108 replies to this topic

[Revis Volek]

ScoutMaster, on 22 July 2015 - 07:39 AM, said:

What's really annoying is that if I press a+s+alt it doesnt register all 3 keys... Stupid keyboard,anyone else have that problem?

Yes, which is why i MASC to be activated via a mouse button


and to the Thread and OP,
Its not a super charger....its MASC.

Meant for added mobility in times of need, Not as a NOS button to cut down on your 1/4 miles times.

Edited by DarthRevis, 22 July 2015 - 11:02 AM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 10:57 AM, said:

Its not a super charger....its MASC.

The irony, Superchargers exist in Battletech, and they function exactly like MASC except they damage the engine on failure instead of the legs for less tonnage and less criticals. The only downside to Superchargers being the cost and only being able to mount it in a section with an engine critical.

[Triordinant]

Greenjulius, on 22 July 2015 - 07:24 AM, said:

The Shadowcat however? MASC MK II only provides 10% boost, which means the Cat goes from 106.9kph, up to 117.59kph, an increase of 10.69 kph. Less than the Executioner!

Didn't they say before that the game engine has a hard speed limit of 117 kph?

[N a p e s]

Triordinant, on 22 July 2015 - 11:05 AM, said:

Didn't they say before that the game engine has a hard speed limit of 117 kph?

[Revis Volek]

Well the Supercharger in TT was the only thing that actually had written about (that i can find) where it INCREASED THE OUTPUT OF THE ENGINE and was used on all kinds of stuff, Tanks, Mechs, etc.

MASC while being able to be used with a Supercharger only stats it Allows for twice walking speed which in MWO translated to a % increase and accelrated turn rates, etc.

The Supercharger should increase everything MASC can AS WELL AS increasing torso twist speed because its an ENGINE OUTPUT INCREASE not just a WALKING SPEED increase.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 11:32 AM, said:

The Supercharger should increase everything MASC can AS WELL AS increasing torso twist speed because its an ENGINE OUTPUT INCREASE not just a WALKING SPEED increase.

How it should (question mark) work and how it does work are two different things...and considering the Superchargers in TT were already better than MASC, it makes sense for gameplay why it wouldn't have all the fun things MASC does.

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 22 July 2015 - 11:37 AM.

[Paigan]

All that "Buff MASC" whining...

Paigan, on 22 July 2015 - 11:00 AM, said:

The nice thing about MASC is the agility boost, not necessarily the speed boost.
Also they reduced the speed boost intentionally to avoid getting too high max speeds (engine problems, lag, etc.).
I'm using it since the EXE came out and I think it's fine.
A little tweaking maybe, but no big speed boost

Edited by Paigan, 22 July 2015 - 11:39 AM.

[Lexx]

Shadowcat MASC is fine. A 2 ton larger engine should give more of a speed boost than a 2 ton MASC because the MASC system gives ridiculous amounts of extra acceleration and deceleration as well as a turning boost.

If anything the MASC on the Executioner should be toned down a little. A Banshee with a 400XL, (an engine that weighs 6 tons more than the 380XL in the Executioner), only goes 75KPH. The speed boost on the Executioners MASC is too much, giving it almost 10KPH more than the largest engine in the game would give. Add to that the boosts to the acceleration and deceleration, it's OP.

MASC is a clan exclusive right now, so it will probably be nerfed when the IS gets it, or be less effective on IS mechs for no good reason other than "lore".

Edited by Lexx, 22 July 2015 - 11:44 AM.

[Top Leliel]

They nerfed MASC because it would break the game if the Flea or Firemoth were allowed to go 200 kph.

But here's the thing, neither the Flea or Firemoth are in the game, the Shadow Cat is, and giving it lore-accurate MASC, would allow it to go as fast as mechs with similar tonnage but less to spare for weapons, in short bursts.

Right now the Shadow Cat's MASC is basically an instant-accelerator, not a speed booster: it does not work like MASC is supposed to work. The Shadow Cat should not suffer for a nerf to mechs that haven't even been released yet, for an engine problem that doesn't even concern it. They can nerf MASC for lights all they like but they have absolutely no excuse nerfing it for mediums which can't go engine-breaking speeds even with it activated.

[Ultimax]

I don't agree completely.


