291 replies to this topic

[ccrider]

YCSLiesmith, on 06 April 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

you're the one who is 'self-entitled' because you're whining that the game should be changed so that even though you suck you still can't get ground up. boo hoo look at my stats! are these the stats of a guy who should get spawn camped?? PGI i paid 500 dollars for my golden madcat and i expect to win every game!


Yes! Exactly! if i get spawn camped, I deserve it. However I don't, because i have got good. If i play badly, I deserve what I get. Only I can step up my game, I cant cry to the ref that I'm losing 48 nil. This is the law of the jungle.

also again spawn camping is not about showing off, it is about getting out of the game with as many cbills as possible in as little time as possible. There is no need to show off, since no one worth talking about is watching.

As much as it pains me to agree with anyone from House Kurita, I do in this case. However, I think an exception to the law of the jungle needs to be made if we want the population of CW to grow. If two teams of 6-12 organized players meet, feel free to spawn camp if the battle devolves in such a way that one team is getting trounced. These teams both had the opportunity to use comms, coordinate drop decks and come up with a coherent strategy. If one gets overwhelmed, then wiping them out quicker gets the next game started earlier. But, if it's an organized team versus a PUG group, then back off and let them fight back. The organized team is still going to win; it might add, what, 5-8 minutes to the time? Everyone has played in solo queues. Solo is great for learning to move, shoot, aim, use cover, etc. It is terrible at teaching the core concepts that CW has become. It isn't teaching hill humping, meta building, focus fire or using comms. It doesn't teach you to coordinate a deck with 11 other players. It teaches you to maintain your mech as long as possible and pad your stats at the expense of team mates. look at the number of solo players who will happily sit at the back launching LRMs or gauss shots while their team gets overrun. Those people drop in their first CW match and then are supposed to spontaneously learn that sacrificing themselves to push the enemy out of a spawn point is necessary? C'mon, we all know that doesn't happen. They will continue to sit far away, plink away at the campers and wonder why premades are matched with PUGs, then go back to solo land. If you give 'em a chance to fight back, a few may find the mode fun, then start looking up what they need to change to get better. maybe they join a unit, switch up mechs(drop LRM boats!) or just get on TS and faction group. Either way, it's a bonus for all of us who enjoy CW; more players actively buying into the mode means more Dev time put into it. I want a CW where loyalist factions are the core, where planets being taken means something, where mercs are hired for specific tasks, I.e. take over planet"x' for Davion, defend planet "y" for 1 week etc. That won't happen with the anemic population we have now. So, if you meet a PUG team, just give them a shot to shoot back a bit. You'll still win, by a lot, but you might help create more players. Some of them may be really good, see your team in action and want to join. it won't hurt, and only stands to benefit them as well as you.

[Telmasa]

Stoned Prophet, on 05 April 2015 - 08:24 PM, said:

Actually, really the only issue is you cant seem to understand that other people disagree with you, and your opinion is not the end of the discussion. Long and the short of it you let yourself get spawncamped. To blame someone for attacking you when you let them is the height of foolishness. Please, understand that no matter what you think, you are the one who is failing, not the people who are good enough to push you back to your spawn and wiped you out.

Soooo, people are supposed to play hard right up until the enemy cant handle it? This is such a stupid concept, I cannot understand how you came to think this way, and must assume you want the game to make up for your inability to compete against people who put in more effort and ability than you do.

Hypocritical nonsense.
"let myself be spawncamped"
"you...let them [attack]"
"not the people good enough to [spawn camp]"

People are supposed to play the game the way it was intended. It's that simple.

I've said it multiple times this thread, I will repeat it just for your one-track mind: Developers* don't design games so that you can spawncamp.

*EA games & Call of Duty titles excluded.



But by all means, Stoned P & YCS, if you want to kill anybody's urge to bother with this game, so you can continue farming freebies by abusing all the gimmicks you can create out of all the little flaws and niches of an incomplete & unfinished game, you go right ahead.

