139 replies to this topic

[Rejarial Galatan]

Ok. Before you get all jumpy. Take note of something. I have not been here for more than 2 years now. I left because things started to look like pay to win. I have a simple question, but first, a simple statement.

One of the core pillars that were sold to us back when becoming a founder was a thing as was closed beta was this: pilot skill will determine who wins, not how much real world money he or she has put into it.

I am seeing sooo many hero/champion mechs, I cannot stop myself from thinking that this went from the above to a pay to win style game. am i just misreading stuff or is it really pay to win?

Edited by Rejarial Galatan, 04 May 2015 - 10:12 PM.

[Sergeant Random]

There is a customization limit. No matter how much you spend: The hitpoints on any one mech does not increase beyond certain values per weight class. Tonnage limits are still tonnage limits.

People often conclude it is more like pay for early access.

[Wraith 1]

They just had a massive sale on heroes and champions. People want to play with their new toys.

And no, there aren't any hero mechs that are currently considered best in class. Champion mechs are functionally identical to standard variants.

[Corbenik]

Rejarial Galatan, on 04 May 2015 - 10:11 PM, said:

Ok. Before you get all jumpy. Take note of something. I have not been here for more than 2 years now. I left because things started to look like pay to win. I have a simple question, but first, a simple statement.

One of the core pillars that were sold to us back when becoming a founder was a thing as was closed beta was this: pilot skill will determine who wins, not how much real world money he or she has put into it.

I am seeing sooo many hero/champion mechs, I cannot stop myself from thinking that this went from the above to a pay to win style game. am i just misreading stuff or is it really pay to win?

Why not just do yourself a favor and play for yourself since in the end it is only you who can determine a mechs viability even if you pay hard cash for a mech or only cbills, the machine is only as good as its pilot. and man ive seen some people in preordered mechs that are terrible and some that are good. I see alot of people running chassis that anyone can buy be awesome, or plain terrible.

[Kiiyor]

Wraith 1, on 04 May 2015 - 10:24 PM, said:

They just had a massive sale on heroes and champions. People want to play with their new toys.

And no, there aren't any hero mechs that are currently considered best in class. Champion mechs are functionally identical to standard variants.

^ This.

Any decent performing hero mechs are edge cases; like the (******* ZOMG WHY ARE THERE BITE MARKS IN MY KEYBOARD) Huggin at super close range (if you're in an assault).

Also, there are no hero mechs available that can remotely compete with the top meta. The Misery is a good performer, but the 4N outdoes it IMHO.

[MikeBend]

Hero mechs, lol. Pay2win marvels like Hellslinger, Pretty Baby, Loup de Guerre or St. Ives Blues. There maybe are a couple decent heroes like Grid Iron or Misery, but thats more of an exception to the general rule.

[Vassago Rain]

The game's so P2W, PGI didn't think twice before they paywalled clans for 6 months.

People will argue that b-b-b-but that was last year!

Doesn't change anything. Once you go P2W, you never go back. Your reputation's tarnished forever. Now we get paywalled robots with premium abilities in the cash shop.

Edit: I see above people already forgot the poptart wars, and how uber the dragonslayer was. Let's not forget the ember, either.

Edited by Vassago Rain, 04 May 2015 - 10:39 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Currently, the best mechs in the game are available for C-bills, therefore you can win for free.

[Rejarial Galatan]

ive played a few matches since my return, even managed a kill as rusty as i am. but, its the echoes of this games past that are screaming loudest. So, if what ive read so far, it is, but it is not pay to win. sounds like its a twisted skill means more. guess ill need to lurk around some more.

[o0Marduk0o]

Vassago Rain, on 04 May 2015 - 10:36 PM, said:

The game's so P2W, PGI didn't think twice before they paywalled clans for 6 months.

People will argue that b-b-b-but that was last year!

Doesn't change anything. Once you go P2W, you never go back. Your reputation's tarnished forever. Now we get paywalled robots with premium abilities in the cash shop.

Edit: I see above people already forgot the poptart wars, and how uber the dragonslayer was. Let's not forget the ember, either.

So you admit that you had no chance against those mechs when they were released on early-access? This is what you are saying, when using the term P2W.

Edited by o0Marduk0o, 04 May 2015 - 10:46 PM.

[Vassago Rain]

o0Marduk0o, on 04 May 2015 - 10:46 PM, said:

So you admit that you had no chance against those mechs when they were released on early-access? This is what you are saying, when using the term P2W.

