188 replies to this topic

[Kilo 40]

Nightshade24, on 16 May 2015 - 02:10 AM, said:

Why? Not much people run ballistics or missiles on either and when they do it's just a Stormcrow streak boat.

I don't really use timber wolves much anymore because I like to use LRMs. and the TW's side torsos blow out all too frequently. same with the hellbringer.

My stormcrow does really good with x2 LRM10s, x2 ERMeds and x3 SMPL though. but I guess that's just because it's OP.

[Insects]

Kilo 40, on 16 May 2015 - 01:11 AM, said:

you're not going to quirk the mist lynx into a good mech.

They are cursed with being a slow light.

But quirk them to spit out a PPC every half second without overheating and they would be gods.
They can always be made better without going so extreme.

If there was more to the game than damage scores then Lights could be more valuable in other ways without needing 8 energy hardpoints to be worthwhile.
A lot of the Module stuff could be loaded into scouting lights by default. Target info, target retention, free UAV, seismic perhaps the ability to share their seismic readings with mechs within 50m. Stuff like that, makes them a support mech teammates love to have on the team. Fix rewards so they arent space poor for playing the support roll.

[KuroNyra]

Evan20k, on 15 May 2015 - 08:45 PM, said:

Only viable? I dunno what game you've been playing. The HBR/WHK are both exceptional mechs and that's before we even talk about the mighty DWF. The Gargoyle also silently became the best 80 tonner with quirks.

Viable in CW he means.

Against Thunderbolts and Stalker, a Dire Wolf isn't viable. A Hellbringer is only saved by his ECM.
Let's not talk about the Lights Clans Mech it's bad to laught at person with handicap.
Nova is far from being a real threat.
Gargoyle is 5ton more than a Timber Wolf and can do less.
A Warhawk generate too much heat and won't last long.

So yeah, only the Timber Wolf and the Stormcrow are viable atm in the CW.

Adiuvo, on 15 May 2015 - 11:37 PM, said:

You're correct, but that they've taken so long to do anything, and that they still haven't touched the Daishi, is cause for little kudos.

Maybe because the Dire Wolf is completly fine? Powerful without being completly broken?

It has the weaponry he was supposed to get.
He is slow has hell, meaning he can't get quickly to cover.
It's a big fat target and you have to be blind to miss it.
He got like most of the LCnas mechs half his firepower in each arm. Meaning an armless Dire Wolf is Harmless.


And you have to be stupid to face on a Dire Wolf then dare to cry about that mech.

joelmuzz, on 16 May 2015 - 12:49 AM, said:

They are only crappy compared to SC and TW and the quirked IS mechs.

No, they are crappy even against mech like the Urbanmech or the Orion.
But of course you need to play them to see that, something you are not doing of course.

Edited by KuroNyra, 16 May 2015 - 02:44 AM.

[KinLuu]

KuroNyra, on 16 May 2015 - 02:36 AM, said:

He got like most of the LCnas mechs half his firepower in each arm. Meaning an armless Dire Wolf is Harmless.

Uh... that maybe was true before the S- and W-Variants were released.

[Skarlock]

KuroNyra, on 16 May 2015 - 02:36 AM, said:

Maybe because the Dire Wolf is completly fine? Powerful without being completly broken?

It has the weaponry he was supposed to get.
He is slow has hell, meaning he can't get quickly to cover.
It's a big fat target and you have to be blind to miss it.
He got like most of the LCnas mechs half his firepower in each arm. Meaning an armless Dire Wolf is Harmless.


And you have to be stupid to face on a Dire Wolf then dare to cry about that mech.

I think the Dire Wolf is fine as it is with it's 84 pt (or more) precision alphas at 400 meters, and only somewhat less at longer ranges up to about 600 meters. However, why is it that *only* the dire wolf gets to take this kind of load out, and still boat 21 or 22 double heat sinks? Balance isn't just relative to game play, there's also balance relative between the various mechs. When all the top comp teams play, it's nothing but dire wolves day in and day out unless there are restrictions based on tonnage, or restrictions based on the number of clan mechs you can take that actually FORCE variety.

I think other assaults, like the king crab, the highlander, the warhawk, and the atlas need to be able to at least have something on the dire wolf that would make people actually consider them as equals, not as somewhat tougher or faster, but inferior versions of the dire wolf because the difference in firepower is so severe. I don't think nerfing the dire wolf's damage is really the answer, because if you take the damage, you rob that mech of its identity, as the offensive long or mid range powerhouse that it is. Other mechs need things that make them shine just as bright, but in different ways.

Edited by Skarlock, 16 May 2015 - 03:10 AM.

[LordNothing]

i like how they decided to nerf the next mech in my get list, the doomcrow, just when im a few million away from getting the first one. sadface.gif

Edited by LordNothing, 16 May 2015 - 03:11 AM.

[Knyx]

Just PGI digging themselves deeper in a hole by yet again listening to the forum whine for balance decisions rather then metrics (how we got most of the quirks in the first place). Heck, I don't even see Tbolt or Jager on there which is just lol.

