264 replies to this topic

[Quicksilver Aberration]

I would've much preferred the IS engines getting buffs of some sort to balance the Clan XL against the other engines rather than a nerf to after you lose your side since most IS assaults still have no reason to run an XL. The parity between IS XLs and standard engines is still rough right now. Clan XLs do need to be balanced against because they are the strongest part of Clan tech.

On that same thought though, Omnimechs need their restrictions loosened because many of the poor performers are unnecessarily hamstrung and don't benefit from the engine rules that differ from TT (ie you can use engines that aren't multiples of its tonnage). Many of the Clan mechs wouldn't be so bad if they were as customizable as the IS mechs, almost all of them would be amazing (especially the Summoner).

[KraftySOT]

Why would IS engines get a buff? ...

And why are we buffing and nerfing things rather than just going by the stinking rule book.

Theres a perfectly acceptable penalty already in the rule books, thats between the rather light penalty they already had, and the godawful yet only 10 seconds long penalty theyre going to get.

How do you not go with the middle option, thats already a battletech rule.

Come oooon.

[CyclonerM]

KraftySOT, on 17 March 2015 - 08:31 AM, said:

This is also why democracy is a cesspit of stagnation, corruption, and stupidity.

Despite something being the right thing to do, everyone sees it as a personal issue, and if slighted, must extract some sort of 'vengeance' from the other party in retribution, namely in the way of nerfing something they have, that isnt actually broken.

No one actually cares about balance, or the rules, or the franchise.

They just care about their robot, and their ability to grind the rail. Their ability to pad stats that no one else can see.

Democracy also fails when everyone just seems to think that his and his opinion only is the right one, while everyone else is just stupid, or egoistically cares only about his stats that no one can see, or something else.

You know what? I could not care less about my stats, they are horrible, heritage of my first games played at 4 FPS lol;

And i actually care about balance, or i would not waste my time here.

And i absolutely love this franchise, or chances are i would not be playing this game at all.

I just have different opinions on balance.. And what rules to actually pick from the sourcebooks for MWO..

Fate 6, on 17 March 2015 - 08:33 AM, said:

Interclan balance still gets murdered by this change though. In fact, it makes the worst of the clans even worse while only minorly affecting the best of the clans because the Storm Crow and Timber Wolf have the best ST hitboxes of the clan mechs.

He is a Spheroid but gets it. My hopes for the Inner Sphere are rasing again

RussianWolf, on 17 March 2015 - 08:40 AM, said:

And Stock configs on clan mechs would also be mandatory. You would be able to switch pods, but the load out of the pods would be fixed.

Aff, well bargained and done. I could even just go with standard configurations, without switching pods. Assault Tech and MW:LL do not have customization and they are very good games in their own ways.

Flaming oblivion, on 17 March 2015 - 10:05 AM, said:

God damn you PGI you suck


Now if I lose a torso in my already vastly superior mech weapon wise slot wise range wise etc, I will lose a barely noticeable amount of speed , but still be alive to keep doing damage.

This is unacceptable as IS xl mechs when they lose a torso flat out die

I must keep my clan mech ridiculously op.

/end sarcasm.

Little bit more info mathematically the best mech per weight class

Light - Firestarter

medium - Stormcrow

Heavy- This ones hard its pretty tight between the timby and HBR but I think the timby edges it overall.

assault- Dire wolf

Notice something ?

And this nerf wont remove the clans from superiority in 3 of the 4 weight classes.

As the guy above said..

The IS uses its best 'Mechs in CW: Firestarter and Thunderbolt (which some argue to be as good or even better than the Timber Wolf, especially at certain conditions). The Clans just do the same with Stormcrow and Timber Wolf. However, if you apply this nerf that punishes little these two 'Mechs and punishes more the other 'Mechs (Adder, Ice Ferret, Gargoyle come to my mind).. What will have changed? So this fix would be pretty useless, even damaging in terms of overall Clan 'Mechs balance. Either you just want to nerf Clan 'Mechs for your own reasons (strange, as you are a Clan player..) or else, you just do not want to bring actual balance among the Clan 'Mechs and in Clan vs IS.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

KraftySOT, on 17 March 2015 - 10:16 AM, said:

Why would IS engines get a buff? ...

And why are we buffing and nerfing things rather than just going by the stinking rule book.

Theres a perfectly acceptable penalty already in the rule books, thats between the rather light penalty they already had, and the godawful yet only 10 seconds long penalty theyre going to get.

How do you not go with the middle option, thats already a battletech rule.

Come oooon.

Buffing IS engines would translate to better survivability which in turn increases TTK for some of the bad IS chassis'

In this case, the rulebook still doesn't fix the dominance of Clan tech. After the 20% speed loss, the Stormcrow engine behaves like a 270 rated engine, which is what close to what most IS 55 tonners run if they are using a standard engine, meaning you still have a huge advantage. It also removes the necessity of some of the quirks.

Basically trying to nerf Clan XLs to offset the death from side torso that IS XLs suffer from is silly, so why not buff IS XLs and standard engines to compete on the level of Clan XLs? One is trying to create some sort of comparison between Apples and Oranges, the other is trying to make the differences more tangible and comparable.

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 17 March 2015 - 10:25 AM.

