a few (Tsi Tsong or whatever it's called)

Totem Mech that works and makes sense?
Posted Image

View PostImperius, on 19 June 2016 - 01:52 PM, said:

This coming from someone who pushed for the Urbie... Yeah ok

Oh look who came back from exile.

And still has nothing useful to say, or the ability to make a meaningful point.

#13686 Imperius

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 02:03 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 19 June 2016 - 01:55 PM, said:

Sure big cat names.

Now imagine can you imagine them crafting a tank that looks liek a Cat's head?

Highly stylized armor becomes shell catchers, and not only enhances damage to the target, but is a lot more work to repair in the field. Especially with the Clans being all about no waste, having Wolf and Coyote and CareBear shaped mechs, and little jade Pigeons and Robo Scorpions and Spiders, literally makes ZERO sense, even above the usual "giant robots make no sense".
Posted Image
Posted Image

Posted Image
Posted Image

all just...stupid. Capellans also have quite a few (Tsi Tsong or whatever it's called)

Totem Mech that works and makes sense?
Posted Image


Oh look who came back from exile.

And still has nothing useful to say, or the ability to make a meaningful point.


It's ok I see you still couldn't get my name out your mouth sorry for pointing out that the urbie is just as worthless as those other mechs you don't like. Just making sure people are aware of your agenda have a great day!

Edited by Imperius, 19 June 2016 - 02:11 PM.


#13687 CK16

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 02:10 PM

So I was wondering, this rescaleing how does it compare to the older Mechwarrior games...

This is some of mechs currently in game (and a few not but close to in game ones)

Here are some of the MW4 ones, some are Mektek however the scale does seem.....somewhat decent....

Spoiler


Thoughts?

#13688 Metus regem

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 02:26 PM

View PostCK16, on 19 June 2016 - 02:10 PM, said:

So I was wondering, this rescaleing how does it compare to the older Mechwarrior games...

This is some of mechs currently in game (and a few not but close to in game ones)

Here are some of the MW4 ones, some are Mektek however the scale does seem.....somewhat decent....

Spoiler


Thoughts?


MW4 hurts my eyes.....

Most importantly, what the hell did they do to the Riflemen??!? It looks like they put missile launchers on the radar array.....

#13689 Odanan

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 04:04 PM

View PostMetus regem, on 19 June 2016 - 02:26 PM, said:

MW4 hurts my eyes.....

Most importantly, what the hell did they do to the Riflemen??!? It looks like they put missile launchers on the radar array.....

I'm sure they did... :/

#13690 Metus regem

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 04:30 PM

View PostOdanan, on 19 June 2016 - 04:04 PM, said:

I'm sure they did... :/


******* MekTek.....

They ruined MechWarrior for an entire generation of players....

#13691 CK16

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 08:25 PM

View PostMetus regem, on 19 June 2016 - 04:30 PM, said:

******* MekTek.....

They ruined MechWarrior for an entire generation of players....


Well....They did not make it missiles at least!
Posted Image
Posted Image

The others do not look to bad IMO well they are close at least xD

Posted Image
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BTW pretty sure all these do end up available in the campaign to buy if you have mektek addons at least....I know I know but still, if you wanted to run Alpha Lance on there you could!

Edited by CK16, 19 June 2016 - 08:26 PM.


#13692 Nightshade24

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Posted 19 June 2016 - 10:07 PM

View PostBishop Steiner, on 19 June 2016 - 01:55 PM, said:

Sure big cat names.

Now imagine can you imagine them crafting a tank that looks liek a Cat's head?

Highly stylized armor becomes shell catchers, and not only enhances damage to the target, but is a lot more work to repair in the field. Especially with the Clans being all about no waste, having Wolf and Coyote and CareBear shaped mechs, and little jade Pigeons and Robo Scorpions and Spiders, literally makes ZERO sense, even above the usual "giant robots make no sense".






all just...stupid. Capellans also have quite a few (Tsi Tsong or whatever it's called)

Totem Mech that works and makes sense?



Oh look who came back from exile.

And still has nothing useful to say, or the ability to make a meaningful point.


Wrote a huge wall of text but decided it isn't necessary.

The only thing I have to say is that the only totem mech that does not make sense to me is the Jade falcon one you showed. Partly because I never read into it and thus do not understand anything, for all I know those wings act as an easy way to transfer heat away from the heatsinks. Maybe it's 100% cosmetic.... either way.
(also the Nova Cat has nothing over the other mechs. if you want to talk about waste of effeciency then just look at those legs and those shoulders. hatamoto chi has everything better over it in all but being the head having a helm like appearance.

#13693 CK16

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 11:22 AM

How is this not pinned yet? Just wondering.

#13694 Metus regem

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 11:39 AM

View PostCK16, on 20 June 2016 - 11:22 AM, said:

How is this not pinned yet? Just wondering.



No idea, but I've been wondering that for years now....

#13695 CK16

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 12:20 PM

ODANAN! Please :)

Also, so assuming after the next Clan Omni we get an Innersphere mech, you Spheroid's, what is most needed ( not demanded) mech type you guys need?

Edited by CK16, 20 June 2016 - 12:20 PM.


#13696 Metus regem

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 12:48 PM

View PostCK16, on 20 June 2016 - 12:20 PM, said:

ODANAN! Please Posted Image

Also, so assuming after the next Clan Omni we get an Innersphere mech, you Spheroid's, what is most needed ( not demanded) mech type you guys need?



That's the trick isn't it? We are a little thing on light mechs right now, so I'm all for the Wasp and Stinger for new lights... those things will be tiny at 20t each...

But really we have a decent showing in all weight classes at the moment as far as IS mechs go.

#13697 CK16

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 12:50 PM

Ok, what flavor chassis are not filled? Or faction specific? 4 unique mechs next for 4 of the faction's? *shrug *

#13698 Metus regem

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 01:02 PM

View PostCK16, on 20 June 2016 - 12:50 PM, said:

Ok, what flavor chassis are not filled? Or faction specific? 4 unique mechs next for 4 of the faction's? *shrug *



L.A.M.'s and Qauds have no showing right now, but Russ is against doing them, either he hates them or is afraid of them for some reason or another...

Scout units in MWO right now are pointless as the maps are too small, and everyone has the same sensor range.

As far as MM goes, it doesn't see any difference between a 100t Kodiak and a 80t Victor, so as much as I would like verity, most mechs under the upper weight bracket for their weight class are getting the short end of the stick...

But if I wanted to do mechs for factions:


Kurita (DCMS):

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Hatamoto-Chi


FedCom (Stenier/Davion):

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Bushwacker

Rasalhague:

http://www.sarna.net/wiki/Dragon_Fire

Marik:

http://www.sarna.net...er_(BattleMech)

#13699 Tordin

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 01:15 PM

Im all for something unique for FRR. So Dragon Fire, Thug, Valkyrie? Berserker etc I would buy.

#13700 Odanan

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Posted 20 June 2016 - 01:40 PM

View PostCK16, on 20 June 2016 - 11:22 AM, said:

How is this not pinned yet? Just wondering.

WE ARE THE PIN!

(now in t-shirts)

View PostCK16, on 20 June 2016 - 12:20 PM, said:

ODANAN! Please Posted Image

Also, so assuming after the next Clan Omni we get an Innersphere mech, you Spheroid's, what is most needed ( not demanded) mech type you guys need?

Assassin.
40 tons fast medium mech with jump jets focused on missiles.





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