Good thing I barely play this game anymore.

[Nightshade24]

Kilo 40, on 16 May 2015 - 02:16 AM, said:

I don't really use timber wolves much anymore because I like to use LRMs. and the TW's side torsos blow out all too frequently. same with the hellbringer.

My stormcrow does really good with x2 LRM10s, x2 ERMeds and x3 SMPL though. but I guess that's just because it's OP.

Try 4 x LRM 15 and pretend to be peter dexter (or if you really want... lower your armour a bit and have 4 x LRM 20 with a few tons of armour enough for a 1 vs 1)

Kilo 40, on 16 May 2015 - 02:12 AM, said:

never happen

I know it didn't happen yet. This is what this thread is kinda about. it's tuesday talk

[Kilo 40]

Nightshade24, on 16 May 2015 - 03:20 AM, said:

I know it didn't happen yet. This is what this thread is kinda about. it's tuesday talk

I meant it will never happen.

[Nightshade24]

Kilo 40, on 16 May 2015 - 03:23 AM, said:

I meant it will never happen.

Edited by Nightshade24, 16 May 2015 - 03:34 AM.

[Kilo 40]

Nightshade24, on 16 May 2015 - 03:32 AM, said:

[dustNbone]

It really seems like people calling for nerfs of certain mechs because of one build they saw (and probably got pwned by). I have played for quite a while (couple of years) and have never until today heard anyone say the RVN-2X is somehow OP.

Looks like someone managed to get 3LLs on it, and as an experienced Raven pilot I say "spot on" to the guy that can be successful with such a build. I'm guessing most of the people calling for it's nerf have never tried to actually pilot a build like this bordering on madness.

It's gonna be hot, slow, and have a terrifyingly small amount of armor. Skill will be required to overcome it's shortcomings and go on to be successful with it. Sure, anyone can build it, but most people wouldn't get very far trying to compete in it.

Those who can shouldn't be arbitrarily punished because of a few hurt butts.

[zeves]

you know what would fix balance in CW if it was balanced by Battlevalue instead of tonnage. would fix the balance in evrything else aswell. or atleast a good first step to normality.

BUT MATH IS HARD

Edited by zeves, 16 May 2015 - 04:05 AM.

[Johnny Z]

There are Inner Sphere mech packs for sale also. Why would they make one tech worse than another and then put them up for sale for the same relative value to C-bills. With balanced game play the game itself is better and mech pack sales and 100 other areas also.

I have no idea what these new quirks bring, guess we see today some time?

I hope the new Omni mech pack is balanced and not Op out the gate....

Oh and one last thing Wave one was OP everyone knows that and it was pay to win and any attempts at changing that have been met with cries from Man Babies since they first added heat to the CERML till now. No one will take many Clan pilots complaints seriously at this point. See what crying wolf does? Pun intended.

The tragedy in all this is the shame of being a Timberwolf pilot or Storm Crow pilot will linger on far after they are balanced, if that ever happens. The Timberwolf deserved better.

Edited by Johnny Z, 16 May 2015 - 05:25 AM.

[Nightshade24]

dustNbone, on 16 May 2015 - 03:40 AM, said:

It really seems like people calling for nerfs of certain mechs because of one build they saw (and probably got pwned by). I have played for quite a while (couple of years) and have never until today heard anyone say the RVN-2X is somehow OP.

Looks like someone managed to get 3LLs on it, and as an experienced Raven pilot I say "spot on" to the guy that can be successful with such a build. I'm guessing most of the people calling for it's nerf have never tried to actually pilot a build like this bordering on madness.

It's gonna be hot, slow, and have a terrifyingly small amount of armor. Skill will be required to overcome it's shortcomings and go on to be successful with it. Sure, anyone can build it, but most people wouldn't get very far trying to compete in it.

Those who can shouldn't be arbitrarily punished because of a few hurt butts.

I think it's getting a buff, the list of mechs is generically the mechs getting quirk changes this patch. The patch simply said it will nerf some chassis and make them different a bit.

[Insects]

dustNbone, on 16 May 2015 - 03:40 AM, said:

It really seems like people calling for nerfs of certain mechs because of one build they saw (and probably got pwned by). I have played for quite a while (couple of years) and have never until today heard anyone say the RVN-2X is somehow OP.

It is top rated on metamechs.
Not heard any complaints about it? I suppose they saw it on top tier list so decided it was a problem?

[CutterWolf]

Wow really? So you can quirk my arm mounted weapons to aim and fire like high mounts torso weapons? And you can quirk the same weapons so that when I lose that arm my weapons will still be there? You do now see how your, "you can quirk anything to make it viable" argument is crap right? Do you think PGI is going to give us quirks to allow us to mount weapons we don't have tonnage or pod space for? Really? Or do you think that PGI is just going to give out 80% to 90% quirks for damage, range, or cool down to make up for the lack of that tonnage or pod space?

