141 replies to this topic

[Zordicron]

I want to point just one thing out- ELO, pretty sure short term(like 10 matches) the ELO system would try to keep you at 50/50 W/L. This new system, they went back to January and set up your tier. I am not certain, but that would imply the system doesn't make rapid adjustments like ELO did, it might take 50-100 matches tosignificantly alter your ranking.

This would be appropriate for cadets in tier 4, allowing them to hone skills before getting into a situation where they could face tier 1. It would also though, make it so playing for an hour and getting tomped does little to lower your own tier away from the tryhards.

I might be wrong, maybe tier jumping is as easy as playing 5 bad matches. but why would they go back to January to establish then?

[Yokaiko]

Eldagore, on 22 August 2015 - 04:32 AM, said:

I might be wrong, maybe tier jumping is as easy as playing 5 bad matches. but why would they go back to January to establish then?

Why not, the longer the period, the more data you have, the more data you have the more accurate the projection for whatever you are trying to accomplish. The question is did PGI break the intended result with the release valves, because I can tell you the group queue is all over the place.

Whether or not that is a consequence of population, poor logic, or what I can't tell you I would need to see the pseudo-code, and you can't get PGI to come off of a number, much less their match making algorithms.

[WANTED]

Buddah, we played ( C4 ) against you in one match last night and then another right after that. If I remember correctly, you're team dominated us 1st match and second one we won? I've noticed that I seemed to be in a tier above and beyond what I normally would be in when playing with my C4 buddies. Most of then are much better than me so it averages me up a bit probably. When I pug last couple of nights only, I have been with same players and games have been much closer. I do more damage. Just my observations.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Tarogato, on 21 August 2015 - 11:23 PM, said:

Who in their right mind would want to play that badly for so long to tank their tier enough just to go seal clubbing?

You know little about real trolls - say... Word of Lowtax... They trolled so hard the mods created the kaekaetoa part of the forums just to contain them. They tried to own Liao and told ppl that they were the rulers of Liao. In TS and on the forums and eventually the forum mods told them the only place they could RP that was in KKT or off topic lol

Wheres the fun in all of that? And that was over a longer time than it would take to game the system

spectralthundr, on 21 August 2015 - 11:49 PM, said:

It doesn't drop you instantly, or after just 10, or even 50 games is what Russ is saying. If one wants to purposely do this, they're going to be tanking for 100's of games and really, why bother?

If thats the case how isnt everyone tier 1 right now?

If it takes 50 to 100 games to adjust, then we should all be only going up as Ive been dropping a lot lately but Ill bet I havent had 50 matches since the change yet.

Also, and maybe worse, youre trying to tell me that this system was designed to mismatch players for hours at a time so that they lose constantly that whole time to 0-12 games against teams they have zero chance of winning against?

That sounds like a serious issue.

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 22 August 2015 - 04:43 AM.

[Viges]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 21 August 2015 - 04:32 PM, said:

... in my **** tier

Im bad, Ill admit it, but Im seeing "pro" teams in the low areas and it seems like theyre gaming their losses just to pwn the bads.

...I miss Elo

They miss elo too!

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Yokaiko, on 22 August 2015 - 02:38 AM, said:

I think that you grossly overestimate the number of players in the group queue. In three hours during US prime we went from literally trash tier teams that couldn't handle or build a mech to SJR and 228....and back.
......

Was in EU server if that matters, grinding out my flag

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

TWIAFU, on 22 August 2015 - 03:50 AM, said:

So everything you want to do to intentionally tank your score as to not face challenging opponents but to roll and not be rolled.

so running into combat and intentionally firing badly to get killed is fine then right? Cause how would the GMs know Im not just a bad shot?

Also; to the question of "why would someone do that"



Those kinds of ppl lol

[spectralthundr]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 04:42 AM, said:

You know little about real trolls - say... Word of Lowtax... They trolled so hard the mods created the kaekaetoa part of the forums just to contain them. They tried to own Liao and told ppl that they were the rulers of Liao. In TS and on the forums and eventually the forum mods told them the only place they could RP that was in KKT or off topic lol

Wheres the fun in all of that? And that was over a longer time than it would take to game the system



If thats the case how isnt everyone tier 1 right now?

If it takes 50 to 100 games to adjust, then we should all be only going up as Ive been dropping a lot lately but Ill bet I havent had 50 matches since the change yet.

Also, and maybe worse, youre trying to tell me that this system was designed to mismatch players for hours at a time so that they lose constantly that whole time to 0-12 games against teams they have zero chance of winning against?

That sounds like a serious issue.

Fact of the matter is, if you thought Tier 1 was only going to play Tier 1, you were lying to yourself off the bat. It's a niche IP to begin with, and the game itself has a learning curve. Until PGI gets a new user experience that better teaches those new to the IP, there will be some that get frustrated and end up not staying long. That being said, I don't know what their player numbers are, but I doubt Tier 1 players want to wait forever to find games. As much as I can't stand the meta myself, that's what that group wants to run and that's fine.