Clan paywalling was the primary reason I barely played back then, yes.

No, P2W doesn't mean that you instantly lose. It means you can buy power, which is what they were. Stop pretending you're too dense to grasp what terms mean. MWO took a huge blow when they went with P2W clans hidden behind a 6 month paywall, and they've yet to recover from it.

I can't see them ever recovering from it. The game was already infamous for being grindy and expensive without 240 dollar grab deal packs, and clans only in the hands of paying players. It was nice of PGI to nerf them as they released for c-bills, though. Great touch.

[Sergeant Random]

You don't need to pay to stick with the attack blob of blue team. Don't need to pay to avoid face tanking a firing line. Don't need to pay to be aware of possible lrm arcs.

So, I don't think it's pay to win... Just takes a while to absorb.

[odiemoncrew]

Sergeant Random, on 04 May 2015 - 10:59 PM, said:

You don't need to pay to stick with the attack blob of blue team. Don't need to pay to avoid face tanking a firing line. Don't need to pay to be aware of possible lrm arcs.

So, I don't think it's pay to win... Just takes a while to absorb.

I don't know what "magical" Elo that you are at or what drugs you are on, But it is still a bit Pay to win, or at the very least Play to learn, when a lot of people from the U.S.A. are still up and playing

[o0Marduk0o]

Funny that 240$ itself is a lot but for 24 mechs + bays + premium + other small content it is a pretty good deal. Wondering where you see the cash grab.

It is grind, when you expect to have every mech within a short time frame. Someone who plays once a week should play something else and no f2p game or spent money for mechs. f2p is all about getting things faster with money.

Concerning nerfing released mechs... I can't express how dumb this comment is. You don't buy a certain power itself, you only buy a mech. Balancing is to be expected.

[Sergeant Random]

odiemoncrew, on 04 May 2015 - 11:09 PM, said:

I don't know what "magical" Elo that you are at or what drugs you are on, But it is still a bit Pay to win, or at the very least Play to learn, when a lot of people from the U.S.A. are still up and playing

Mostly I go by sheer dumb luck.

As for drugs, there is serotonin and dopamine (natural neuro transmitters). So you may call me a natural loon, fellow adrenaline junkie.

[Corrado]

even clan tech is not even pay to win. it's pay to early access in the worst case.

[MechWarrior414712]

Grid iron is the best hunchback. This isn't pay 2 win?

[Parnage Winters]

Corrado, on 05 May 2015 - 12:10 AM, said:

even clan tech is not even pay to win. it's pay to early access in the worst case.

There is a reason people think early access is bad..because it is.

Early access for months at a time. It sucks. It's a bad model for consumers and they need to drop it. No matter how you look at it it's allowing people to have mechs the primary point of the game before anyone else for an extended period of time is selling power. I could live with the one-two week style of first for mc then for credits, but frankly it's insane that they are still going with this 2-3 month waiting period. I've seen f2p publishers like PerfectWorld treat it's players better then that.

This is a clear left over from IGP's influence and needs to go away to something more reasonable.

[Wintersdark]

Parnage, on 05 May 2015 - 12:40 AM, said:

There is a reason people think early access is bad..because it is.

Early access for months at a time. It sucks. It's a bad model for consumers and they need to drop it. No matter how you look at it it's allowing people to have mechs the primary point of the game before anyone else for an extended period of time is selling power. I could live with the one-two week style of first for mc then for credits, but frankly it's insane that they are still going with this 2-3 month waiting period. I've seen f2p publishers like PerfectWorld treat it's players better then that.

This is a clear left over from IGP's influence and needs to go away to something more reasonable.

Why? Pay for early access isn't pay to win unless said early access mechs are objectively superior to everything else.

You could argue that this was the case on release of the clans, but is no longer. In fact, most new mechs (lol clan wave 2!) have been flat out poor to average.

If your complaint is that PGI is mistreating free players by making them wait for content that they're selling for real money but ISN'T pay to win, then you sir need to suck it up. This is a business, and mech pack releases are the primary source of income. There are about 100 mechs available for cbills now, having to wait for the newest shiny is hardly onerous.

[Wintersdark]

The Mech Daddy, on 05 May 2015 - 12:32 AM, said:

Grid iron is the best hunchback. This isn't pay 2 win?

No, because there's no Hunchback Competition. The Grid Iron may be the best hunchback (may!) But its not Tue best mech or even the best medium. As such, paying for a Grid Iron doesn't give you an edge over a free player who just bought any other good medium.