41 replies to this topic

[Void Angel]

I already reported it to be stickied - you should, too.

[Waffles 2pt0]

Thanks for putting this together.

How are the 'Savior Kill' and 'Defensive Kill' bonuses triggered? I can't find the criteria anywhere.

Edited by IIII The Smiling Bandit IIII, 17 July 2015 - 06:43 AM.

[IraqiWalker]

IIII The Smiling Bandit IIII, on 17 July 2015 - 06:40 AM, said:

Thanks for putting this together.

How are the 'Savior Kill' and 'Defensive Kill' bonuses triggered? I can't find the criteria anywhere.

Savior kill is triggered when an enemy is hitting a friendly with exposed internals, and you assist in killing the enemy.

I think defensive is for killing someone trying to cap a base you own.

[Glxy Cmdr Jason Tseng]

InspectorG, on 14 July 2015 - 04:02 PM, said:

Needs 'pilot pressed R' bonus.

Quote

Scouting:Be the first to spot a target.
Do not engage.

They did.

[SRTHellcat]

Good read well done

[Spare Parts Bin]

Bravo well done, more points to ponder.

[Jingseng]

Defensive kill is triggered when you kill someone attacking you while you are attempting to capture. It does not have to be your base (I've gotten it on conquest, as well as when capturing enemy base). You need to be within the capture zone (not sure about the enemy... but Pretty sure it does need to hit you once stopping capture)

[Jingseng]

Was just thinking about the kill most damage/solo kill ... I think PGI might need to rethink/rework that. It encourages inefficient damage dealing over focused damage.

For example, if I core a mech from the back... that is less damage dealt than coring a mech from the front. Someone who shoots off my useless shield arms gets more credit towards KMD/SK than someone who takes care of the torso armor (and if the damage spray n pray then gets a lucky shot on internals, or uses machine gun hail and snags the kill...)

And as people have noted elsewhere, getting a headshot is in some ways penalized, as it is less damage dealt (but I guess more salvage?)... the same would apply to a KMD/SK situation on a damaged mech. It'd be like getting a two stroke penalty for making a hole in one.

But I suppose the upshot is, it makes for flashier, longer, and more 'exciting and watchable' battles (for the esports and whatnot)

[Insanity09]

I would suggest that the rewards for actually accomplishing the mission objectives need to be boosted (resource cap, assault base cap, domination timer). They are already better, true, but the difference needs to be higher to encourage more people to actually do it. I know that I am tired of watching one selfish (and unwise?) player deny the entire team better rewards so they can get that last kill.
As a second part to this, I'd suggest that the type of victory, capping, or countdown, apply some sort of bonus modifier to the pilot skill tier rewards. A skirmish style victory (killing the entire enemy team) should be the baseline, no additional modifier. No additional penalty for losing. (And btw, killing off the entire enemy team in domination should NOT result in a countdown victory, that is a skirmish style victory and should be counted as such)

As far as the solo kill & kmdd versus the spray of overall damage and so forth, I suggest an additional category.
"Precision Kill"? If you kill an opponent with only a small amount of damage done to him (a head shot, back kill, etc.) it counts for more xp/cb? This should be worth more than a kmdd and would ONLY apply if the overall health of the target mech was higher than a certain amount (or alternatively, only apply if the target areas that were not directly involved in the kill were relatively intact, i.e. if you take out both legs but no other area is open to internal damage or something like that...). So kmdd could still apply, but precise kills would be rewarded as well.
I'm sure the idea could be refined and expanded on. There is a need to be careful here though, because discouraging the use of entire weapon systems (SRM/LRMs, basically) is not to be desired.

[Insanity09]

This is great information, thank you very much.
However, a related follow-up question: what earns match score, and how much?

[IraqiWalker]

Insanity09, on 14 December 2016 - 11:28 PM, said:

This is great information, thank you very much.
However, a related follow-up question: what earns match score, and how much?

This is quite outdated in some regards, but the list as far as I recall is as follows (how much was NEVER made public, but we know damage is king, apparently):
1- Damage (team damage earns negative match score, so watch out)

2- Kills (this includes savior kills, kill most damage dealt, killing blows ... etc.)

3- Assists (this includes TAGing and NARCing enemies for your teammates to hit)

4- Captures

5- Spotting (this includes TAGing and NARCing enemies for your teammates to hit)

6- Sticking close to your lance

7- Hitting enemies who are not seeing you and attacking your teammates

8- Providing ECM cover to allies.

9- Providing AMS cover to allies.

Almost anything you do helps raise your match score.

[Insanity09]

And I thank you, Iraqiwalker, for that info.

My apologies, but I guess I wasn't clear. A kill gets you match score, sure, but how much? 1 point? 50? 25 for an assist? 3.75? 1 point for each proximity reward?

Things like scouting and objectives (base captures) may add to match score, but the amount seems inconsequential. I was hoping to find out how trivial those activities were compared to damage/kills.

[IraqiWalker]

Insanity09, on 16 December 2016 - 12:14 PM, said:

And I thank you, Iraqiwalker, for that info.

My apologies, but I guess I wasn't clear. A kill gets you match score, sure, but how much? 1 point? 50? 25 for an assist? 3.75? 1 point for each proximity reward?

Things like scouting and objectives (base captures) may add to match score, but the amount seems inconsequential. I was hoping to find out how trivial those activities were compared to damage/kills.

