292 replies to this topic

[FupDup]

Phra, on 26 April 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:

It still won't be able to hold a candle to the FS9, pretty sure I'll be sticking to my KFX for CW. The Shadow Cat will suffer for the same reason

The Cheetah will roflstomp the Firestarter at long-range due to having very high torso hardpoints, Clan ER lasers, and ECM. At medium range, the Cheetah will have a moderate advantage due primarily to the CERML, and ECM helps a bit here.

The real question is how the Cheetah will stack up against the Firestarter at short range. It could go either way really. On one hand, the Firestarter has a little bit more armor and internal structure, along with some various quirks (such as heat reduction). On the other hand, the Cheetah can survive a side torso loss and possibly pack a larger alpha (depending on weapon/Omnipod choice).

What's certain is that the Arctic Cheetah absolutely, positively, will outclass all other Clan lights and the majority of IS lights quite handily. The *possible* exception is that some IS lights might be able to match or somewhat surpass it in brawls. It will be a very good gundam either way.


The Scat won't quite rule the medium class (most likely), but it will likely be a decent/effective robot. Dem high hardpoints are nice, especially when using something like 2 CLPL or whatever. You can do a "Clan Arrow" with 2 ERLL/LPL and 6 MGs for fun, or go with ECM for sneaky sneaking.

[Zibmo]

Andi Nagasia, on 25 April 2015 - 09:42 PM, said:

true but right now the problem isnt Variety, but Viability,
if people could run NVAs SMNs and GARs you would see more of them in CW,
but when the SCR and TBR are the only truly Viable Mechs for Clans, you take them,

Loosely translated that means "but when the SCR and TBR are the most clearly superior mechs for either Clan or Inner Sphere". It is tiresome to keep hearing "but the others are SO BAD" when, in fact (having both sets), the less desired Clan mechs are no more gimp than most IS chassis. The SCR, TBR (and DW) are so far superior that Clan have gotten spoiled by them.

I play my Summoners all the time. Just started leveling my Gargles.

[Chrome Magnus]

"I'm sticking with my guns on this one. The beam duration is too long." For me only the CERL falls into this category. I would love to see it dropped by a tenth or two.

I'm running the event on my alt account and only had an unskilled MD prime (added a HB) to stack onto 3 trials. Those trials are a drag but even they are serviceable. Of course I have plenty clanners on my other account and most work very well. I have to laugh at folks pretending the IS flat out outclasses them or that clans only have 2 or 3 good mechs. I do agree there are some, like the Garg, that need love. Just can't pack enough ammo on that thing...

Also, quirks are not stupid as they allow a great level of fine tuning. It's that so many mechs need such big quirks that shows an issue. They should only need to be like 5-15% or so.

Edited by Chrome Magnus, 26 April 2015 - 05:36 PM.

[Mirumoto Izanami]

Phra, on 26 April 2015 - 04:47 PM, said:

It still won't be able to hold a candle to the FS9, pretty sure I'll be sticking to my KFX for CW.

[Phra]

FupDup, on 26 April 2015 - 04:57 PM, said:

The Cheetah will roflstomp the Firestarter at long-range due to having very high torso hardpoints, Clan ER lasers, and ECM. At medium range, the Cheetah will have a moderate advantage due primarily to the CERML, and ECM helps a bit here.

The real question is how the Cheetah will stack up against the Firestarter at short range. It could go either way really. On one hand, the Firestarter has a little bit more armor and internal structure, along with some various quirks (such as heat reduction). On the other hand, the Cheetah can survive a side torso loss and possibly pack a larger alpha (depending on weapon/Omnipod choice).

What's certain is that the Arctic Cheetah absolutely, positively, will outclass all other Clan lights and the majority of IS lights quite handily. The *possible* exception is that some IS lights might be able to match or somewhat surpass it in brawls. It will be a very good gundam either way.


The Scat won't quite rule the medium class (most likely), but it will likely be a decent/effective robot. Dem high hardpoints are nice, especially when using something like 2 CLPL or whatever. You can do a "Clan Arrow" with 2 ERLL/LPL and 6 MGs for fun, or go with ECM for sneaky sneaking.

You do realize that the Cheetah gives up a whopping 6 tons to the Fox right? It simply won't have the free tonnage to keep any kind of relevant energy build cool enough.

Edited by Phra, 26 April 2015 - 06:19 PM.

