717 replies to this topic

[Baelfire]

Icebergdx, on 18 February 2015 - 09:16 PM, said:

This was a quote from Page 2 of this thread, and yet there are idiots on here that are still arguing that people who run off, hide, shut down and waste people's time are not violating the rules. This was a definition that came out from PGI people.

I yet have to see a part of the CoC that makes "wasting time" a reportable offense. I'm actually pretty sure that someting like this does not exist and that is the reason why you guys try to turn the rule for non-particpation into a "the last man has to die"-rule.

If someone runs in a corner and shuts his mech down at the very start of the match than he is guilty of "non-paricipation" and should be reported to the support. I don't think anyone here will claim something else. Because he is hurting his own team with his actions and creates an advantage for the enemy team. That is what the CoC is about. But the same part of the CoC declares suiciding and running out of bounds as reportable offense as well, for the very same reason. But if your team is dead none of those rules apply, because your team has already lost the fight.

All you have to do when you enter a game is to fight for your team as good as you can. If your team still lose the fight, than you can do whatever you want, even suiciding or running out of bounds. But if you chose to survive it is not against the rule, because you have already played the core mechanic of the game mode until it didn't make sense anymore. After all the core mechanic is to defeat the opponents and to destroy their mechs, not to "fight to the death".

Btw, calling people "idiots" is against the CoC as well. Before you lecture other people about the CoC you should probably learn to stick to the rules yourself.

Edited by Baelfire, 19 February 2015 - 07:16 AM.

[Kjudoon]

Spawnsalot, on 19 February 2015 - 03:53 AM, said:

Eugh is this thread *still* going on?

Yep. People still won't get the point and repsect the right of others to play the way they want when they can leave at any time.

Edited by Kjudoon, 19 February 2015 - 07:07 AM.

[Necromantion]

.

Edited by Necromantion, 19 February 2015 - 09:39 AM.

[MechWarrior3671771]

"there are idiots on here that are still arguing that people who run off, hide, shut down and waste people's time are not violating the rules"

Nope. Everyone agrees that running off to shutdown and hide till the timer runs out is griefing and not cool.

What's actually being argued is that, as long as the last man standing is NOT doing that, its uncool to report him or call his position out to the other team.

The "hiding shutdown" argument is a strawman pushed by people who are too selfish and lazy to let the last man standing finish playing out the match. I've been here 6 weeks and have never seen it happen. I think its myth What I HAVE seen is about 12 instances of some poor guy trying to get a kill in even though his team cant win, and some selfish jackwagon decides his precious time is more important so he tells the enemy in chat where the last pilot is.

[Joseph Mallan]

Bloodweaver, on 19 February 2015 - 06:31 AM, said:

Uh, no. So long as they have a ping, then as far as you know, they are NOT a DC. Zero ping is disconnected, any ping above that is still connected. Whether actively disguising themselves from enemy patrols, opening the door to let their dog out, or just throwing the game to preserve KDR (an act for which, again, there is almost no evidence) they are still connected and it is still against ToS to divulge their position.

Your assumptions are not something other players need to prove themselves against, because you are just another player. Not a gamemaster, not a developer, not a moderator - other players do not need to explain themselves to you, because you are not above them, and have no power over what they do for their allotted fifteen minutes. You only control what you do, and the fact of the matter is that you made an agreement to abide by certain rules when you downloaded and installed the game. One of those rules is to not give out a connected teammate's position to the enemy team. What you are trying to justify now is, in short, "I don't care what I signed, I'm going to do what I want even if it ruins other people's game, and the only way I won't is if they prove themselves worthy to me." Well, pardon my French, but **** that.

When you click the button that says "Play," you should have every expectation of your 'mech being kept for fifteen minutes, because that's how the gamemodes work. A match ending before that, is a BONUS, it is not a RIGHT to which you are entitled. If you died before that fifteen minutes, and other people are still alive, they are still playing, and get to do so how they want, up to and including hiding, since that is part of the game mechanics, put into the game intentionally. You, on the other hand - your game is OVER.

