171 replies to this topic

[Thunderchickenz]

Quirks that differentiate a chassis enough to make it feel different, and viable, rather than just being a few percentage points that are difficult to consciously notice. Quirks that have tradeoffs (eg: glass cannon quirks). And no, they do not need to be weapon specific (though these ones are); they could be broadened to weapon-type specific without problem.

HBK-4J - LRM ROF
BJ-1DC - AC ROF pre-nerf :-(
DRG-1N - AC ROF
RVN-2X - Laser Duration
Huginn - SRM ROF

etc. These hit a sweet spot of taking a variant and making it competitive but not unbalanced, and creating niche gameplay styles.

Edited by Thunderchickenz, 22 April 2015 - 10:24 AM.

[Mike Forst]

Hello everyone. Thanks for your replies!

I will be reviewing this thread later today and gathering feedback info.

[Tarogato]

• Ravens: I feel like they're in a good place now. The 2X and Huginn are both beastly, and the 3L is great, but not automatically the best simply because it has ECM. Also, Ravens are balanced with Firestarters as the best lights in the game right now. I think that's the right way to do things, even though I do think Firestarters are a hair too strong and set the bar too high - kinda invalidating other light mech options. The 4X falls behind a little because it doesn't have a niche, but I don't think it's a game breaker. If I could have it my way, I'd give the 4X some mobility quirks to make up for its lack of firepower and synergise with its jumpjets.

• The old LPL Wolverine 6K: I wish it could have that old quirk as well as the new LL quirk so that you could have the option to choose between the two. Perhaps general energy quirks that give it the best of both worlds. Also, Wolverines in general are pretty balanced right now and I'm very happy with them.

• Thunderbolts: all the variants are balanced pretty well among themselves right now, which I think is the perfect first step. The next step is balancing the chassis as a whole against other chassis - in which case I find all the quirks on the Thunderbolts across the board to be between 2% and 5% too strong. They're kinda the default IS heavy mech right now and I think that's because they're just so strong. I do like how they're quirked for the most part, but I do kinda wish they had more build options. It's sad that the TDR-5SS has only one really viable loadout.

And for the record, my favourite quirks are general quirks. I feel like too much emphasis is put on individual weapon systems and that limits the variety considerably. I'd prefer if almost all quirks had closer to an 80/20 ratio rather than 50/50 ratio between specific weapon quirk and general weapon quirk. That way you can buff a chassis or variant without limiting its build options, and you can put emphasis on a specific weapon without making that weapon become the only viable option to take.

Edited by Tarogato, 22 April 2015 - 11:46 AM.

[STEF_]

Locust 1E.
Uber quirked, and a brainless relaxing mech.
I use it to relax, couple of k, 3-400 dmg.

Fun

But a little strange that a 20 tonner can do all that mess

[Ghoja]

Most of the non-weapon related quirks are good.

[Mcgral18]

Heat generation and armour (not Structure) would be my favourites.


One I would suggest is Heat Dissipation quirks. The Pre Quirkening Awesome had a 10% boost (for a total of 25% bonus dissipation), although I'm not aware of a single mech that has had a Heat Dissipation quirk since the Quirkening.


I would suggest all Sub-250 engine mechs get it to various degrees, since they miss out on TrueDubs.

[Kageru Ikazuchi]

Good quirks ... use subtle buffs to bring a crappy 'mech up to par, enhance the purpose of the 'mech ("it was designed to ..."), and slightly differentiate it from similar variants without making it a "one-trick pony".

Bad quirks ... buff one thing too much and make a previously crappy 'mech a "one trick pony" that is only brought because it uses one weapon better than anything else ... see the other thread ...

[PremithiumX]

I absolutely love love love that you've introduced LBX spread quirks, though I think 10% still isn't enough.

Edit: I would also love to see more maneuverability and survivability quirks for mechs in place of weapon quirks.

Edited by PremithiumX, 22 April 2015 - 11:44 PM.

[Ragnahawk]

You should definitely give streak crow +50% cooldown on Streak SRM 6

[Fire for Effect]

Good quirks are

- anything that increases mobility; any tank is more agile than the socalled kings of the battlefield with lights the only exception

- anything lowers the absurd heat generated by lasers

- anything that lowers the obscene beam duration of laser weapons.

[Duke Nedo]

Tina Benoit, on 20 April 2015 - 10:12 AM, said:

Hello MechWarriors!

