108 replies to this topic

[Mercules]

Many times in the group que my Unit will end up down a few mechs. At that point the better leaders in our group will typically remind people, "They are up by a few, but they are pretty beat up. Take out those wounded mechs and we can still have a game here."

Now units that are really good about withdrawing their damaged mechs so that fresh armor is being shot at are the ones that will stomp other groups. So there are times when a strong counterpush right after losing a mech, which is typically when people will pull back instinctively, can take out the wounded enemy and leave you in a better position.

[Mister Blastman]

Most games are decided before the first shot is ever fired. You can typically tell the outcome of a game based on the first few movements a team decides to make. Just watch your team radar. If you see multiple teammates...

1. Taking the long long way around things
2. Avoiding central conflict areas
3. Starfishing
4. Hesitant to advance
5. Moving up and then pulling back slowly behind cover and continuing to do so

You're usually doomed.

There are exceptions such as the enemy team being even more guilty of the above and doing exceptionally stupid stuff like...

1. A lance going cave
2. A lance of assaults going off to cap a point
3. A lance staying way back

Sad but... you can really tell how it is going to go basically within twenty to thirty seconds of starting.

[mogs01gt]

Joseph Mallan, on 28 May 2015 - 06:10 AM, said:

No its not, At least not on any maps we have now. If we chose to meet at the same choke points every game we get what we get. No map is bad IF and I mean IF we play smart. Now that playing smart thing seems to be in limited supply.

Which is why promoting randomize spawns and lance combat will create a different play style than what we have now with the "lets all funnel into one area and play peak-a-boo" style.

Then again, I want more maps Alpine but I doubt players will ever use different strategies in this game.

Edited by mogs01gt, 28 May 2015 - 06:44 AM.

[Kira Onime]

3-0 leads are surmountable.... it just depends what those 3 kills where.

[McScwizzy]

Join a unit? Seriously, join one. You won't regret it. It's awesome playing as a team.

[YueFei]

My team once had a 5 to 0 lead in Solo Queue.

Then it turns out the friendly Atlas in front of me was the only one kicking some ass. And I was like the only one following him and shooting at things with him.

I think he may have run outta ammo after the 5th kill. And then finally he buckled and died when no one else on our team came to help, and then of course I got killed, too.

Then I spectate the rest of our team and they are all sitting around like couch potatoes. We end up losing 5 to 12.

[Elizander]

YueFei, on 28 May 2015 - 06:53 AM, said:

My team once had a 5 to 0 lead in Solo Queue.

Then it turns out the friendly Atlas in front of me was the only one kicking some ass. And I was like the only one following him and shooting at things with him.

I think he may have run outta ammo after the 5th kill. And then finally he buckled and died when no one else on our team came to help, and then of course I got killed, too.

Then I spectate the rest of our team and they are all sitting around like couch potatoes. We end up losing 5 to 12.

Yeah, this happens. After a certain someone bites the dust it can often go downhill from there, depending on what the MM puts together.

[Kyynele]

cSand, on 28 May 2015 - 06:09 AM, said:

That sounds like the typical thing to say but in all reality, the only way to equalize that loss is to get 3 kills yourself

3 kills just covers the kills the dead guys in your team should've done. You should get a 4th to add your own personal effort in, too.

[Goose]

At two down, you should be thinking how to get your turrets involved, or else firming up your recon, so you can be capping around the deathball someone brought into Conquest.

At five down, you should be looking to salvage the time you would otherwise be wasting, playing out this failed op …

[CygnusX7]

Had a match where we were down 5 to 9 last night... Came back for the win!
Puglandia.

[Melon Lord]

One of my most memorable matches was on Tourmaline Desert. We had a Nova griefer who TKed 2 mediums/heavies right at the beginning of the match and heavily damaged another before we got him. So down 3, almost 4 mechs really within the first minute or so. We all stayed where the carange was at one corner of the map and just spread out and waited for the inevitable rush to wipe out the reminder of our team. The thing is, we spread out really, really well in the little corner we were hiding in.

Every time the enemy team pushed you would see our concentrated fire coming from EVERYWHERE. Lights/mediums with jumpjets were high on either side of our main force firing from cover, and for once it seemd everyone targeted the same enemy at the same time. It was a beautiful thing seeing almost every enemy mech fall from concentrated fire from what looked like 6 or 7 of our mech each and every time. We rolled the other team, I think the final score was like 12-5 or something like that.

[SkyHammyr]

What burns me is when those 3 kills happen within the first minute and a half of the match!