You are right they don't. But I do let them know if I don't get a response I will assume they are DC and will announce their location. So If i in good faith ask a team mate if they are hiding and I get no reply. I will assume they are DC.

And you are right, I am only responsible for what I do. So when I give away someone's position I am accepting responsibility for my actions. If I am turned into PGI then I will defend my actions and accept whatever they think is appropriate.

As to your interpretation of my actions... You are free to think what you want to. PGI has evidence and confession of what I do in game. You wanna turn me in for it please do. I feel I'm being fair, if PGI feels otherwise, They can let me know.

[MechWarrior3671771]

"Your assumptions are not something other players need to prove themselves against, because you are just another player. Not a gamemaster, not a developer, not a moderator - other players do not need to explain themselves to you, because you are not above them, and have no power over what they do for their allotted fifteen minutes. You only control what you do, and the fact of the matter is that you made an agreement to abide by certain rules when you downloaded and installed the game. One of those rules is to not give out a connected teammate's position to the enemy team. What you are trying to justify now is, in short, "I don't care what I signed, I'm going to do what I want even if it ruins other people's game, and the only way I won't is if they prove themselves worthy to me." Well, pardon my French, but **** that."

Bumped just so I can like it again.

[Joseph Mallan]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 09:49 AM, said:

"Your assumptions are not something other players need to prove themselves against, because you are just another player. Not a gamemaster, not a developer, not a moderator - other players do not need to explain themselves to you, because you are not above them, and have no power over what they do for their allotted fifteen minutes. You only control what you do, and the fact of the matter is that you made an agreement to abide by certain rules when you downloaded and installed the game. One of those rules is to not give out a connected teammate's position to the enemy team. What you are trying to justify now is, in short, "I don't care what I signed, I'm going to do what I want even if it ruins other people's game, and the only way I won't is if they prove themselves worthy to me." Well, pardon my French, but **** that."

Bumped just so I can like it again.

And I am saying it again, If PGI feel I am in the wrong they can PM me and let me know. But until they do so, I will continue to give away a DC. So please feel free to turn me in. PGI will judge my actions.

[MechWarrior3671771]

"But I do let them know if I don't get a response I will assume they are DC and will announce their location. So If i in good faith ask a team mate if they are hiding and I get no reply. I will assume they are DC"

That's still a lot of assumptions on you part. I've had to pause and minimize the game because of malware pop-ups. I've had to do the same because my controller went on the fritz and I had to do a quick (30 sec) reinstall. So its likely I wouldn't see your chat demands.

And when I'm in a light trying to evade 6 enemy mechs while setting up an attack, I don't have a lot of time to justify to you what I am planning.

I also don't understand how you can call me out as AFK before the match has ended.


"If PGI feel I am in the wrong they can PM me and let me know"

They have already ruled that as Team Treason.

The only time I would give out the last man's position is if he is still at his spawn with full ammo no damage and not responsive to comms. Even THAT is against the rules, but I risk it as a courtesy to the other team.

Edited by Fenrisulvyn, 19 February 2015 - 09:57 AM.

[Joseph Mallan]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

"But I do let them know if I don't get a response I will assume they are DC and will announce their location. So If i in good faith ask a team mate if they are hiding and I get no reply. I will assume they are DC"
That's still a lot of assumptions on you part. I've had to pause and minimize the game because of malware pop-ups. I've had to do the same because my controller went on the fritz and I had to do a quick (30 sec) reinstall. So its likely I wouldn't see your chat demands.

And when I'm in a light trying to evade 6 enemy mechs while setting up an attack, I don't have a lot of time to justify to you what I am planning.

I also don't understand how you can call me out as AFK before the match has ended.

Then turn me in. Is there a problem with that? Cause I don't see any. Also when you are the last guy standing and standing still for several minutes You have plenty of time. In those conditions you listed, you are completely in your right to turn me in.

I'll get in trouble and the process will work as intended.