[Adiuvo]

Phra, on 26 April 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

You do realize that the Cheetah gives up a whopping 6 tons to the Fox right? It simply won't have the free tonnage to keep any kind of relevant energy build cool enough.

5ERMLs, ECM, rest in DHS is cool enough.

There are also smalls builds you can play around with.

[FupDup]

Phra, on 26 April 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

You do realize that the Cheetah gives up a whopping 6 tons to the Fox right? It simply won't have the free tonnage to keep any kind of relevant energy build cool enough.

In exchange, it moves at the speed of a light mech instead of a medium mech, while still being able to pack a respectable payload with weight-efficient energy weapons.

Also, probably better hitboxes (humanoid) and higher hardpoints. Might also be scaled more like a light instead of a medium that hasn't hit puberty yet.

Edited by FupDup, 26 April 2015 - 06:25 PM.

[One Medic Army]

FupDup, on 26 April 2015 - 04:57 PM, said:

The Cheetah will roflstomp the Firestarter at long-range due to having very high torso hardpoints, Clan ER lasers, and ECM. At medium range, the Cheetah will have a moderate advantage due primarily to the CERML, and ECM helps a bit here.

The real question is how the Cheetah will stack up against the Firestarter at short range. It could go either way really. On one hand, the Firestarter has a little bit more armor and internal structure, along with some various quirks (such as heat reduction). On the other hand, the Cheetah can survive a side torso loss and possibly pack a larger alpha (depending on weapon/Omnipod choice).

What's certain is that the Arctic Cheetah absolutely, positively, will outclass all other Clan lights and the majority of IS lights quite handily. The *possible* exception is that some IS lights might be able to match or somewhat surpass it in brawls. It will be a very good gundam either way.


The Scat won't quite rule the medium class (most likely), but it will likely be a decent/effective robot. Dem high hardpoints are nice, especially when using something like 2 CLPL or whatever. You can do a "Clan Arrow" with 2 ERLL/LPL and 6 MGs for fun, or go with ECM for sneaky sneaking.

I'm going to venture that the firestarter will crap on the Cheetah in a close-up brawl. The Firestarter is faster, and ought to have better DPS due to shorter range and much cooler weapons. The Cheetah may survive a side-torso loss, but most light-v-light fights end in legging, at which point the Cheetah has the weaker legs.

Now, this is part of why I'm thinking of shoving a SSRM6 or a pair of SRM4s on my Cheetah, to give it a bit more close-in punch, and hopefully make some of the FS pilots run away rather than fighting and getting beaten up. And of course, if they run that clan range advantage lets you keep shooting them for quite a while.

[FupDup]

One Medic Army, on 26 April 2015 - 06:30 PM, said:

I'm going to venture that the firestarter will crap on the Cheetah in a close-up brawl. The Firestarter is faster, and ought to have better DPS due to shorter range and much cooler weapons. The Cheetah may survive a side-torso loss, but most light-v-light fights end in legging, at which point the Cheetah has the weaker legs.

Now, this is part of why I'm thinking of shoving a SSRM6 or a pair of SRM4s on my Cheetah, to give it a bit more close-in punch, and hopefully make some of the FS pilots run away rather than fighting and getting beaten up. And of course, if they run that clan range advantage lets you keep shooting them for quite a while.

I don't think the speed will be a big factor between the two, given that the Cheetah is 140.2 and the Firestarter is about 150.

For Streaks, I don't think they'd be a very good choice for the Cheetah because you've got 8 tons to spend. Even with Clan's lighter Streaks, you'll run out of pod space quickly (especially with ammo and BAP considerations). Laser vomit will be the best way to make use of that 8 tons, maybe with some occasional regular SRMs thrown in.

[ShinVector]

Adiuvo, on 26 April 2015 - 06:20 PM, said:

5ERMLs, ECM, rest in DHS is cool enough.

There are also smalls builds you can play around with.

Long duration ERMLS with Borked Lasers HSR is going to put-off high ping players though.
Hope PGI will fix that scrap at some point.

[FupDup]

ShinVector, on 26 April 2015 - 06:52 PM, said:

Long duration ERMLS with Borked Lasers HSR is going to put-off high ping players though.
Hope PGI will fix that scrap at some point.

The ERML has a duration of 1.15 seconds. Not really a big deal.

The only Clan laser that can situationally be disadvantaged by duration is the CERLL, which is a niche gun as a result (specialized uber-range sniper gun, sub-par in close range).

Edited by FupDup, 26 April 2015 - 06:54 PM.

