322 replies to this topic

[JustEvil]

Percimes, on 24 June 2015 - 08:06 AM, said:

The alternative is to have a cone of fire... but there is a very vocal part of the community that see the introduction of a random number generator as a skill killer. They want their mech to shoot where they aim*. Just watch them react to my post...

For godsake. I wanted to write something earlier, abandoned it, but... What is so hard in let's say, disabling permanent convergence, introducing separate crosshair for every weapon/weapongroup (like one for center/left/right torso, arms and head), introducing button to hold for arm convergence and such stuff. It's much more reliable than cone of fire... Seriously... Cone of fire?

Edited by JustEvil, 24 June 2015 - 09:29 AM.

[Sarlic]

Davegt27, on 24 June 2015 - 07:33 AM, said:

to the OP

why do you care what I do with my Mech?

is this some kind of troll post?



why not let other people enjoy the game

Certainly not trolling.

I wish more people would understand that balance changes is not alone about weapons and mechs. It's a great chance to discover new things. New players should have better chances then just going with the meta. Veterans knows how-to. But then again if something gets dominant, it gets very stale.

Did you notice for example when PGI quirked alot of chassis and other mechs? People went out and tried every sort of builds. Or the Founders event? Alot of Founders had their own build running. No spam, no vomit, just plain old good fairly optimised builds.

The ideal mix is both specialists and generalists. Some thing will never change and that's when veterans getting stuck with the meta allong down the road.

Edited by Sarlic, 24 June 2015 - 09:43 AM.

[xengk]

Bilbo, on 24 June 2015 - 07:41 AM, said:

Yes and strange things could happen, like arm mounted cannons firing off at 90 degrees of where they were aimed.

This reminds me.
I remember ballistic used to have trajectory, I would lob AC20 slug over a cliff to hit mech behind it.
Nowadays that is no longer possible or very difficult, the slug either travel straight before dropping at max range or have very little arc.

[cSand]

I agree with you Sarlic, and personally I also like to play with varied loadouts

but to face the facts, it is much easier to play with a 1 button alpha vomit mech than a mixed loadout




edit: I just realized this was a huge necro'd thread, lol

Edited by cSand, 24 June 2015 - 09:43 AM.

[GRiPSViGiL]

Oddly enough using all the same weapon type lends itself to simplicity which in turn requires a lower skill cap to use optimally while usually being the efficient as well.

[cSand]

GRiPSViGiL, on 24 June 2015 - 09:41 AM, said:

Oddly enough using all the same weapon type lends itself to simplicity which in turn requires a lower skill cap to use optimally while usually being the efficient as well.

Very true sir

[HammerMaster]

Two words:
Stock Mode.

[Percimes]

Main problem with a stock mode would be ammo as it is rather low for the boosted armor of MWO.

[Percimes]

JustEvil, on 24 June 2015 - 09:28 AM, said:

For godsake. I wanted to write something earlier, abandoned it, but... What is so hard in let's say, disabling permanent convergence, introducing separate crosshair for every weapon/weapongroup (like one for center/left/right torso, arms and head), introducing button to hold for arm convergence and such stuff. It's much more reliable than cone of fire... Seriously... Cone of fire?

Not perfect, I know, but not as bad as you think. At close range it wouldn't make much of difference, might even resurrect brawling.

[DjPush]

The load outs that the OP is talking about are all I play.

To OP: Type "Brandon's Builds" in the forums search box.

[Abisha]

haveing a mix loadout is crap simple put.
first you have limited amount of ammo even 100 gauss rounds is bare minimal in a PUG.
having a mix means lot of ammo=not efficent enough to be usefull.

second optimal range and key-binding not to mention mix loadout means more brain ativaty on your weapons while drawing attention of battle field.

most efficient and effective build, your mech separated left and right with mouse button 1 button 2, and have all same weapon type

[CDLord HHGD]

Bilbo, on 24 June 2015 - 09:11 AM, said:

Oh. So it's still happening?

Yup.

I'll saddle up in my HBK tonight and check again though.

[Moldur]

Maybe I have no idea what my teammates will bring, and I need loadouts that will kill stuff.

[stoogah]

I'm trying to lvl hgn-732b ritght now using all hardpoints. It's pain... it's just no match for meta laser vomit, wubmasters/bolts or anything with large amount of hardpoinds of the same type. Armor quirks? Haha... instead of 1 sec my side torso can withstand like 1,5 sec of facetime vs whatever is meta now.
I don't like to play like that (boating same weapons), it's effective but boring and... out ouf place in MW game. Boating turns mwo into yet another fps online shoter where you just press da button to shot and thats it.