I'm done arguing here, I've laid out all salient points in posts prior.

If PGI really is naiive enough to listen to players like you, then just like so many other titles that have flopped and failed over the last decade, all hope is lost for this game and any kind of future it won't have.

Edited by Telmasa, 06 April 2015 - 04:47 PM.

[Tasker]

I love 2 spawn camp.

This is me spawn camping:



When I shoot your mech before it even touch the ground, MY HEART IS BEATING, MY HANDS ARE SHAKING

[Chef Kerensky]

Dropship *large laser sound*

Edited by Chef Kerensky, 06 April 2015 - 09:04 PM.

[Scoops Kerensky]

Telmasa, on 06 April 2015 - 04:45 PM, said:

Hypocritical nonsense.
"let myself be spawncamped"
"you...let them [attack]"
"not the people good enough to [spawn camp]"

People are supposed to play the game the way it was intended. It's that simple.

I've said it multiple times this thread, I will repeat it just for your one-track mind: Developers* don't design games so that you can spawncamp.

*EA games & Call of Duty titles excluded.



But by all means, Stoned P & YCS, if you want to kill anybody's urge to bother with this game, so you can continue farming freebies by abusing all the gimmicks you can create out of all the little flaws and niches of an incomplete & unfinished game, you go right ahead.

I'm done arguing here, I've laid out all salient points in posts prior.

If PGI really is naiive enough to listen to players like you, then just like so many other titles that have flopped and failed over the last decade, all hope is lost for this game and any kind of future it won't have.

At this point I'm willing to support it if means hysterical people like you stop playing.

[Stoned Prophet]

Scoops Kerensky, on 06 April 2015 - 09:10 PM, said:

At this point I'm willing to support it if means hysterical people like you stop playing.

QFT

[pbiggz]

Scoops Kerensky, on 06 April 2015 - 09:10 PM, said:

At this point I'm willing to support it if means hysterical people like you stop playing.

[Hayek Lahiri]

Scoops Kerensky, on 06 April 2015 - 09:10 PM, said:

At this point I'm willing to support it if means hysterical people like you stop playing.

#rekt

[Tasker]

Ha Ha. Just a little Kurita humor there.

[Romeo Deluxe]

nitra, on 05 April 2015 - 11:12 PM, said:

2nd. spawn camping is not playing hard . especially in this game with these maps. you did very little to camp the opposing team spawn. took down a wave or two of mechs preceded to spawn sat and focused fired on dropping opponents. with overwhelming fire support.

(wall of text)

Same message I have written on other pages of this thread: Please go read page 2 of this very thread for suggestions how to balance "spawn camping".

I still suspect people are skipping posts just to unload some of their rage without stopping to think.

You will never remove spawn camping in games that allow you multiple spawns. Public matches are free of it because there is only the initial spawn. Thus I have a feeling PGI is a bit noobish about dealing with this matter. I'm sure they will soon come up with an answer. (cough:: see page 2 :: cough)

Take a look at any of those games you are thinking about. Eliminate all the ones that only have one initial spawn and not multiple spawns. There is no way to prevent this. However, I believe there are ways to balance this per the many suggestions on page 2.

Random Spawn Location - don't like this idea for a game where the focus is teamwork. I like the dropships as it's more sci-fi instead of you mystically appearing somewhere or even dropships going to some random map location. In a match where one side takes virtual control it will be a hunt for the ones separated from the heard.

Invincible Location: those spawning & apparently losing will just sit there or at least you will have those who will just sit in the safe area that will frustrate the rest of team who wants to put up a fight. Also, designing this into a map is always a tricky job. People will try to find a way to exploit this. Human nature and so forth.

Hardened Spawn Location: similar to Planetside2, the hangar suggestion on page 2, the spawn camp will simply move to the door of the hangar. This is also pretty much like the Invincible Location noted. The main difference is that if you sit in there you will lose the match because objectives are far enough you need to move out to defend them. Maps/modes would have to be designed with this consequence in mind.