[ShadowStealer]

my personal idea on this is that a lot of people have premium time running, which cost real money, along with having limited play time etc. Maybe there should be something where the time lowers after so many of 1 team has died the time limit drops accordingly. for example 1 team has 2 remaining mechs, maybe the time limit should drop to 2 minutes remaining in match? Something along those lines may help alleviate the problem.

[Raggedyman]

ShadowStealer, on 19 February 2015 - 10:09 AM, said:

my personal idea on this is that a lot of people have premium time running, which cost real money, along with having limited play time etc. Maybe there should be something where the time lowers after so many of 1 team has died the time limit drops accordingly. for example 1 team has 2 remaining mechs, maybe the time limit should drop to 2 minutes remaining in match? Something along those lines may help alleviate the problem.

That would be my "Option 1" solution: lower the victory threshold
Please go here to support

[MechWarrior3671771]

Best solutions are:

1) Remove all-chat for dead peeps
2) unlock dead mechs so dead peeps can exit and drop again immediately

[Mystere]

ShadowStealer, on 19 February 2015 - 10:09 AM, said:

my personal idea on this is that a lot of people have premium time running, which cost real money, along with having limited play time etc. Maybe there should be something where the time lowers after so many of 1 team has died the time limit drops accordingly. for example 1 team has 2 remaining mechs, maybe the time limit should drop to 2 minutes remaining in match? Something along those lines may help alleviate the problem.

I have a very big problem with your suggestion. Short of going all Rambo and succeeding, expecting a lone survivor to win against 5+ enemies in 2 minutes is expecting to much. I'm going to give that player all the time he/she needs to get the job done.

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 10:32 AM, said:

Best solutions are:

1) Remove all-chat for dead peeps
2) unlock dead mechs so dead peeps can exit and drop again immediately

The first I can agree with, if grudgingly. The second I cannot because it's an open invitation to farmers.

[MechWarrior3671771]

Ah didn't think of farmers. Yup.

So edit to

2) please someone give them another mech so they will quit wasting time on the forums whining about how their time is being wasted

or something

Edited by Fenrisulvyn, 19 February 2015 - 11:22 AM.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Icebergdx, on 18 February 2015 - 09:16 PM, said:

This was a quote from Page 2 of this thread, and yet there are idiots on here that are still arguing that people who run off, hide, shut down and waste people's time are not violating the rules. This was a definition that came out from PGI people. GET A CLUE!!!! This post was from Feb 2, it is now Feb 18. OVER 2 WEEKS AND 31 PAGES OF PEOPLE SHOWING THEY ARE TOO DUMB TO READ AND COMPREHEND PART OF THE CONDUCT OF THE GAME. ENOUGH ALL READY!!!!!

Or the parts where I posted recieving a email back from them that said that it is just against the spirit of the game not really against the rules lol

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 10:32 AM, said:

Best solutions are:

1) Remove all-chat for dead peeps
2) unlock dead mechs so dead peeps can exit and drop again immediately

according to that email I posted that was supposed to be part of UI 2.0. They dropped it and dont seem to have looked back. Im guessing its not a priority

[Bloodweaver]

You really enjoy being wrong, don't you, Buddah? First, they didn't say "it's not really against the rules." And second, they didn't say "it was supposed to be part of UI 2.0." Get your head straight. Or learn to read. Or just stop lying. Your pick, you have three to choose from.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Bloodweaver, on 20 February 2015 - 06:19 PM, said:

You really enjoy being wrong, don't you, Buddah? First, they didn't say "it's not really against the rules." And second, they didn't say "it was supposed to be part of UI 2.0." Get your head straight. Or learn to read. Or just stop lying. Your pick, you have three to choose from.

Read it yourself, chuckles

Hard to get wrong when its right there, and whatever Egomane says doesnt much matter being that he's as much PGI as we are

And yea they did say it would be fixed after UI 2.0. Here Ill help you



Unless you have a differing idea of what "until the chat system is fixed (post UI 2.0)"

and "its against the spirit of the game. We dont worry about it unless someone becomes really obnoxious"

means

lol you tell me to read it and dont read it yourself

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 20 February 2015 - 06:30 PM.