[Kain Demos]

KraftySOT, on 17 March 2015 - 08:51 AM, said:

The Central Committee of Expanding Bureaucracy would like to thank you for your patronage. Would you please fill out these three forms completely, to receive this thank you.

Not that I entirely disagree with everything you say (any government by default is corrupt and not to be trusted) I just found irony in a Liao guy trashing democracy and individualism.

[CancersCincar]

Yes, yes, yes! Let's make it so that the already terribly slow clan lights become even slower on side torso loss! The other underused chassis as well, like the nova and summoner. Brilliant idea!

Wait.... what? I understand the desire to make clan 'mechs like the TWolf and SCrow slower but... Why does the Summoner need this to happen? Or the Nova? Or the Adder? Or the Myst Lynx? Or the Gargoyle? Or the Ice Ferret? Like I know the Ice Ferret is fast and all but it's not really that great.

[EvilCow]

They should have implemented this since the beginning and spare us all the drama consequence of the change.

Than 20% look spot on, strange, I would have expected 1% or 80%.

[KraftySOT]

Kain Thul, on 17 March 2015 - 10:24 AM, said:

Not that I entirely disagree with everything you say (any government by default is corrupt and not to be trusted) I just found irony in a Liao guy trashing democracy and individualism.

Sshhh The Maskirovka will hear you. And disappear you.

[Joseph Mallan]

Flaming oblivion, on 17 March 2015 - 10:05 AM, said:

God damn you PGI you suck


Now if I lose a torso in my already vastly superior mech weapon wise slot wise range wise etc, I will lose a barely noticeable amount of speed , but still be alive to keep doing damage.

This is unacceptable as IS xl mechs when they lose a torso flat out die

I must keep my clan mech ridiculously op.

/end sarcasm.

Little bit more info mathematically the best mech per weight class

Light - Firestarter

medium - Stormcrow

Heavy- This ones hard its pretty tight between the timby and HBR but I think the timby edges it overall.

assault- Dire wolf

Notice something ?

And this nerf wont remove the clans from superiority in 3 of the 4 weight classes.

Wait... Aren't you the one who always whines?

[Serpieri]

Losing a side torso on a clan mech is 2 critical hits that result in +10 heat - which causes a mech to lose 2 movement points and also affects targeting. So PGI make this happen but also reduce the speed at which a mech can place its reticle on target.

[Knight Magus]

Don't see this a nerf - its straight from Battletech.

[Phashe]

if someone shoots out 1/4 of my car's engine, it will go slower I bet. :-)

(I love my clan mechs, and I still think the nerf is good. 20-25% per side torso or so)

[kapusta11]

"Please don't nerf my OP mechs!!1" Right?

Edited by kapusta11, 17 March 2015 - 10:49 AM.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Phashe, on 17 March 2015 - 10:48 AM, said:

if someone shoots out 1/4 of my car's engine, it will go slower I bet. :-)

(I love my clan mechs, and I still think the nerf is good. 20-25% per side torso or so)

Actually, your car wouldn't go at all.

[CancersCincar]

kapusta11, on 17 March 2015 - 10:49 AM, said:

"Please don't nerf my OP mechs!!1" Right?

Myst Lynx? Ice ferret? Adder? Nova? Summoner? Gargoyle? Too. Good.

>.>

Edited by CancersCincar, 17 March 2015 - 10:53 AM.

[CyclonerM]

kapusta11, on 17 March 2015 - 10:49 AM, said:

"Please don't nerf my OP mechs!!1" Right?

They might have been at first, now they were pretty balanced, and some IS 'Mechs could even outsnipe the Clan 'Mechs that had always been so good at long range fighting that i heard in BT Clan players used to just walk backward firing, staying out of the IS 'Mechs range..

[WarHippy]

Serpieri, on 17 March 2015 - 10:46 AM, said:

Losing a side torso on a clan mech is 2 critical hits that result in +10 heat - which causes a mech to lose 2 movement points and also affects targeting. So PGI make this happen but also reduce the speed at which a mech can place its reticle on target.

Knight Magus, on 17 March 2015 - 10:47 AM, said:

Don't see this a nerf - its straight from Battletech.

Vastly superior Clan mechs and more difficult customization of IS mechs than what we have here are also straight from Battletech. So using that as an excuse probably isn't the best way to go about making a valid argument in this case.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Knight Magus, on 17 March 2015 - 10:47 AM, said:

Don't see this a nerf - its straight from Battletech.

Its actually not as bad a penalty as TT BT.

Edited by Mirumoto Izanami, 17 March 2015 - 11:01 AM.

[Agent 0 Fortune]

I support the OP, this should not be a Clan only Nerf. Fair is fair, apply the same penalty to IS XL engines, then it is balanced and fair.

[Burktross]

I support this wholeheatedly.

Agent 0 Fortune, on 17 March 2015 - 11:04 AM, said:

I support the OP, this should not be a Clan only Nerf. Fair is fair, apply the same penalty to IS XL engines, then it is balanced and fair.

Not sure if sarcasm?

PhoenixFire55, on 17 March 2015 - 08:28 AM, said:

I'm all for the idea. As long as stock configs on IS mechs are mandatory.

No, you're using the wrong argument.
IS Configs take 30 OOC days to change.
Wait, that's just completely irrelevant. You should've ranted about LFE and IS XL (somehow)

Edited by Burktross, 17 March 2015 - 11:10 AM.