Those of you who listened to the Town Hall on April 16th may remember the discussions regarding the Quirks!

This thread is to hear out your feedback regarding your most favorite Quirks, the ones you don't want to change!

I appreciate quirks that niche mechs, that's how I think they should be used!

1. Huginn. Excellent quirks for a useless mech. It does not in any way OP the Huginn, it will always be a short range, large legged ammo dependent non-pinpoint mech, but now it has a role as an Assault slaying backstabber. That makes it incredibly fun to play! And if anyone complains that it kills an Assault too quickly from behind, that is not really true. A FS9-S would have done it quicker, while taking less return damage and used no ammo.

2. DRG-1N. Same here, these quirks while ridiculously strong, are still not enough to OP the mech since it fully relies on a low slung right arm, and the fast firing rate makes it impossible to twist and spread damage (protect your arm) while dealing dps. If ignored it can and will wreck havoc, but if taken seriously it's not really a threat. Nice niche, fun to play, not frustrating to face. The AC/2 DRG-5N is envious and the Flame is pissed off.

3. AWS-9M. It's still underwhelming, but it does feel like an Awesome with these triple ERPPCs. Play it from time to time because of this.

[Maxx Blue]

Hmm...In general I would say Internal Structure and Armor buffs are my favorite. These are a flat-out awesome way to help compensate for mech hitbox and geometry differences. I'm not just saying that because a HBK-4G was my first mech either!

Aside from that, I find weapon cooldown and PPC speed buffs to be highly effective when it comes to imporving some mechs with odd or limited hardpoints.

[Telmasa]

Duke Nedo, on 27 April 2015 - 04:29 AM, said:

I appreciate quirks that niche mechs, that's how I think they should be used!

1. Huginn. Excellent quirks for a useless mech. It does not in any way OP the Huginn, it will always be a short range, large legged ammo dependent non-pinpoint mech, but now it has a role as an Assault slaying backstabber. That makes it incredibly fun to play! And if anyone complains that it kills an Assault too quickly from behind, that is not really true. A FS9-S would have done it quicker, while taking less return damage and used no ammo.

2. DRG-1N. Same here, these quirks while ridiculously strong, are still not enough to OP the mech since it fully relies on a low slung right arm, and the fast firing rate makes it impossible to twist and spread damage (protect your arm) while dealing dps. If ignored it can and will wreck havoc, but if taken seriously it's not really a threat. Nice niche, fun to play, not frustrating to face. The AC/2 DRG-5N is envious and the Flame is pissed off.

3. AWS-9M. It's still underwhelming, but it does feel like an Awesome with these triple ERPPCs. Play it from time to time because of this.

I just have to disagree about the Huginn & Dragon-1N.

Huginn & Dragon-1N are achieving completely absurd amounts of max & sustained DPS with only half the weaponry normally necessary to see such high numbers. The hardpoints don't really matter if you can win in a trade against every other mech in the game...and remember that this is a 12v12 game, currently, so it's quite often you're able to pump out that damage relatively unscathed while the enemy is distracted.

Putting this in perspective, the Dragon-1N, with quirks, has the same DPS - both max and sustained - as a full 6xAC/5 Dire Wolf.

It has so much DPS that it can actually out-alpha most 'average' alpha builds.

It's also the same reason the Grid Iron is now the go-to hero mech...firing a Gauss rifle like it's an AC-5 is insane. A mech half the weight of the King Crab is able to trade evenly with that King Crab. It's able to win 1v1 against many assault mechs, at any range.

That's just too much, no matter what other attributes of the mech. If it needs that much buffing, put the buffs in other areas besides the weapon cooldown.

Edited by Telmasa, 27 April 2015 - 05:56 PM.

[happy mech]

Mike Forst, on 22 April 2015 - 11:09 AM, said:

Hello everyone. Thanks for your replies!

