81 replies to this topic

[stjobe]

About that "it's not P2W, it's P2EarlyAccess" argument:

During that early access period, when the 'mechs are only available for real money, they are often quite unbalanced (read: OP). Right before their CB release, they get a balance pass - all in the name of balance, of course, and never in the name of keeping pre-order 'mechs better than those generally available.

Be honest, and you'll have to admit this has happened on a suspiciously large percentage of the 'mech packs.

[xWiredx]

This WintahMute guy still only has 1 post: the OP. Hasn't replied and OP is now more than 24 hours old. Hmm.

[Ovion]

stjobe, on 30 June 2015 - 12:37 PM, said:

About that "it's not P2W, it's P2EarlyAccess" argument:

During that early access period, when the 'mechs are only available for real money, they are often quite unbalanced (read: OP). Right before their CB release, they get a balance pass - all in the name of balance, of course, and never in the name of keeping pre-order 'mechs better than those generally available.

Be honest, and you'll have to admit this has happened on a suspiciously large percentage of the 'mech packs.

3-5 mechs among them, out of what.. 31? have actually been 'overpowered'.

That's 9-16% of pack released mechs so far.
That have had some power issues (and they continue to now - they're hard to balance)

That's hardly a suspiciously large percentage.

[stjobe]

Ovion, on 30 June 2015 - 01:43 PM, said:

3-5 mechs among them, out of what.. 31? have actually been 'overpowered'.

That's 9-16% of pack released mechs so far.
That have had some power issues (and they continue to now - they're hard to balance)

That's hardly a suspiciously large percentage.

Just about every 'mech pack has had at least one "unbalanced" 'mech - in some cases several.

[Pjwned]

"I'm so dissatisfied with your product that I bought over $100 worth of stuff."

This is why we don't have nice things.

[WintahMute]

Alot of you have good points, I paid $130 to support the game as a 'noobie' I have a right to voice my constructive critism.
After thinking about it further I think the devs should be concentrating on better graphics and destructable terrain, new maps and players ability to sell mechs (for a decent price), just to name a few.
I don't think it's pay to win outrightly but it's easy to get that impression that alot of money is to be spent in the game, you understand I'm trying to get my friends involved in the game... this is the opinion of a lot of people who have just looked into it.. it may be a mistaken impression but sometimes looking at the website I feel like I'm suppedenly transported to the mechwarrior equivalent of amazon online.
Obviously the players have invested quite a bit of money into this product it's time to see some visual benefits, I checked this game out when it was in beta... has it really changed that much since? faction warfare is nice but it needs more work, there is no overall feeling of galaxy wide conflict, no benefits to conquest.. the graphics are nice but could be better.
I'm not trying to be overally whingy and I'm sorry my original post was probably a bit harsh, but you have a good franchise here, very rich in lore and detail there is a lot of promise.

I guess what I'm trying to say is, there are enough mechs out at the moment, you have some decent modes of gameplay... the physics are good, now its time to wrap it up get the graphics up to standard(with other games which I spend 130 on like star citizen-which had destroyable terrain and ships), get more maps out and more gameplay.

or am I aiming to high?

[Ovion]

Gameplay is better (despite what some will say)
Graphics have been brought down, because people complained they couldn't run the game.

Especially since IGP was kicked to the curb, the game has been steadibly progressing.
This year will see a lot of things improved further and Steam.

Plus, especially if you stick with it and actually learn what you're doing, it IS fun.

[Mcgral18]

Ovion, on 30 June 2015 - 03:48 PM, said:

Gameplay is better (despite what some will say)
Graphics have been brought down, because people complained they couldn't run the game.

In fairness, they did double my FPS over time when I still had my potato.

From Closed Beta (15ish FPS average) to Open Beta (30ish FPS average) was a significant enough change.



No reason they shouldn't include their high res texture as a separate download (to prevent confusion from new players or other Toaster users) for those who can handle them, of course.

[Dinochrome]

Hailz Mechwarriors:

Reality check/ frame of reference check. I know of a game in development for 2.5 years with a current budget of $85,000,000 with an estimated 900.000 sponsors, who have to date produced only a basic PVP flight simulator. They have nothing for a top tier ship less $220. Is it a good game? Yes. Will it be along time in development. Yes. You think MWO has those resources?

V/R Dinochrome

[Escef]

grievoussmaug, on 30 June 2015 - 02:56 AM, said:

Notice how the mech pack scheme came about after IGP full left.

