132 replies to this topic

[DrSlamastika]

Messy Bopzz . . . . this game is not pay to win.

Edited by DrSlamastika, 12 April 2015 - 10:50 AM.

[sneeking]

Can you afford an urban mech mr bopzz ?

Because iv softened toward you during the course of this thread and I recon we could go stomping

Edited by sneeking, 12 April 2015 - 05:40 AM.

[sneeking]

Fragnot, on 12 April 2015 - 05:31 AM, said:

You still have the Spider then? I wouldn't call it a waste...

Buy a few chassis with MC, sell them for C-Bills, and then buy them back later like I have; then we can talk about waste

I agree that the initial grind for a F2P here is pretty steep, don't get discouraged. As others have suggested, it pays to research Mechs and builds before buying when your account is new (metamechs, smurfy's, youtube etc).
I hope you stick with it, glhf^^

Yea I did some of that also..

[bad arcade kitty]

anyway if he is going to stick to spider buying sdr-5k is not a waste, he needs to buy and train basic skills for 3 versions of spider to get the elite skill tree anyway, so he can simply buy 5d with the rest of the cadet bonus, swap there all that engine and other equipment which he bought for sdr-5k and then wait till he needs 5k and some other model to unlock the elite tree

if he don't want spider at all he can create a new account

[Bishop Steiner]

Metus regem, on 11 April 2015 - 11:49 PM, said:

I'd say that the Wang is the best centurion hands down...

debatable, based mostly on playstyle.

[AEgg]

Of course it's pay to win. Anyone arguing anything else is using a non-standard definition of "pay to win" (typically only admitting pay to win if the advantage is significant). More options are an advantage, even if they're bad options.

We went over this endlessly when the YLW came out. End result, most people agree that hero mechs are pay to win, but generally they are not actually very good. The people that stand on principles left the game, some like myself simply decided to never buy a hero mech until PGI started selling them for cbills without the skin or boost, and some people just don't care.

[sneeking]

Who doesn't want a spider though ?

[bad arcade kitty]

yen lo wang's hatchet when (:

[Metus regem]

Bishop Steiner, on 12 April 2015 - 05:58 AM, said:

debatable, based mostly on playstyle.

Out of my three I'd say:

Wang
9A = 9D

The Wang gets the lead, for being able to fit the AC20, and two energy slots.

[Yokaiko]

One Medic Army, on 11 April 2015 - 11:41 PM, said:

It's only pay to win if they're better (ahem, Misery, looking at you).

Pay-2-Win is paying money to get an advantage over other players, which is different than having additional options. Additional options are only P2W if they're upgrades rather than side grades.

Hero variants aren't (generally speaking) any better than non-hero variants.

You do know that currently the -4N makes Misery its female dog right? The Misery can do the PPFLD thing, but -4N mangles it in range, sustained DPS and alpha.

[sneeking]

Metus regem, on 12 April 2015 - 06:52 AM, said:

Out of my three I'd say:

Wang
9A = 9D

The Wang gets the lead, for being able to fit the AC20, and two energy slots.

Except I never put one on it lol...

[Yokaiko]

sneeking, on 12 April 2015 - 07:20 AM, said:

Except I never put one on it lol...

WTH is this blaspheme?

Yen Lo max XL, AC 20 ES/FF/DHS x2 MPL three tons of ammo, its one of the best medium brawler the IS has, 106kph with the Wang out. Mine I swapped down the MPLs to mlas for CW and use it there to, expend all 5 tons of ammo punch out and back to the next mech. Its awesome.

[sneeking]

Yea im like that.

My fav wang build was always 2x uac5 with no laser backup.

One gun each on a separate mouse button so I can control the fire rate...

[bad arcade kitty]

Yokaiko, on 12 April 2015 - 07:24 AM, said:

WTH is this blaspheme?

Yen Lo max XL, AC 20 ES/FF/DHS x2 MPL three tons of ammo, its one of the best medium brawler the IS has, 106kph with the Wang out. Mine I swapped down the MPLs to mlas for CW and use it there to, expend all 5 tons of ammo punch out and back to the next mech. Its awesome.

kind of funny, you can run that build on adder... well with only 2 tonnes of ammo though (if we put 4 tonnes of armor, lb-20x and 2 mpl, generally it has 6 tonnes with the gun and lasers without armor and ammo free, yen with xl300 has 11.5)

Edited by bad arcade kitty, 12 April 2015 - 07:37 AM.