I will be reviewing this thread later today and gathering feedback info.

hello Mike, may i ask, are you looking into changing the system underlying the quirks too?
for example naturally balance the clan mechs themselves by unlocking all heatsinks and jumpjets and allowing to use or not use upgrades (in preset slots)
this will make all clan mechs more powerful and closer to how scr, tbr and dwf are
you already try to balance the game 1:1 clan vs IS (which i like), so sticking to lore makes no sense here

another thing is super high alphas, try the fixed heat cap (like 30, 3 ppcs or 2 erppcs, or even lower) and see how it works, this will make mechs that were built for sustained damage or have horrible hitboxes and mobility (vindicator, dragon, ctf, orion, awesome, hgn, atlas) useful even without quirks

also, engine and non-engine heatsinks need to have same dissipation (for example 1.7, 20 dhs would stay the same, less would be weaker, more would be stronger)

there must be a reason to take some backup small lasers, or even medium lasers in case of IS (because ll is more heat efficient than ml), the laser heat/damage/duration numbers should present the sl as best option for the heat, ml as so-so for skirmishing (try to reduce ml+mpl heat to 3.5 so it is better than ll and somewhere between clan sl and clan ml), ll for long range support (more heat than ml), erll only for long range
the clans have lighter lasers with more range, the heat cost and duration needs to be way higher, but high heat cap is the reason why people boat, nobody would equip 5 ml + 2 lpl if can only fire half of it at once

so, in short, unlock clan equipment, allow clan upgrades endo/ff on/off, get fixed heat cap, make IS ml better than ll, make clan normal acs useful -> achieve diversity in builds and mechs seen on battlefield, then, quirks

edited

Edited by happy mech, 28 April 2015 - 12:26 AM.

[B0oN]

My most favorite quirks ?

None .
I liked the mechs more before that silly quirking shenanigans became FOTM .

Counterproposal placed here since it might get some attention from the eggheads at PGI :

Make an internal build in which you cut out all clan weapons and replace them with IS weaponry, IS chassis get all their quirks removed.
Then let´s see (and way more important) AND LET US know how THAT goes .

Edited by Rad Hanzo, 28 April 2015 - 12:59 AM.

[Lily from animove]

The Great Unwashed, on 21 April 2015 - 05:17 AM, said:

I prefer the armor, structure and movement quirks because they make sense. I do not understand why a Gauss rifle suddenly reloads twice as fast when it is in a Grid Iron, why the shell fired from an AC goes faster when mounted on a Dragon, and why some lasers fire further in a Stalker. How does the weapon know?

I understand that an arm with 1B slot might give a better reload than an arm with 2B slots because it has some better ammo supply or somesuch McGuffin reason, why some slots have better integrated cooling or better recharge with better power mains and so forth to reduce the Guass charge or energy cooling. But when a quirk is well over 10% then I image what idiot (in the MWO universe that is) designed a mech that does not take that advantage into account. I understand no ghost heat for 3 ERPPCs for the Awesome because it was built around these weapons and a light mech was not. And so forth.

So basically, I dislike some quirks for the same reason I dislike Ghost heat; it is an ad-hoc mechanism that does not make sense and is for some reason trying to patch up a problem that very well might have been solved differently.

Well if you need an explanation for this, the lore knows different manufactirers, and especially on battlemechs, the unique manufacturer in conunction with the emchs variant may allow faster reload mechanics, ot a special barrel allowing the the bullet to be faster.

But honestly, your first mentioned quirks are "more simple" because these individual weapon quirks makes getting used to a mech way harder for new players and average users. And so the same weapons acts differently on different mechs, which these players may not understand.

[John McHobo]

Quirks I like:

-The acceleration quirks an all the Locusts. Its the saving grace on an insanely fragile mech.

-The durability quirks on all the Dragons. Everyone focuses on the 1N´s AC5 quirks, but I used Dragons before quirks and the terrible hitboxes made it one of the squishiest heavies I have ever seen.getting 12 SPs on its giant CT and 6 SP´s on its most important arm was a huge boost.

-Mobility and agility quirks on the Highlanders. If you go for Jumpjets you cripple your firepower, so the mech should at least be mobile. Its height makes it stand out quite a lot in firefights and extra toughness makes a retreat via JJs actually possible. The new quirks help it greatly in that role.

Edited by John McHobo, 28 April 2015 - 08:34 AM.

[Mazzyplz]

all the quirks are terrible.
the dragon kinda needs his quirks but i am not sure it needs what it has right now.


the awesome has terrible quirks it needs more quirks, first you give it some ok quirks and everyone is happy and then you troll the community by giving the thunderbolt insane quirks that make the awesome obsolete. mission: FAIL!!!

[Johnny Z]

Did I miss out?

Best quirks are for anything Large energy. Clan mechs so fast they are tough to hit with ballistics not to mention the other draw backs of ballistics.

[MysticLink]

I really enjoy the Dragon 1n quirk. It's fun. Please don't nerf, I haven't played that much games with it. I think this makes a dragon a viable mech while dragons were pretty much a joke before that. So please keep it as is.