IGP started the mech packs. The gold mechs were their idea as well (Russ even said that while the gold mechs made a fair amount of money, he didn't like dealing with the flack they generated, so he's not planning on ever doing them again).

[InspectorG]

Burktross, on 30 June 2015 - 06:45 AM, said:

So, gamble to win?

More of a gamble for PGI...i would say.

[InspectorG]

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I guess what I'm trying to say is, there are enough mechs out at the moment, you have some decent modes of gameplay... the physics are good, now its time to wrap it up get the graphics up to standard(with other games which I spend 130 on like star citizen-which had destroyable terrain and ships), get more maps out and more gameplay.

or am I aiming to high?

MWo is in DIRE need of more gameplay modes/objectives. Supposedly we are getting a Recon mode and this interests me greatly.

IMO, Gameplay > Graphics(though destructable terrain is more important than moar shiny - imo)
My potato cant handle more than 20FPS on Low Settings.
I still rock oldschool games with terrible graphics...but excellent gameplay.

Gameplay will make or break MWO.

[Raggedyman]

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

Alot of you have good points, I paid $130 to support the game as a 'noobie' I have a right to voice my constructive critism.
After thinking about it further I think the devs should be concentrating on better graphics and destructable terrain, new maps and players ability to sell mechs (for a decent price), just to name a few.

Better graphics = higher specs machine needed = less people able to play the game = less sales
players able to sell mechs (for a decent price) = less incentive to either buy mechs for $$$ or buy membership for $$$ = less sales
destructible terrain and new maps (see previous comments about news maps not always being meaningful content) = possibly more sales

So that's two definite drop in income vs one possible up in income
Please never start a business.

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I don't think it's pay to win outrightly but it's easy to get that impression that alot of money is to be spent in the game,

Yes, especially when you start with 'i spent a lot of money on this game'

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I feel like I'm suppedenly transported to the mechwarrior equivalent of amazon online.

Correct. Assuming it's an Amazon Online which gives you 95% of its products for free.

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

Obviously the players have invested quite a bit of money into this product it's time to see some visual benefits,

No, that really isn't obvious.
They already have the benefits, its "the things they spent their money on"

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I checked this game out when it was in beta... has it really changed that much since? faction warfare is nice but it needs more work, there is no overall feeling of galaxy wide conflict, no benefits to conquest..

That is actually a really valid point

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

the graphics are nice but could be better.

You could always buy a better rig to play on

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I'm not trying to be overally whingy

yeah, well sometimes people succeed even when not trying.

WintahMute, on 30 June 2015 - 03:38 PM, said:

I guess what I'm trying to say is, there are enough mechs out at the moment, you have some decent modes of gameplay... the physics are good, now its time to wrap it up get the graphics up to standard(with other games which I spend 130 on like star citizen-which had destroyable terrain and ships), get more maps out and more gameplay.

or am I aiming to high?

New mechs are the main source of income, if PGI stop doing that game go bye-bye
New game play modes could be fun but if there are too many options you get population problems/not enough people to fill each game mode
Considering how much money you spend on games you may want to look into a better spec rig to up the graphics with and a lesson on "how to check out what you're buying before you hit the 'buy' button"

[Speedy Plysitkos]

As I alrdy said in another dread.
You think 20/40/60/80/120 $ for pack is greedy ? when you got 3/6/9/12 mechs ?

starcitizen is selling 400$ NON-piloting ship, and people buying it like mad....

[ColdHeat]

Biggest problem I have with the game is the "hidden" grind where it actually feels like work in order to achieve anything. And that's where I can agree with your feeling of "greed" OP.

I've invested a lot into this game, mainly because I liked the mechs designs. Bought the operation phoenix pack and a ****ton of hero mechs which are parked in my garage since then only to find that all of them come with barely useful loadouts. So in order to play just a single mech the way I want I typically have to invest 6+ million CBills. When you want to buy a new mech from scratch it's pretty much that amount PLUS the millions of C-Bills the mech costs in the first place. Yet with every game I only make around 100-150k. So it comes to the point where you have a lot of mechs you actually would want to drive but just can't see any progress to once be able to finally to it.

I still know the times when you could make 300k+ with each match but the grind got worse and worse with every little update to the point where I ask myself now: What do I have from this game if I actually invest a sum worth of multiple AAA titles and still feel like I'm trapped in a horrible forced-to-pay grind? Like a cashcow that's going to be milked over and over again and that leaves a quite unsatisfactory aftertaste with me.