IraqiWalker, on 16 December 2016 - 09:49 AM, said:

(how much was NEVER made public, but we know damage is king, apparently)

[Insanity09]

With the addition of formerly qp/gp map modes (assault, skirmish, domination) to faction warfare, it has become even more important that some enhancement to victory by objectives be made.

I have now had people saying in voip and chat to ignore the objectives of a faction match and to "just kill enemies".
Simple attrition warfare was fairly thoroughly discredited in WWI.

The only rational reason I can think of that people would want this is to see higher numbers on their match scores; more kills and damage means more credit and xp? And I admit, that although that makes no sense in terms of sacrificing victory, which willfully ignoring the objectives will tend to do (who among us has not seen a conquest loss due to that?), it does make a modicum of sense if all you care about are numbers.

It seems PGI has two choices.

One, and the better choice by far: Make victories matter. Both on the individual match level, and for winning at faction play campaign level.

For each match this can be done simply by giving much, much better rewards for simply winning a match, especially for winning via the objectives, rather than simply killing the enemy. I might go so far as to suggest that winning by objective (capture in assault, timer in dom, etc.) give a huge bonus for victory (I'd say at least 2-3 times what it is now) but an additional bonus based on how many enemies are left alive. (suggest: half the value of a kill in cbill, xp, and match score to every member of the winning team per enemy mech alive IF the victory is achieved via objective (not an enemy team kill)). (actual individual kill/assist counters would not change based on this bonus)

Faction play victories must matter. Right now, there really isn't much incentive one way or the other to actually achieve faction goals (taking planets, hitting scouting milestones, etc.). If there were some sort of additional bonus, cbill, xp, faction rep for the defending/capturing faction, possibly even mc, shared among those who contributed to the win (who actually won a faction play match of any kind on the relevant planet), that might actually encourage more folks.
Little blinky lights on a map are unlikely to encourage people. Tangible rewards do (using the term advisedly in a virtual world).

Doing these things (or something similar) would give people more reward for playing (esp. in fp), and might actually help retain people.


The second choice is to do nothing to enhance the experience and motivation of the players. The end result here is more rapid attrition of the player base, especially in fp.

[Elric Tchernovkov]

I do know that as of last year, you can win a match and not make match score for stocking tuffers etc. BUT, you can lose a match and as long as you have 9 or more assists, qualify for rewards. So an assist is worth at least 9 points toeard match score.

[IraqiWalker]

Victory and Loss actually impact match score a lot. Keep screen capping your matches. Eventually you'll get a win and a loss where you performed near identically. You'll see that the win will have a higher match score.

Here's the thing though about ignore the objective: If your team is confident they can secure it should their advantage be taken, then it's better in terms of score, and rewards, to farm the enemy team. It's not fun, but it gives more credits.

[Quazi moto]

IraqiWalker, on 16 July 2015 - 03:55 AM, said:

Yes, but NARC is still the least risky of the two, by miles. The NARC rockets can still hit a target at up to 450 meters. You can then boogie out of there without consequence. Whereas TAG provides the enemy with a clear red "shoot over there for a free kill" beam of light. The mech has to hold it over the target, until it is hit by LRMs for them to get a reward. Do you know how long it takes a dual Gauss mech to kill something standing still?

do you really TAG standing still?

[IcarusNine]

Recently took notice of these and compiled an updated list of the rewards.
(They're in roughly the same order you see them on the end scoreboard. I also couldn't trigger a tie or counter ecm at my convenience. I'm not entirely certain how to trigger Counter-ECM Locked Damage, it happened once.)

Reward	C-Bills	XP	Note
Win	35000	250
Loss	25000	40
Tie	?	?
Conquest Win	10000	75
Capture Assist	2500	50
Capture Success	10000	75
Turret Kill	1000	20
Savior Kill	7500	60
Killing Blow	3000	30
Team Kill	15000	150
Kill Assist	1500	50
UAV Kill	1500	50	Destroy a UAV.
Counter ECM	?	?
Counter ECM Locked Damage	500	25
Conquest Bonus	10000-20000?	0	Conquest games only. More data needed.
Salvage Bonus	5000-10000?	0	More data needed.
Damage Done	21*damage	0
Team Damage	-21*damage	0
Component Destroyed	4000	15
Kill Most Damage Dealt	7500	80
Solo Kill	10000	280
Flanking	3000	20	Can occur from the front. Strange.
Brawling	4500	130
Spotting Assist	2000	20	Can be rewarded for NARC locks.
UAV Locked Damage	3000	20
UAV Detection	3000	20
TAG Kill	6000	60	Might require locked damage.
NARC Kill	10000	60	Might require locked damage.
Hit And Run	2000	15
Capturing Base	100	0	Every 10 seconds or so. (Slow and marginal!)
Scouting	3000	20
TAG Damage	?*damage	0	Locked damage, including your own.
TAG Stealth	1000	0
Lance in Formation	120	0
Protected Light	500	0
Protected Medium	500	0
Protection Proximity	500	0

[Xaat Xuun]

shouldn't that team kill read as a -150
heck if I was to get 150, I might just start team killing . . well not really

[Aidan Crenshaw]

Greetings everyone!

I have collected the recent match rewards in one compilation. Enjoy!



Edit: The list is outdated as of May Patch '19, update in progress!

Edited by Aidan Crenshaw, 27 May 2019 - 12:14 AM.