140 replies to this topic

[Gas Guzzler]

As a result of a conversation on twitter I began to compare to loadouts, one is IS and one is Clan. They both consist of 6 lasers.

On one hand, we have 6 IS Large Lasers, with the following specs

54 damage
450 m Range
30 tons
1 second duration
72 Heat (42 w/o Heat Scale)

On the other hand, we have 4 cER Medium Lasers and 2 cLP Lasers

54 Damage
400m/600m range
16 tons
1.12-.15 second duration
44 Heat


What do you guys thing about this?

[Cyborne Elemental]

I think ghost heat is a bunch of BS at this point..

[norus]

IS LL's take an obscene amount of quirks to get to a competitive level. But at least we can fire 3 at a time without ghost heat now!

[kapusta11]

Everything you need to know about laser vomit:

[Gas Guzzler]

Mister D, on 14 February 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

I think ghost heat is a bunch of BS at this point..

For lasers at least, yeah I don't see the point.

I wonder how the community would react to removing it on PPCs...

[Yosharian]

norus, on 14 February 2015 - 03:23 AM, said:

IS LL's take an obscene amount of quirks to get to a competitive level. But at least we can fire 3 at a time without ghost heat now!

Uh since when?

[Cyborne Elemental]

Tbh, IS mediums and medpulse are fine where they are, but I always hoped for at least 3 LL or 3 LPL before heatscale kicked in.

IS ERLL, and PPC's I still think need a measure of control, maybe reducing heatscale a little on 3 ERLL & 3 PPC/ERPPC but not removing it completely would be the way to go.

C-Smalls & C-SPL needs to be unlinked from ERMED & ERMPL, because its only hurting the Nova honestly.

[Lily from animove]

kapusta11, on 14 February 2015 - 03:24 AM, said:

Everything you need to know about laser vomit:

is lpl ftw.

Mister D, on 14 February 2015 - 03:35 AM, said:

Tbh, IS mediums and medpulse are fine where they are, but I always hoped for at least 3 LL or 3 LPL before heatscale kicked in.

IS ERLL, and PPC's I still think need a measure of control, maybe reducing heatscale a little on 3 ERLL & 3 PPC/ERPPC but not removing it completely would be the way to go.

C-Smalls & C-SPL needs to be unlinked from ERMED & ERMPL, because its only hurting the Nova honestly.

after the quirkening I guess this is not even possible anymore because now the quirks would create some op loadouts again if you can spam 3 wuirked LL

and CERML CESL link, well if we ever get the SCR with 5E arm, then we sit on a op crow again. 10 lasers + some M's woah -.-

Edited by Lily from animove, 14 February 2015 - 03:42 AM.

[kapusta11]

Lily from animove, on 14 February 2015 - 03:41 AM, said:

is lpl ftw.

Yeah, who cares about range, weight and Ghost Heat, right?

[Lily from animove]

kapusta11, on 14 February 2015 - 03:51 AM, said:

Yeah, who cares about range, weight and Ghost Heat, right?

wow, I wonder how all those AC 20 mechs work with their pitiful range. How about you just use your mech for the niche its designed? if they ever allow crosstech, then behold the clanners with IS LPL's or the 1ß+ clanners with IS medium lasers. 4 LPL finish their weapon fire without ghostheat nearly at the same time as a single clan LPL even burns. and so time to exposure, (which all you "clanlaser OP" screamers ignore) is superior.

heta efficiency is a keyfeature with lasers that is most important.

If crosstech will be allowed, all thise IS gamers thiking clantech is op will slam clan-ermeds and ershorts on their mechs and suddenly figure out how bad thy are because they are not heat efficient and spread a load more for this and so are not as efficient for killing anymore. But then they ocme with the next excuse why clanners are op for some reason.

Edited by Lily from animove, 14 February 2015 - 11:30 AM.