[Speedy Plysitkos]

Coldheat

you are right about the additional cost for IS mechs. you buy 10m atlas, then you need 1.5m for DHS, 1m for ES, 1-2m for weapons. and 3m for new engine. (6 when you go full crazy with XL).
So basicly you spare for 10m, bought the chassis, but you know you are done 50% only of the grind.

And also, it could turn into you have the chassis, finaly rebuilded what you wanted from start, and then realized its NOT working in game, you thought it will be. Then you park 10-20m mech in your garage and are not using it.... then you start another mech....

hero mechs are not something special. They are only "different".

[Nik Reaper]

ColdHeat, on 01 July 2015 - 01:38 AM, said:

Biggest problem I have with the game is the "hidden" grind where it actually feels like work in order to achieve anything. And that's where I can agree with your feeling of "greed" OP.

I've invested a lot into this game, mainly because I liked the mechs designs. Bought the operation phoenix pack and a ****ton of hero mechs which are parked in my garage since then only to find that all of them come with barely useful loadouts. So in order to play just a single mech the way I want I typically have to invest 6+ million CBills. When you want to buy a new mech from scratch it's pretty much that amount PLUS the millions of C-Bills the mech costs in the first place. Yet with every game I only make around 100-150k. So it comes to the point where you have a lot of mechs you actually would want to drive but just can't see any progress to once be able to finally to it.

I still know the times when you could make 300k+ with each match but the grind got worse and worse with every little update to the point where I ask myself now: What do I have from this game if I actually invest a sum worth of multiple AAA titles and still feel like I'm trapped in a horrible forced-to-pay grind? Like a cashcow that's going to be milked over and over again and that leaves a quite unsatisfactory aftertaste with me.

THis is true, but unless you are a top tier competitive player and need the new meta mech or a crazy collector who has to have them all, you don't have to have them all and sence 1 or 2 come out in a month there should be months you don't need the new one , and if you play this game for fun, as you should, you should be generating enough cbills, unless you like using 2x40k consumables every game with out premium or a hero mech, to buy 1 direwolf even with only a few hours a week, after a year or 3 , you will have enough spare components and engines that when you buy a new mech you can sell it's engine to cover endo and you will have enough spare weapons to save there too, but is it hell on the new guy, damn right.

At the start you need all them xl300's and all them modules as they would say the first 100mil is the hardest x) .

Titannium, on 01 July 2015 - 02:32 AM, said:

Coldheat

....

hero mechs are not something special. They are only "different".

Nothing special exept some of them have highly desirable hardpoint counts and in locations unavailable to others with good quirks ( 30~50% cooldown reduction ).. Huginn, oxide, grid iron, misery all totally crap mechs. that noone uses competitivly right? ....
Not all of them are good, but the ones that are , really are.

Edited by Nik Reaper, 01 July 2015 - 04:55 AM.

[Burktross]

Titannium, on 01 July 2015 - 12:06 AM, said:

As I alrdy said in another dread.
You think 20/40/60/80/120 $ for pack is greedy ? when you got 3/6/9/12 mechs ?

starcitizen is selling 400$ NON-piloting ship, and people buying it like mad....

And we're not star citizen.
Go raise package prices that high, see what happens. If people buy it like crazy there, it must happen here too.

But that wont happen, because this is MWO. We're paying for fighter robbits-- fractions of the actual game (or, as it should be at least). Star Citizen's pricing system is irrelevant to us.

And-- call it a hunch-- but I gander most of star citizen's profit is a result of hype and buying to show off yer epeen. From the gameplay I've seen, it doesn't look too--- STELLAR.
Sorry, I couldn't resist.

Edited by Burktross, 01 July 2015 - 05:40 AM.

[Escef]

Burktross, on 01 July 2015 - 05:31 AM, said:

And-- call it a hunch-- but I gander most of star citizen's profit is a result of hype and buying to show off yer epeen. From the gameplay I've seen, it doesn't look too--- STELLAR.
Sorry, I couldn't resist.

At this point I haven't heard anything about Star Citizen that makes it seem worth my time.

[Vandul]

Escef, on 01 July 2015 - 06:15 AM, said:

At this point I haven't heard anything about Star Citizen that makes it seem worth my time.

Sure there is. A $400 starliner that is unarmed and can carry 40 passengers. You can serve drinks on it. DRINKS I tell you!