The Executioner's MASC weighs more and takes up more space.

I like that for once, taking the heavier, bulkier item actually has additional value - and happens to be on a mech that spends EIGHT TONS on JJs that can't jump 1/5th as good as a mech that has spend half as much tonnage on them..


The Arctic Cheetah also has its MASC placed in a great location, CT. It can't be destroyed without killing the mech, unlike the EXE.



Lastly, while investing the raw tonnage would have gotten you a bigger engine:

1) That's not an option for Omni-mechs anyway.
2) The best feature of MASC isn't the speed, it's the instant acceleration/deceleration boosts - and no amount of larger engine would give that to you.

Edited by Ultimatum X, 22 July 2015 - 12:02 PM.

[Revis Volek]

Ultimatum X, on 22 July 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

I don't agree completely.


The Executioner's MASC weighs more and takes up more space.

I like that for once, taking the heavier, bulkier item actually has additional value - and happens to be on a mech that spends EIGHT TONS on JJs that can't jump 1/5th as good as a mech that has spend half as much tonnage on them..


The Arctic Cheetah also has its MASC placed in a great location, CT. It can't be destroyed without killing the mech, unlike the EXE.



Lastly, while investing the raw tonnage would have gotten you a bigger engine:

1) That's not an option for Omni-mechs anyway.
2) The best feature of MASC isn't the speed, it's the instant acceleration/deceleration boosts - and no amount of larger engine would give that to you.

You and me both, because it's hardly ever worth taking a TC2 or larger over a TC1....there is no point because of diminishing returns. MASC is the first item where the bigger you go the better it is and i like that.


and yes Omni's dont have the luxury of changing out our engines, if we want to go faster we put in MASC. If we ever get Superchargers they should do everything MASC does but also increase Twist rates and like i said in another thread in MWO MASC is meant for mobility perks not to shave seconds off your 1/4 mile speed.

[Top Leliel]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 12:07 PM, said:

You and me both, because it's hardly ever worth taking a TC2 or larger over a TC1....there is no point because of diminishing returns. MASC is the first item where the bigger you go the better it is and i like that.


and yes Omni's dont have the luxury of changing out our engines, if we want to go faster we put in MASC. If we ever get Superchargers they should do everything MASC does but also increase Twist rates and like i said in another thread in MWO MASC is meant for mobility perks not to shave seconds off your 1/4 mile speed.

MASC is supposed to give a noticeable speed boost. It does so for the Executioner in MWO. Go to Sarna and look up the canon specs of a stock Shadow Cat, you'll notice it is supposed to give a big boost there too.

[Mcgral18]

Ultimatum X, on 22 July 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

The Arctic Cheetah also has its MASC placed in a great location, CT. It can't be destroyed without killing the mech, unlike the EXE.

Not quite right, it can be crit like any other item. As with every other item, also 10 HP.

-<Module faction="InnerSphere" CType="CMASCStats" name="MASCMkII" id="1601">
<Loc iconTag="StoreIcons\MASC.png" descTag="@MASCMkII_desc" shortNameTag="@ui_MASCMkII" nameTag="@MASCMkII"/>
<ModuleStats TonsMax="40" TonsMin="25" amountAllowed="1" health="10" tons="2.0" slots="2"/>
<MASCStats WeaponSpread="2.5" WeaponShake="0.25" DamageMax="1.32" DamageMin="1.08" DamageRate="0.5" GaugeDamagePoint="0.75" GaugeDrain="0.02" GaugeFill="0.1" BoostTurn="0.25" BoostDecel="1.5" BoostAccel="1.75" BoostSpeed="0.1"/>

[Revis Volek]

Top Leliel, on 22 July 2015 - 12:17 PM, said:

MASC is supposed to give a noticeable speed boost. It does so for the Executioner in MWO. Go to Sarna and look up the canon specs of a stock Shadow Cat, you'll notice it is supposed to give a big boost there too.

I'm well aware of all the numbers whats its suppose to and not suppose to do.....this isnt TT though unfortunatly but the implementation i dont think is quite terrible.

And its listed as being able to Double a Mechs walking speed NOT Top Speed which translates to a Mechs top speed here in MWO which i dont think is the case in TT. Supercharger can be used in conjunction for a boost to engine output and walking speed.