[Lugh]

William Mountbank, on 28 May 2015 - 04:22 AM, said:

4 is my number. In all my thousands of MWO games, I've only ever seen two matches with a comeback win despite one team going 4 down, and one of those was my favourite ever match (Caustic, ASRM Cent-AH, a well chosen death run into the caldera turned out to be a win run).

It's still possible to (male chicken) up a 3 kill lead in pugland.

I saw that number of comeback wins last week alone. Sorry your experience hasn't been as good.

Edited by Lugh, 28 May 2015 - 08:24 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Although the first 1-3 Kills are important. The "Final Kill" for your Team is the Key!

[bossclan]

I have seen many games where a single player at the end killed 5 or 6 enemies for a comeback win.
I have done it myself killing 7 in one game as the lone survivor in a jenner.
Then there are the games where i do 1k damage with 4 or 5 kills and still lose

[Mystere]

mogs01gt, on 28 May 2015 - 04:36 AM, said:

This issue is more on which mechs you lost. 3 lights, well who gives a ****. 3 Assaults, whether they are 100t's or not,it hurts!

That is true only if you're a fundamentalist member of The Church of the Bigger is Better.

mogs01gt, on 28 May 2015 - 04:51 AM, said:

lance vs lance so 4 mechs vs 4 mechs.

More or less how battlemech battles went in the novels. Lances vs lances spread across a large area but for MWO make each lance have each weight class. Randomized spawns also. I think if it was lance vs lance, faster Assaults might have chance since they could possibly out maneuver the heavy mechs. Much easier said then done obviously.

The 3/3/3/3 system is already bad enough. Now you want each lance to be composed of one of each class too? Hell no!

Elizander, on 28 May 2015 - 04:58 AM, said:

Trust in the MM. If your team has 3 idiots, the enemy team will probably have 3 idiots as well. You just have to find them before the non-idiots do more damage.

Better yet, use the idiots as bait to lure and kill the enemy.

[Ultimax]

Alistair Winter, on 28 May 2015 - 02:41 AM, said:

Yeah, it kind of blows. But that's pretty much an inevitable consequence of 12 v 12, no respawn and relatively high TTK

The phrase you are looking for is LOW TTK, not "HIGH TTK".


TTK = TIME TO KILL


If you have a game with HIGH TTK it means it takes LONGER to kill people, not shorter.

[bad arcade kitty]

Hans Von Lohman, on 28 May 2015 - 01:57 AM, said:

It seems weird to me as I have been playing World of Warships a lot lately, and there the matches nearly always seem to be a lot closer run things. Especially with the ability to capture the enemy flag and win that way. Since we got base turrets I think I've seen can count base capture wins on one hand in total.

play conquest

[Alistair Winter]

Ultimatum X, on 28 May 2015 - 09:11 AM, said:

The phrase you are looking for is LOW TTK, not "HIGH TTK".
TTK = TIME TO KILL
If you have a game with HIGH TTK it means it takes LONGER to kill people, not shorter.

Nope, that's not the phrase I'm looking for. I said exactly what I meant.

High TTK means it takes longer to kill people. Which means that unlike CounterStrike and similar games, a good player cannot easily beat a large number of bad players by taking them out 1 by 1. In other words, teamwork becomes more important than individual skills. And losing 3 people early in the match is thus quite often a certain prelude to defeat.

I want the game to have even higher TTK, but it does come at a price.

[Repasy Cooper]

Hans Von Lohman, on 28 May 2015 - 01:57 AM, said:

Does it seem odd to anybody else that there are not a lot of closer run games? It seems to me that the first team to score 2 or 3 kill over the enemy is the team that will win.

That leads to the majority of the match essentially being cleanup, and the team with the fewer players can only hope to score a moral victory by at least taking down a few more enemies so it isn't as one-sided.

It seems weird to me as I have been playing World of Warships a lot lately, and there the matches nearly always seem to be a lot closer run things. Especially with the ability to capture the enemy flag and win that way. Since we got base turrets I think I've seen can count base capture wins on one hand in total.

It's not odd at all. This isn't your typical fps with infinite respawn, so when a player gets taken down the battle value of your force goes down significantly! Just like TT Battletech.

Also, yea base capture wins are far and few, and there's a good reason for that. In order for your base to be captured, all your turrets usually gotta be destroyed & your team is too far from base to cover it. A team would usually rush back to base to prevent a capture win, but when this happens that team can get a bit chaotic, making it easier for the enemy team to pick them off.

Killing the enemy team also gives you more points, C-Bills, XP, and helps your K/D. The only time when a capture win is ideal is if you know your team will get slaughtered, or if you're already down on mechs.