95 replies to this topic

[Ace Selin]

Cool so instead of implementing 1/1/1/1 we need to nerf the Stormcrow, Madcat & Dire.

[Yokaiko]

Ace Selin, on 07 March 2015 - 12:01 AM, said:

Cool so instead of implementing 1/1/1/1 we need to nerf the Stormcrow, Madcat & Dire.

If you haven't noticed almost no one runs whales in CW.

....and none of those three mechs need nerfs, the IS has better in each roll.

[ArchSight]

On the clan side in CW, Warhawks, Gargoyles, and the new Executioner will be the most desirable assaults just because they run faster. Player's that say these mechs are bad are just not experimenting enough. If your mech die's quickly just increase it's burst damage potential so when it get's hit one's it'll put a big hole in the other mech. The Gargolye is a more heat efficient laser vomit Nova (more DbleHS) or heat efficent brawler with ballistic and energy. If it starts to over heat it has the speed to get back into cover to cool down and retreat.

The alpha meta is still strong sense Heat Scale(Ghost Heat) doesn't take into account of mounting different weapons.

[Yokaiko]

ArchSight, on 07 March 2015 - 12:04 PM, said:

The Gargolye is a more heat efficient laser vomit Nova (more DbleHS) or heat efficent brawler with ballistic and energy. If it starts to over heat it has the speed to get back into cover to cool down and retreat.

Yeah, 80 tons that is outdone, and outmanuvered by a clan FIFTY tonner.....and like 7 IS mechs that are all signifcantly lighter. Warhawk is workable, but "burst" and "Clan mech" are false economies.

Executioner isn't in game yet
and Direwhale is simply too slow for most CW applications.

[ArchSight]

If burst and clan mech were false economies than the timberwolf and stormcrow laser vomit wouldn't exist. Those laser vomit builds are burst. Come out of cover fire a high damage alpha of over 50 damage of duration based lasers into the Center torso and then returning back into cover to cool down for another shot. The Gargoyle can get over 60 damage in laser vomit and have DHS to cool it down while behind cover. It's just captilizing on the same laser vomit builds. The nova can do a over 50 damage laser vomit too but it's more fragile than a stormcrow.

[Metus regem]

KraftySOT, on 02 March 2015 - 01:41 PM, said:

And let me add....if youre not rocking infantry, artillery, tanks, aerotech, mechs, on at least 8 map sheets, youre doing it wrong.

Your TT games should include predesigninated artillery zones, mines, APCs, paratroopers, resupply dumps, coolant trucks, lifter mechs, ammo loaders, aerofighters with bombs, thunder lrms, ECM, BAPs, entrenched positions, engineers, bridging trucks (and mechs), mine clearers, and possibly, a hot drop lance.

And if you dont have Yellow Jackets. FU.

Triage/medical tents, and using your Doctors and Astechs are optional.

I think this is the first post I have ever read by you, that makes me like you.

[Toadkillerdog]

Yokaiko, on 07 March 2015 - 11:10 AM, said:

If you haven't noticed almost no one runs whales in CW.

....and none of those three mechs need nerfs, the IS has better in each roll.

Really? The Orion can run 90 with JJs and my old Highlander build with a standard engine? Most of the clanmechs are balanced, yes, but I don't think anyone is stupid enough to legitimately belief the Twolf isn't just a bit overpowered.

[Yokaiko]

Toadkillerdog, on 08 March 2015 - 06:20 PM, said:

Really? The Orion can run 90 with JJs and my old Highlander build with a standard engine? Most of the clanmechs are balanced, yes, but I don't think anyone is stupid enough to legitimately belief the Twolf isn't just a bit overpowered.

I don't really like the timber, I very rarely run them.

It's certainly not the engine of destruction it's made out to be. I like the thunderbolt and dragon better personally.

[DasSibby]

Rouken, on 02 March 2015 - 12:40 PM, said:

Is the IS ready to only take one Thunderbolt as well? I think this deal works out worse for them.