[ShinVector]

FupDup, on 26 April 2015 - 06:54 PM, said:

The ERML has a duration of 1.15 seconds. Not really a big deal.

The only Clan laser that can situationally be disadvantaged by duration is the CERLL, which is a niche gun as a result (specialized uber-range sniper gun, sub-par in close range).

Huge... Deal... I repeat.. High Ping Player.. I repeat again High Ping Player...
The longer the duration the harder it is for us to deal damage...

It is just hard to deal damage at high ping because you use supposed to hit invisible mechs that are in the future, from high pingers perspective.

[FupDup]

ShinVector, on 26 April 2015 - 07:02 PM, said:

Huge... Deal... I repeat.. High Ping Player.. I repeat again High Ping Player...
The longer the duration the harder it is for us to deal damage...

It is just hard to deal damage at high ping because you use supposed to hit invisible mechs that are in the future, from high pingers perspective.

That's not a probably with the gun, that's a problem with the player who has the high ping. Whether it's a poopy ISP, or you live far away from PGI's servers, or play on a potato, or whatever else, it's not the weapon's fault.

[Mcgral18]

Phra, on 26 April 2015 - 06:18 PM, said:

You do realize that the Cheetah gives up a whopping 6 tons to the Fox right? It simply won't have the free tonnage to keep any kind of relevant energy build cool enough.

It also gains 2 TrueDubs over the Cute Fox, which means it saves nearly two tons worth of PoorDub DHS.


Larger engines allow for that.


5 ERMLs...seems awfully hot. 30 heat.

[ShinVector]

FupDup, on 26 April 2015 - 07:03 PM, said:

That's not a probably with the gun, that's a problem with the player who has the high ping. Whether it's a poopy ISP, or you live far away from PGI's servers, or play on a potato, or whatever else, it's not the weapon's fault.

Just saying... High ping players will have worst experience with high duration lasers versus short duration lasers. And I already said the fault does lie with the weapon.... Its broken PGI broken Lasers HSR netcode.

[Ace Selin]

OP is awful at piloting Clan mechs... i hear you OP (get better)

[Mcgral18]

Ace Selin, on 26 April 2015 - 07:41 PM, said:

OP is awful at piloting Clan mechs... i hear you OP (get better)

Or he uses more than 4 of them.


That's another option.

[Fate 6]

Zibmo, on 26 April 2015 - 05:22 PM, said:

Loosely translated that means "but when the SCR and TBR are the most clearly superior mechs for either Clan or Inner Sphere". It is tiresome to keep hearing "but the others are SO BAD" when, in fact (having both sets), the less desired Clan mechs are no more gimp than most IS chassis. The SCR, TBR (and DW) are so far superior that Clan have gotten spoiled by them.

I play my Summoners all the time. Just started leveling my Gargles.

^
I've been playing a lot of the "worse" Clan mechs lately (Ice Ferret, Nova, Warhawk) and they are, at the very least, on par with most IS mechs. The Ice Ferret is on par with similar IS mechs such as the Raven-2x and flat out better than the Cicada in every way - basically it's a decent mech but it's niche since it takes up a medium slot. Tonnage-wise it's solid. The Nova is comparable to every IS medium with JJs (non-missile ones of course) or better. The Warhawk is better than every IS assault except for the Stalker-4N and Crab (and if the Crab were 85 tons it would be even or in favor of the Warhawk).

The only Clan mechs that truly are bad are the lights. RIP Adder.

[DrunkenAntichrist]

Warning: Anecdote ahead, steer clear!

So, the Nova doesn't seem too terrible to me. I managed to successfully brawl an Atlas DDC solo (mind he left me cored the hell out enough for a fly with a bad cough to end me) but that could always mean I am awesome or he was awful. Either way. But all in all, played right, the Nova seems fine. It's not a stand up and tank the team mech, it's a knife-fighting spec-ops minus the stealth. Slip in, take out the last guy in line, run away, repeat.

[Phra]

Adiuvo, on 26 April 2015 - 06:20 PM, said:

5ERMLs, ECM, rest in DHS is cool enough.

There are also smalls builds you can play around with.

Can do 4 at 40% heat eff, or 2 LL at 41%, nothing more.

It's gonna be a solid mech for soloq, but in CW heat efficient pokey pokey is more important than speed, especially when the FS9 will destroy it either way in a light rush.

So if I need a 35 filler, I will still bring the KFX.

Edited by Phra, 27 April 2015 - 03:31 AM.