Nope. There is no way to design a spawn camp free game that makes sense and isn't as frustrating as what we already have. However, as noted on page 2, there are ways to balance this out so there can be more than just an easy kill frenzy at the LZ. I believe this is PGI's goal. The dropships have lasers that can kill opponents. There is no other explanation than that PGI see's it like I do(some others here to) and are trying to balance.

Some tweaking may be called for on some of the maps. PGI will need to experiment, but you will never, should never, eliminate it. See page 2.

[Lyoto Machida]

Barantor, on 01 April 2015 - 08:04 PM, said:

A whole lot of people don't like CW, something should be done about that.

A whole lot of people (like me) want this game to be better than it is, something should be done about that.

A whole lot of people have moved on to other games....

A whole lot of people will slaughter this game in reviews on steam...

A whole lot of people will be disappointed if it fails...

Probably spent over $500 on mechs and had been waiting 2+ years for CW. Pretty sure I've spent more time on the forums reading about CW than playing it.

Why? Because it's boring to me in its current state.

Just dropped $60 on Elite: Dangerous yesterday and while flying around doing nothing might seem boring, it's preferable to CW for me at this point in time.

[Romeo Deluxe]

Addendum to previous post:

Spawn on Lance or Leader - if the Lance is getting slaughtered it's another "spawn camp". Also I don't see how you make this fair or work with MWO. Dropships? Would have to remove the lasers and/or make them killable.

[Telmasa]

Simple solution:

Rename this game to Mechwarrior: Call Of Duty.

Then it would both properly describe the so-called meta, and the meathead players who enjoy it! (FPS Doug & airhorns? are you serious? Laugh it up, mountain dewfus...lmao)

Edited by Telmasa, 07 April 2015 - 01:24 AM.

[Tasker]

Call of Duty is cool. Millions of people play Call of Duty even though core gameplay not as good as Mechwarrior Online. Hmm, make you think? Maybe spawn camping is epic and CW will bring many new players to MWO when game release on Steam!

[Crockdaddy]

nitra, on 05 April 2015 - 11:12 PM, said:

Its not about honor or not playing "hard" nor is it role playing .

1st. no one cares about honor in this game so well just throw it out the window sad as it may be but gamers in general just tend to be a bunch of honorless ****** who just want easy kills.

2nd. spawn camping is not playing hard . especially in this game with these maps. you did very little to camp the opposing team spawn. took down a wave or two of mechs preceded to spawn sat and focused fired on dropping opponents. with overwhelming fire support.

3rd. roleplaying excuse is laughable , in what way is spawn camping role playing? in what war does the enemy resupply the troops into the same compromised drop zones repeatedly ? so no, your not role playing.

what you are doing is what every spawn camping team, group, or person does in every game that spawn camping occurs in.

its called Kill Farming.

mechwarrior is not the only game that deals with spawn camping many games before it have dealt with it and even some games have guilds who host servers just so they can spawn camp the players unfortunate enough to join that server.

and yes their forums are filled with the same bs trying to justify how their spawn camping is justified because the other team sucks.

well you know what ?

your team sucks just as hard when its in a overwhelming predicament as does any team, what makes the difference is that good teams dont get them selves in those pediments often. unfortunately the more unbalanced a game is the more often a team finds it self in such a crunch.

So what happens here in CW we have teams that happen to perform well wiping out the first or second wave of attack/defending mechs.

eventually depending on how shattered the opposing team is, the majority of the spawn camping team ends up at the spawn points. regardless of the drop point, the range of the CW meta is well with in striking distance of any dropped mechs. so they either become crippled or severely damaged providing little chance against any minor resistance. (also nothing beats getting dropped into a artillery strike)

The camped team continues to spawn in a haphazard fashion aiding to the focus fire farming fest for the spawn campers. the game enforces this strategy as there is no real risk for abandoning the objective . The spawn campers continue their current farming of individuals to pad their kill count.