Maybe I'm in the minority... But right now my drop decks has two Cataphracts (though I'm debating switching one of them out), an Enforcer, and a Wolverine. So... No?

[Metus regem]

Had my first CW game tonight since I switched from Clans to IS, and we slaughtered the Clan team 48 to 17.... I felt kind of dirty...

My deck was:

CN9-A
CN9-D
CN9-Wang
KGC-000(L)

I have only had one game clan side that was that much of a slaughter....

[Mordin Ashe]

New variants of existing Mechs that should be released in April (or so) for c-bills should help a bit as well, some of serious underperformers get fifth energy hardpoint and Kit Fox will have the ability to run 4xcERML 4xCMG combo. Also if quirks on Adder are done even remotely right we should have our first CW-viable light Mech. Who knows though... PGI sure seems to like to make strong Mechs (TW, SCR, DW) even stronger while the rest only gets scraps.

[Thejuggla]

It must be a coincidence you mostly see clan mechs with FF/Endo, swap-able pod JJs, or ecm.(unlock endo/JJ hint hint)

[50 50]

The endless tweaking of weapons and mechs is not going to solve anything.
Because the game is so competitive, people want to win or at least have some measure of success in the matches so they will optimise the mechs or make a build that suits their play style and gives them the best results.
Making players adopt a different build or use a certain mech more than others by altering the performance does little more than shift the problem.

The real solution is to adjust the objectives and structure of Community Warfare so it becomes beneficial to have a wider selection of mechs.
Because we only have the orbital cannon as the objective, to give the highest chance of success, players will take the best option/s available to them.
That's natural.

As it is, I see the orbital cannon defences as the first stage in an invasion.
There needs to be a campaign against different strategic targets after that to capture the planet where having different classes of mech can be given a chance to prove their worth.
We may see more of this with the 4 v 4 mode that was mentioned, but I hope there will be more depth to the whole process that will let players immerse themselves in the warfare.

[CrushLibs]

clan laser vomit so getting tired of seeing/hearing that comment on the forums.

PGI is back to screwing up the game again and again and again but now its quirks instead of fixing jump snipping.

Iam having second thought on my clan 3 pack due to all the BS.

Laser Vomit TW with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge frozen city 12 chain fire shots ,,, Stalker 4N with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge 20 chain fire shots.

Shots before overheating TW 12 , Stalker 20
Damage output TW 132 , Stalker 180
Range output TW 740m , Stalker 743m

Stalker has shorter laser duration too. So for all you IS whinners complaining about laser vomit clanners go look in a mirror and thank PGI.

Most IS weapons have more range , faster cycle times , and less heat + customization of engine , armor , and endo clans can't touch if you are losing ground on CW get off your butts and play because for now the IS has a HUGE upper hand.

PGI before you kill off CW I suggest you return to 2 large laser GH and put IS down to 240 - 245 tons.

[BARBAR0SSA]

Yeah I'm pretty much just going to say STFU from now on, clan mechs defending, lost 48-7 and some of those kills were overheating and drop ships...dun dun dun!

[Summon3r]

Squarebasher, on 02 March 2015 - 12:33 PM, said:

Having dropped into clan wars for the first time tonight, I can see why there has been talk about stopping players taking the same mech more than once.

At the moment i can see that clan mechs are a little short on choice, but once wave 3 is out for cbills then i see no reason why a rule like this should not be brought in.

lol seriously?? dragon, thunderbolt, stalker rinse repeat.

[Funkmaster Rick]

CrushLibs, on 10 March 2015 - 06:01 AM, said:

Laser Vomit TW with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge frozen city 12 chain fire shots ,,, Stalker 4N with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge 20 chain fire shots.

Shots before overheating TW 12 , Stalker 20
Damage output TW 132 , Stalker 180
Range output TW 740m , Stalker 743m

Stalker has shorter laser duration too. So for all you IS whinners complaining about laser vomit clanners go look in a mirror and thank PGI.