[Bloodweaver]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 20 February 2015 - 05:32 PM, said:

according to that email I posted that was supposed to be part of UI 2.0.

Nope:

Reppu said:

...dead players can't talk with live players [once] the chat is fixed (post UI 2.0)

You are aware of what "post" means, aren't you? It means "after." As in, not a part of. Reppu never claimed that removing chat functionality for dead players was supposed to be part of UI 2.0, he said that it was something intended to be done after UI 2.0. But you go on, keep repeating something and "proving" it with an image that contradicts what you say! It's hilarious.

As for "we don't worry about it", it means just that. It doesn't mean it's not against the rules, it means that "we" (and by "we," what Reppu is really saying is "I," since it's clear he does not speak for everyone) don't necessarily punish every occurrence. It means we look at things on a case-by-case basis before making a final decision. You know, like rational, thinking human beings.

What it doesn't mean, and what Reppu never said, despite your continued claims to the contrary, is that it's not against the rules. "Against the spirit of the game" is not the same thing as "not against the rules." You do realize those are two different concepts, don't you? Letter of the law vs. intent of the law? And that they are not mutually exclusive? Making a statement about one, does not have any bearing on the other. Plus, as an additional bonus to your lack of credibility, we don't even know WHAT exactly he's saying is "against the spirit of the game" - because we've never seen the exact question you actually sent to support in the first place!

You go ahead and keep referring to your magical response that says it's not against the rules and that chat functionality was supposed to be changed when UI 2.0 was implemented. Just be aware you're not the only one with eyes, and no matter how much you WISH that Reppu had said what you want to believe he said, nobody else has to fall for the same nonsense just because you've convinced yourself of it. So long as you keep trying to tell people this happened, there will be someone else to tell those same people that you're making stuff up, and to show them how.

And, once again, a single email response from support staff really has little weight on determining what is and is not allowed. You want to know what the rules are for revealing teammate's positions? You check the ToS. You don't need to ask someone else, it's already spelled out for you. Asking a person only risks getting a response colored by that person's assumptions and opinions. You do realize several support staff and moderator responses on this matter have directly contradicted each other, don't you? Support is there to help you out with stuff that can't be figured out through other means. Not to tell you how to play, where to shoot, and what the ToS already tells you.

Joseph Mallan, on 19 February 2015 - 09:47 AM, said:

You are right they don't. But I do let them know if I don't get a response I will assume they are DC and will announce their location. So If i in good faith ask a team mate if they are hiding and I get no reply. I will assume they are DC.

You cannot "assume" they're a DC, because they STILL HAVE A PING. You don't get to make incorrect assumptions when the PROOF of them being incorrect, is right in front of you. What you are talking about is an AFK, not a DC, and you know it - just can't bring yourself to admit to ratting out AFKs, why is that? Because you know it's wrong? I doubt that it's really because you don't know the difference, but that IS the only other possibility.

Edited by Bloodweaver, 20 February 2015 - 10:13 PM.

[Stormyblade]

Fenrisulvyn, on 19 February 2015 - 09:54 AM, said:

"But I do let them know if I don't get a response I will assume they are DC and will announce their location. So If i in good faith ask a team mate if they are hiding and I get no reply. I will assume they are DC" That's still a lot of assumptions on you part. I've had to pause and minimize the game because of malware pop-ups. I've had to do the same because my controller went on the fritz and I had to do a quick (30 sec) reinstall. So its likely I wouldn't see your chat demands. And when I'm in a light trying to evade 6 enemy mechs while setting up an attack, I don't have a lot of time to justify to you what I am planning. I also don't understand how you can call me out as AFK before the match has ended. "If PGI feel I am in the wrong they can PM me and let me know" They have already ruled that as Team Treason. The only time I would give out the last man's position is if he is still at his spawn with full ammo no damage and not responsive to comms. Even THAT is against the rules, but I risk it as a courtesy to the other team.

Boy, you certainly have a book full of excuses ready for when someone might accuse you of being AFK or not playing, don't you? Just a suggestion, but maybe you could spend some time working on your computer so it's not infected with malware and update all your drivers?