[Metus regem]

sneeking, on 12 April 2015 - 07:20 AM, said:

Except I never put one on it lol...

I don't use this phrase often, but in this case, I'll make an exception....

You're doing it wrong

Having an AC20 on a Centurion is like.... Well its like finding the perfect girl (or man if that's your thing) and they are into you too....

[Yokaiko]

bad arcade kitty, on 12 April 2015 - 07:31 AM, said:

kind of funny, you can run that build on adder... well with only 2.5 tonnes of ammo though (if we put the same 3 tonnes of armor, lb-20x and 2 mpl)

Yeah but its 50 ton armor vs 35 ton armor.

.....and I'll take the IS AC any day.

[Ultimax]

Mcgral18, on 11 April 2015 - 11:41 PM, said:

Name each pay only variant that is better.


Dragon Slayer? Misery?
Ember isn't that robot anymore.


PGI has done a pretty good job on keeping them in line. One isn't obnoxiously better than anything you can buy with Cbills.

I'd also say that the DS and Misery are not pay to win either.


Neither of them is clearly better than other variants in the current game - and there are other mechs in the game that are easily as good or significantly better.

[bad arcade kitty]

Yokaiko, on 12 April 2015 - 07:33 AM, said:

Yeah but its 50 ton armor vs 35 ton armor.

.....and I'll take the IS AC any day.

eh, you quoted the version with wrong numbers before i fixed them, it's 3+3 = 6 free tonns my smurfy had some unstripped armor and i misread the post too

adder obviously has both low ammo and low armor, but still, a light mech with lb20 is fascinating imo :3

especially if we change mpl to med lasers adder will get 2 tonnes for armor and ammo too

Edited by bad arcade kitty, 12 April 2015 - 07:47 AM.

[990Dreams]

MessyBopzz, on 11 April 2015 - 11:36 PM, said:

If I cannot access certain variants that have different hardpoint loadout capabilities unless I pay money, that is called pay to win.

Hero Mechs and Clan Omnipods are the only things worth buying. But none of them guarantee you a win. You can take down any Mech with special Omnipods or HP loadouts the same way you can take down any Mech that is standard.

Just because you are incapable of beating something that other people bought doesn't mean it's pay to win. It means that (bluntly speaking here) you are too weak to handle these Mechs and need to improve.

[WonderSparks]

MessyBopzz, on 12 April 2015 - 12:41 AM, said:

... a spider mech with 2 er large lazers on its chest, an AC2 and a machine gun? ...

I know others have poked at this already, but...
Too much weight, too much space. There is no way you can fit two Inner Sphere (ER) Large Lasers in the center torso of any 'Mech in MWO. Not going to happen. And the combined weight of those and your (largely useless) AC/2 is just too much for a Spider to handle with any level of viability. (I know, I bought a SDR-5K back when I was a newcomer and put a STD 100 and an AC/2 on it. Rough times indeed )

Again, using Smurfy (as has also already been pointed out to you) will allow you to put together builds before actually throwing your C-bills at it in the commitment of purchase. _{It will also allow you to see that I am right about trying to cram two LL into a CT.}


And as far as MWO being P2W, I do not personally believe this to be true. At all.
In my two year experience of MWO, the only real money I have spent has generally been for early access 'Mech Packs, with a rising number of Hero purchases as well (and I can assure you, these do not magically grant me a win every game; my Grid Iron actually has a below-zero W/L ratio, and my Misery only has such high stats because I have used it since it was first released).
None of the money I spent felt like it was making me win more. Because it was not. If anything, my familiarity with certain chassis and weapon systems was making the difference.



tl;dr
"P2W" is not a title that fits in MWO. Either deal with the slow grind to gather C-bills (learning as you go to help reduce the amount of dying you do and increase the amount of killing you do), or shut your trap, pack up and go home. Sorry to be blunt and rude, but face facts, the game is what it is.