So to summarize spawn camping is nothing more than an easy way to get free kills.

the game reinforces this because there is no real risk in ignoring the in game objective.(this is a problem but those who defend spawn camping are to blind to see it )

any suggesting that wold force the spawn campers to actually engage in a full on brawl is out right attacked as they would rather sit at spawn and shoots "terribad" players in the back on drop. because they have such elite rear coring skills they need to show it off.


But yeah keep on kill farming you will never see a better game from that action .

but as most of you have already stated you dont want a better game, you just what to enforce the current broken game play so you can continue your traditional farming game play. and brag to one another on how awesome it was when you nailed that locust in the rear ct with a 60pt alpha strike. he was so terribad that he didnt even try to fight your 8 mechs. were so leet !!

Yet if you focus on the objectives (also called light rushing) ... a large segment calls you out for doing that.

Another segment wants nerfed
ERPPC
Laser Vomit
Lights
Direct Fire Weapons
LRMs (even though they suck hard in group play)

It is the forums ... each issue is just from someones personal experience.


Easy solution ... group up. When on defense don't sit back ... get aggressive. I'd rather die on the attack then eating it from the dropship.

The only real problem is the losers come here to whine about their latest loss. Do something about it. Take some time to find out how the better teams operate. Crap ... NS pounded Davion for months. Those guys never stopped and in fact got better. We still win but the matches became tougher.

Want to win in CW?
Fix your drop deck
Fix your mech builds
Get on Team Speak
Find a group
Work with a better group to learn from them


I dropped with the old LORDs quite a bit ... it was eye opening in some regards how they operate ... we did something similar but on a lesser scale. Learned quite a bit. They were still much better but at least I had a clue on how to manage my drops better. Hell watch Jager XII stream ... you can learn a lot just from that.

Edited by Crockdaddy, 07 April 2015 - 06:56 AM.

[YCSLiesmith]

i always laugh when i see someone say 'I dont drop in cheesy, broken mechs' and then they cry about how spawn camping means never giving them a chance to fight, they would have won otherwise. sorry about your XL machine gun crabs, everyone

Lyoto Machida, on 06 April 2015 - 11:36 PM, said:

Probably spent over $500 on mechs

gold mech not good investment

[Tasker]

Crockdaddy, on 07 April 2015 - 06:52 AM, said:

Yet if you focus on the objectives (also called light rushing) ... a large segment calls you out for doing that.

Hit nail on head with this post.

When we light rush objective, enemy team complain that light rush OP. When we farm enemy team to 48 with heavy mech, enemy team complain of spawn camping.

Truth is, nobody like to lose, but player who insist on playing bad never have chance to win, so only option is to try to change rules of game to favor bad play.

[Kerc Kasha]

I too have changed my opinion on spawn camping, OP. It's in fact extremely cool and owns quite a lot.

[Chef Kerensky]

Telmasa, on 07 April 2015 - 01:24 AM, said:

Simple solution:

Rename this game to Mechwarrior: Call Of Duty.

Then it would both properly describe the so-called meta, and the meathead players who enjoy it! (FPS Doug & airhorns? are you serious? Laugh it up, mountain dewfus...lmao)

If this game managed to pump out annual overpriced sequels with a solid foundation for multiplayer gameplay and a lack of new content with each iteration I would be much more impressed with it than in its current state.

I'm not sure if you're trying to imply that because Call of Duty is derivative and appeals to the lowest common denominator that it's somehow flawed from a gameplay design perspective. Unless you're talking about the single player campaigns which are cutscene-driven trash.

[Chef Kerensky]

I haven't played a cod game in years but you can bet your ass I ran around with an rpg-7 and danger close in mw2 and I shot rockets at people, and then I reloaded those rockets with OMA, and then did it again. I did this because it was very effective, and because it was extremely funny.

Similar principles apply to spawn camping.