[kapusta11]

Lily from animove, on 14 February 2015 - 04:12 AM, said:

wow, I wonder how all those AC 20 mechs work with their pitiful range. How about you just use your mech for the niche its designed? if they ever allow crosstech, then behold the clanners with IS LPL's or the 1ß+ clanners with IS medium lasers. 4 LPL finish their weapon fire without ghostheat nearly at the same time as a single clan LPL even burns. and so time to exposure, (which all you "clanlaser OP" screamers ignore) is superior.

heta efficiency is a keyfeature with lasers that is most important.

If crosstech wil be allowed, all thise IS gamers thiking clantehc is op will slam clanermeds and ershorts on their mechs and suddenly figure out how bad thy are because they are not heat efficient and spread a load more for this and so are not as efficient for killing anymore. But then they ocme with the next excuse why clanners are op for some reason.

How can one be so blind with all numbers right before his eyes is beyond me. Sigh.

[Lily from animove]

kapusta11, on 14 February 2015 - 04:40 AM, said:

How can one be so blind with all numbers right before his eyes is beyond me. Sigh.

how can one be too blind to see how you have to use those weapons correctly?

[Metus regem]

Lily from animove, on 14 February 2015 - 04:52 AM, said:

how can one be too blind to see how you have to use those weapons correctly?

Lilly, just wait for the IS ERML, and see how many just stick with the ISML over it. In MWO range is meaningless, most engagements happen at sub 200m anyways...

[Gas Guzzler]

So what advantages does the IS Large Laser loadout offer over the clan laser vomit build? Frankly there should be some advantage with such a weight (and slot) disparity, but all I see is a huge disadvantage with ghost heat. So, why keep ghost heat for 6 large lasers when clan mechs can have a loadout that performs virtually the same but avoids ghost heat?

[FupDup]

Gas Guzzler, on 14 February 2015 - 10:02 AM, said:

So what advantages does the IS Large Laser loadout offer over the clan laser vomit build? Frankly there should be some advantage with such a weight (and slot) disparity, but all I see is a huge disadvantage with ghost heat. So, why keep ghost heat for 6 large lasers when clan mechs can have a loadout that performs virtually the same but avoids ghost heat?

The IS ER Large is significantly cooler and shorter-duration than the Clan ER Large, but really that's about it.

The regular IS Large was never really a great weapon in the first place, and the Clan invasion embarrassed it even more.

Edited by FupDup, 14 February 2015 - 12:04 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

FupDup, on 14 February 2015 - 10:05 AM, said:

The IS ER Large is significantly cooler and shorter-duration than the Clan ER Large, but really that's about it. The regular IS Large was never really a great weapon in the first place, and the Clan invasion embarrassed it even more.

Yes thinking about the IS ER Large, might need to be treated differently, (its still 30 tons of lasers and not a cool loadout, but whatever, at least is offers one advantage) but looking at the numbers I don't know if removing ghost heat on the normal Large Lasers would really break the game... looking at the numbers, its basically saying, okay a <60 kph Stalker can now have a loadout that will compete directly with an 89 kph Timber Wolf. Why is that too much to ask for some of the clan players I want to know?

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 14 February 2015 - 10:10 AM.

[Screech]

How can you compare laser when you intentionally cripple one with ghost heat? Also laser vomit is a symptom of clan AC's being bad nothing else.

[FupDup]

Screech, on 14 February 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

How can you compare laser when you intentionally cripple one with ghost heat? Also laser vomit is a symptom of clan AC's being bad nothing else.

That's a part of it, but to be fair Clan lasers are also really good on their own as well.

[Gas Guzzler]

Screech, on 14 February 2015 - 10:13 AM, said:

How can you compare laser when you intentionally cripple one with ghost heat? Also laser vomit is a symptom of clan AC's being bad nothing else.

That's why I'm saying why don't we remove ghost heat on them.

[Mcgral18]

We shouldn't forget the WubShee either.

58 damage in a half second for 34.1 heat? You could also go 3 LPLs 5 MLs and a STD engine, for the same damage and more range, for a couple extra heat points.


More damage, less heat, less time. Less range.