I don't have any idea how to remedy this situation. Maybe diminishing returns... smt like negative quirks like TBR have? Some bonuses for using all types of hardpoints?

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Harrison Kelly, on 26 February 2015 - 02:28 PM, said:

The hiccup of being outgunned at any given range by a specialist sniper/brawler/LRM boat? How does practice help you overcome that? Look, I'm not talking about intelligent 75/25 splits like bringing backup lasers on a sniper. But things like bringing a single LRM rack or having 5 different weapons groups with wildly different firing characteristics and ranges is not a hiccup. It's handicapping yourself. There's a very good reason why nobody puts one of each type of laser on their Mech and calls it a good build. The taste-the-rainbow colors might be pretty, but wow is it impractical.

If you choose to do that, I respect your right to build that way. All I ask if you don't try and tell me how your way is better when by every measurable metric, it's not.

Teamwork will trounce specialized builds no matter what.

If you have a full team, working together with mixed builds. You can trounce a team that's using all the broken mechanics. I've seen it work. [anicdotial evidence I know, so whatever]

But let's be real, seeing a mech run around with ALL medium pulse.. or all large/medium pulse, or x4uac5 or whatever... It's all just, kinda lame. There's no real tactics to a laser boat other than "find enemy, laze enemy, watch enemy die."

There will always be a place for specialized builds... else mechs like the Nova wouldn't exist. The HBK is a great example of a brawler... ect. There's good reasons for these mechs to exist, and yes, they are effective in their role... but not EVERY mech should fit this mold.

I have to wonder how skilled a person is when they can't deal with multiple weapon ranges on their mech, when they have to have everything range optimized, or when they only use a single weapons system in mass. Because then you're not learning, you're not evolving... you're not adjusting for anything. You're simply abusing the customization mechanic and stagnating your playstyle.

[Lykaon]

Sarlic, on 17 February 2015 - 05:34 AM, said:

That's no build for teamwork.

The irony of this statement is the better your team's teamwork the more successfull over specialized mechs become.

When I PUG I try to bring a mech with some versitility.I would never ever bring a mech with a severe over specialization handicap like all PPC loadouts (my PUG team wouldn't even think to keep lights out of my 90m min range for me)

In PUGlandia I am also loathe to bring any mech with a specialized role.

LRM carrier? no way Puggies can't be bothered to maintain target locks,spot or deploy UAVs conversley there is no shortage of puggies who will verbally berate you if you request teamwork from them.

Dedicate recon/spotter? No way of knowing if the Puggies will have LRMs or an attention span for using my recon data or if they would exploit a UAV deployment in enough time to make it worth the C-bills to launch.

Knife fight range brawler? not a good plan if you end up with some timid pugs who won't close range to make your AC20s and SRM make a difference.

Essentially the problem is by design there is one role worth building a mech for.

highest damage in shortest time period in as tight a grouping as possible.We don't need role warfare when we fight on postage stamp parcels of land with predetermined spawn points all we need is damage dealing capacity.

When the most advanced tactics employed are all how to kill them faster than they kill you your options narrow conciderably because the focus is likewise narrowed.

[CMDR Sunset Shimmer]

Joseph Mallan, on 27 February 2015 - 03:58 AM, said:

So having a AC20, Medium Lasers and SRMs Is a bad brawler?
Sniper With ERPPC and Gauss a Bad Sniper?

AC20 Mlas and SRM's all function in the same range bracket.

Generalist mechs function within varried range brackets.

[Koniks]

Flash Frame, on 24 June 2015 - 03:00 PM, said:

AC20 Mlas and SRM's all function in the same range bracket.

Generalist mechs function within varried range brackets.

Gauss+lasers and standard laser vomit are also generalists. UAC5s or Gauss+PPC/ERPPC also was a generalist build. Those loadouts are Swiss Army Knives without being bracket builds.

[FupDup]

Mizeur, on 24 June 2015 - 03:03 PM, said:

Gauss+lasers and standard laser vomit are also generalists. UAC5s or Gauss+PPC/ERPPC also was a generalist build. Those loadouts are Swiss Army Knives without being bracket builds.

The Clan LPL is an amazing generalist weapon that fight at pretty much any range. Long, medium, short, it's omnipotent and capable in every role you can think of.

[Hellcat420]

Never because taking a mixed loadout in this game is putting yourself at a disadvantage.