[Top Leliel]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 12:39 PM, said:

I'm well aware of all the numbers whats its suppose to and not suppose to do.....this isnt TT though unfortunatly but the implementation i dont think is quite terrible.

And its listed as being able to Double a Mechs walking speed NOT Top Speed which translates to a Mechs top speed here in MWO which i dont think is the case in TT. Supercharger can be used in conjunction for a boost to engine output and walking speed.

It isn't terrible at all, it's still powerful. While it isn't exactly like it was in previous games, people who are saying "Shadow Cat is strictly worse than Stormcrow!" are wrong.I was hoping for a broken mech and got a good one instead.
Edit: I still think it would be great if MASC were improved, but hopefully in a way where it remains balanced.

Edited by Top Leliel, 22 July 2015 - 01:00 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 12:39 PM, said:

And its listed as being able to Double a Mechs walking speed NOT Top Speed which translates to a Mechs top speed here in MWO which i dont think is the case in TT. Supercharger can be used in conjunction for a boost to engine output and walking speed.

It does not double walking speed, it increases your top speed from 50% your walking speed to 100% your walking speed. Superchargers function exactly the same, and they both will cause +2 to-hit modifier because you have to run to use them.

Regardless, supercharger wouldn't/shouldn't be MASC++ considering it weighs less and is always one slot which gives it quite the benefit, balance > realism.

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 22 July 2015 - 12:52 PM.

[Revis Volek]

WM Quicksilver, on 22 July 2015 - 12:51 PM, said:

It does not double walking speed, it increases your top speed from 50% your walking speed to 100% your walking speed. Superchargers function exactly the same, and they both will cause +2 to-hit modifier because you have to run to use them.

Regardless, supercharger wouldn't/shouldn't be MASC++ considering it weighs less and is always one slot which gives it quite the benefit, balance > realism.

Well Sarna is wrong then....wouldn't be the first time.

http://www.sarna.net...ignal_Circuitry

Edited by DarthRevis, 22 July 2015 - 12:54 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

DarthRevis, on 22 July 2015 - 12:54 PM, said:

Well Sarna is wrong then....wouldn't be the first time.

http://www.sarna.net...ignal_Circuitry

Nah, it just is worded a little weird.

Quote

piece of equipment that allows a BattleMech to move twice its walking speed

It does not state that your walking speed is doubled, only that you are able to move at twice its walking speed, which is correct.
It probably should be worded a little more clear to state that it pushes your top speed from 1.5x your walking speed to 2x your walking speed, but meh.

Edited by WM Quicksilver, 22 July 2015 - 12:59 PM.

[Deathlike]

Greenjulius, on 22 July 2015 - 08:53 AM, said:

It's a valid comparison to show that there are much more powerful alternatives.

An 45 tonner comparison would probably be the BJ-1X, which beats the **** out of the Shadowcat. However, the subject at hand is MASC on the Cat, and why it makes absolutely no sense the way it is currently implemented.

Someone forgot the Vindicator. Zero torso twist buffs there. Such wonderful balance!


Even the Fridge (Ice Ferret) has some torso twist buffs.

Ultimatum X, on 22 July 2015 - 12:01 PM, said:

I don't agree completely.


The Executioner's MASC weighs more and takes up more space.

I like that for once, taking the heavier, bulkier item actually has additional value - and happens to be on a mech that spends EIGHT TONS on JJs that can't jump 1/5th as good as a mech that has spend half as much tonnage on them..


The Arctic Cheetah also has its MASC placed in a great location, CT. It can't be destroyed without killing the mech, unlike the EXE.



Lastly, while investing the raw tonnage would have gotten you a bigger engine:

1) That's not an option for Omni-mechs anyway.
2) The best feature of MASC isn't the speed, it's the instant acceleration/deceleration boosts - and no amount of larger engine would give that to you.

Had to do a double take on what you wrote.

Edited by Deathlike, 22 July 2015 - 01:10 PM.

[Top Leliel]

Deathlike, on 22 July 2015 - 01:09 PM, said:

</p>
Had to do a double take on what you wrote.

If the Arctic Cheetah had MASC nobody would ever laugh at the idea of Clan Light 'mechs again.

Edited by Top Leliel, 22 July 2015 - 01:13 PM.