What part of, "the complete lack of torso mounted weapons, tonnage or pod space don't you understand/" Do you really think that we just like playing nothing but TW's and SC's over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over again is fun for us?

Or maybe you think that NONE of us have thought that we can just bust Russ's balls over and over again until he folds and quirks those mechs into something we can use? We have already been threw it, we know for a fact that you can't "quirk" these mechs into a viable mech its just not possible due to weapon mounting locations, tonnage, and pod space which you can't quirk without completely breaking the game. Which why PGI "rightfully" leaves those alone.

[meteorol]

dustNbone, on 16 May 2015 - 03:40 AM, said:

It really seems like people calling for nerfs of certain mechs because of one build they saw (and probably got pwned by). I have played for quite a while (couple of years) and have never until today heard anyone say the RVN-2X is somehow OP.

Looks like someone managed to get 3LLs on it, and as an experienced Raven pilot I say "spot on" to the guy that can be successful with such a build. I'm guessing most of the people calling for it's nerf have never tried to actually pilot a build like this bordering on madness.

It's gonna be hot, slow, and have a terrifyingly small amount of armor. Skill will be required to overcome it's shortcomings and go on to be successful with it. Sure, anyone can build it, but most people wouldn't get very far trying to compete in it.

Those who can shouldn't be arbitrarily punished because of a few hurt butts.

Have you tried the build? It has max armor(or close to max, too lazy to check right now), runs 124kph and is pretty cool thanks to -25% heatgen. What really makes it good is the -30% LL burntime. It's one of the easiest lights to use. You have ok range, minimal exposure time and high damage for managable heat. Just don't get into a 1on1 with other lights. It's like a 3L on roids.
Not saying it's op though, nor do i think it needs to be nerfed (it's a light mech with raven hitboxes after all), but it's not nearly as hard to use as you make it.

Nightshade24, on 16 May 2015 - 04:26 AM, said:

I think it's getting a buff, the list of mechs is generically the mechs getting quirk changes this patch. The patch simply said it will nerf some chassis and make them different a bit.

I'm pretty sure they won't buff it any further.

Edited by meteorol, 16 May 2015 - 05:12 AM.

[omessiaho]

I hope they don't go too far with the 2x since its one of my favorite mechs. Simply getting rid of the large laser quirk should take care of the 3ll builds that people have a problem with.

Its annoying that these changes seem to be based around CW, a mode that I and a growing number of people don't even play. I can't tell you the last time I've seen a 4n or 2x in the regular modes.

Edited by omessiaho, 16 May 2015 - 05:27 AM.

[Project_Mercy]

This is what I see

• Come out with a new game mode
  
• Make that game mode require you to fit mechs into a homogenous tonnage
  
• Have one set of mechs have really bad options on the low end so you discourage anything but the middle weights
  
• Have that same set of mechs lock those mechs so there's very little option for them to change
  
• Make Clan ACs be crap and nerf LRMs to be useless in comp play
  
• Discourage ammo weapons by making you have to kill 4 mechs but provide no way to reload
  
• Make the maps about taking a stagnent point where you generally have long cooridoors of fighting and encourage people to deathball, call targets, and annihilate or spawn camp
  
• Wonder why in the end you end up with the optimum choices for the middle-weight laser boats
  
• NERF NERF NERF

I don't even use the SCR and TBR, but the whole thing stinks to me. The fact the HBR and DWF aren't in the list says to me there's no rationality behind it, since the DWF is a better boat, and the HBR has the same build options. To me, I see changes that are based on Tukayyid that a result of CW instead of a result of the mechs themselves. It would be like making a map where both teams had to race 20 KM to a point and the first there wins, and wondering why everyone used locusts.


TBR is the way it is because they locked FF and ES and Engines, made clan ACs total crap, and made the model slightly smaller than it probably should be. It already has negative quirks and a CT that sticks out from any angle

SCR is the way it is because they locked FF and ES and Engines, and turned it into the clan Firestarter.

Instead adding the Warhammer and Marauder back to IS to fix the glaring whole instead of crap mechs like the Orion and Grasshopper, Instead of fixing clan lights so they're viable; we get this. Even if it's a -1% to laser cooldown; it's the end result of other issues that should have been addressed.

I liked the concept of the perks initially to add uniqueness to chassis; but all they're doing with it is homogonizing tonnage down to Hawken levels. It's turning into "Stand this mech in front of a dummy and compute total alpha and DPS and then perk it to meet our expected numbers".

CW and "dropship mode" (COD Respawn mode) are already pushing MWO further away from Battletech. Trying to balance the game around it is just pushing it further from BT. I mean, if you're going to go that route, just throw it all out and start over so at least it's consistent and sensical. Go back and nerf clan weapons do match up with IS ton-per-dps/alpha and save us all the effort of the constant nerfs. I mean, they'll eventually get to mechs I DO use. Why waste time buying and leveling mechs that are just going to suck in the future?

Edited by Project_Mercy, 16 May 2015 - 06:13 AM.