Even though I'm a clanner, I've gotta point out that your IS 'mech in this example has an extra ten tons over the clan 'mech and it has a whole slew of quirks specifically designed to make that build exceptionally strong. In other words, you have biased your study by specifically skewing the results to make any conclusion but your own look stupid.

So, while you've proved that the Stalker-4N is a better Large Laser puke than any given Timberwolf build, the point you claimed to make - that IS does better laser vomit than the clans - has not been anywhere near conclusively proven by your data.

Sorry bro. That's science and stuff.

[Johnny Z]

CrushLibs, on 10 March 2015 - 06:01 AM, said:

clan laser vomit so getting tired of seeing/hearing that comment on the forums.

PGI is back to screwing up the game again and again and again but now its quirks instead of fixing jump snipping.

Iam having second thought on my clan 3 pack due to all the BS.

Laser Vomit TW with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge frozen city 12 chain fire shots ,,, Stalker 4N with 18 DHS and 6 ERLarge 20 chain fire shots.

Shots before overheating TW 12 , Stalker 20
Damage output TW 132 , Stalker 180
Range output TW 740m , Stalker 743m

Stalker has shorter laser duration too. So for all you IS whinners complaining about laser vomit clanners go look in a mirror and thank PGI.

Most IS weapons have more range , faster cycle times , and less heat + customization of engine , armor , and endo clans can't touch if you are losing ground on CW get off your butts and play because for now the IS has a HUGE upper hand.

PGI before you kill off CW I suggest you return to 2 large laser GH and put IS down to 240 - 245 tons.

All this did was prove how OP the TW is. The TW is 10 tons lighter and is nearly twice as fast not to mention the TW profile is way smaller and has jump jets, the torso twist is faster etc. etc etc.

Thanks for giving such a strong arguement for the Cheese Wolf nerf that is sure to come.

Edited by Johnny Z, 11 March 2015 - 01:32 AM.

[Widowmaker1981]

Koniving, on 02 March 2015 - 12:52 PM, said:

Problem with a chassis limit:
85 tons, 75 tons, 55 tons, 35 tons. Largest of each. You know people would be all over it, and complaining about tonnage limits if they had a chassis limit.

I personally believe the mandatory 4 mechs thing should be dropped, and the tonnage lowered substantially. Say 115 tons. Most you can bring is five 20 ton mechs (with 15 tons left over). Least you can bring is a single 100 ton mech (with 15 tons left over).

CW would turn into something.. awful. Like UT or something, since with the way mechs are balanced in this game, taking 4 - 5 lights would be the only way to go (4 probably, 115 tons would be 2xFS9, locust, commando).. no thanks. Though 2 Streakcrows might be pretty hilarious..

edit, On Topic: We will see more variety when clans have a viable mech that weighs under 55 tons - quirks might help but i doubt it, because there are far too many IS r3t4rds on these forums who have never played a clan mech and constantly cry about them being OP, so PGI wont give the crap clan mechs the quirks they need to be viable alternatives. Wave 3 should fix it though, because the Scat and the Cheater should/will be very viable.

Edited by Widowmaker1981, 11 March 2015 - 02:11 AM.

[Brizna]

The clan CW triumvirate (Stormcrow, Hellbringer and Timberwolf) are all great mechs, but even then we should see more of the others mechs like we see a lot of under performing IS mechs all the time. It's the fact that all the other clan mechs either are really sucky or it's not so bad but becuase of weight concerns make you take a definitely sucky mech that you almost see nothing outside of triumvirate: want a warhawk, the mech itself is meh but usable but good luck picking the other three mechs ... direwolf is better but practically married to a mist lynx... novasuck is a waste of tonnage in itself ... Kit Fox decent punch for a light but way too easy to kill, and so on.

Wave 3 though is going to throw all of that out the window, Arctic Cheetah and Shadow Cat aren't just going to rock (probably) but they are going to really open the possibility of doing stuff out of the meta because once and for all clan will have good lighter mechs to compensate for heavier mechs. I actually foresee that wave 3 will inevitably lead to another CW clan nerf...

Edited by Brizna, 11 March 2015 - 02:10 AM.