Over all I think the games have been better, I've been in more 12-11 games in just the couple days it's been active than prolly the last year + of playing the game almost daily. If you getting rolled that bad, try leading your pugs, help them out, give them some friendly advice, but don't do it with your usual troll fashion because that's not going to help anyone. Especially the new players that might not yet have a handle on the game itself.

Secondly give it some time, despite it using stats going back to January, it's a new system, it's going to take time for players to be sorted into the tiers they belong in.

[Yokaiko]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 04:44 AM, said:

Was in EU server if that matters, grinding out my flag

I just moved to Japan and only got my computer and internet sorted last week, so I power ground the OC takeover, all categories, and all three servers.

Which basically involved me running in a manner that is basically win it or bin it, caution to the wind, the second I die, next mech, next game, I was basically running three mechs in rotation, KDR went down a bit because I was grinding GI and Huggin at the same time, W/L is up.

Solo seems pretty close, but I think its chocking on the population in the group queue, hence the accusations of sandbagging going around.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

spectralthundr, on 22 August 2015 - 04:50 AM, said:

Fact of the matter is, if you thought Tier 1 was only going to play Tier 1, you were lying to yourself off the bat. It's a niche IP to begin with, and the game itself has a learning curve. Until PGI gets a new user experience that better teaches those new to the IP, there will be some that get frustrated and end up not staying long. That being said, I don't know what their player numbers are, but I doubt Tier 1 players want to wait forever to find games. As much as I can't stand the meta myself, that's what that group wants to run and that's fine.

Over all I think the games have been better, I've been in more 12-11 games in just the couple days it's been active than prolly the last year + of playing the game almost daily. If you getting rolled that bad, try leading your pugs, help them out, give them some friendly advice, but don't do it with your usual troll fashion because that's not going to help anyone. Especially the new players that might not yet have a handle on the game itself.

Secondly give it some time, despite it using stats going back to January, it's a new system, it's going to take time for players to be sorted into the tiers they belong in.

and I seriously doubt my friend will be in the game that long with hours long losing streaks against guys we cant hope to win against

[spectralthundr]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 04:56 AM, said:

and I seriously doubt my friend will be in the game that long with hours long losing streaks against guys we cant hope to win against

You don't think it could possibly be your skill levels being a detriment to your team? If you're losing that much, I doubt it's everyone else that's always the cause for it. Not trying to give you crap just throwing it out there. If your friend is completely new to the game that might not be helping either.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Then again, if it takes hundreds of losses to change tiers then that makes more sense as then everyone would end up in tier 1 and would stay in tier 1 until they hit a point where they has a hundreds games losing streak to normalize them...

Yeah I dont think even I could handle that

[spectralthundr]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 05:11 AM, said:

Then again, if it takes hundreds of losses to change tiers then that makes more sense as then everyone would end up in tier 1 and would stay in tier 1 until they hit a point where they has a hundreds games losing streak to normalize them...

Yeah I dont think even I could handle that

I doubt it's put everyone in Tier 1, I believe new players start in Tier 4.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

spectralthundr, on 22 August 2015 - 05:05 AM, said:

You don't think it could possibly be your skill levels being a detriment to your team? If you're losing that much, I doubt it's everyone else that's always the cause for it. Not trying to give you crap just throwing it out there. If your friend is completely new to the game that might not be helping either.

He's been playing as long as I have

And if im so bad (im bad mind you) then why am I getting matched so high? Seems broken to me

spectralthundr, on 22 August 2015 - 05:12 AM, said:

I doubt it's put everyone in Tier 1, I believe new players start in Tier 4.

Riiight but if it takes hundreds of losses to go down then theyd only go up

[Yokaiko]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 05:23 AM, said:

He's been playing as long as I have

And if im so bad (im bad mind you) then why am I getting matched so high? Seems broken to me



Riiight but if it takes hundreds of losses to go down then theyd only go up

To much seal clubbing?

I like the challenge though, which makes me rare.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Yokaiko, on 22 August 2015 - 05:24 AM, said:

To much seal clubbing?

I like the challenge though, which makes me rare.

I like challenge but against teams (like last night) where the second we make enemy contact we lose a whole lance?

Thats suicide not a challenge

But again, Im bad at this game, Ill admit it, I usually run **** builds, so WHY am I being matched against skilled teams?

And is tier 1 can play agaunst up to tier 3 than this was DESIGNED for this seal clubbling lol

[Davegt27]

I been sandbagging since Dec

I am really tier 6 instead of tier 7

[Void Angel]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 21 August 2015 - 08:31 PM, said:

Be nice if Russ told us XD

Will Alexander Garden do?

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 05:23 AM, said:

Riiight but if it takes hundreds of losses to go down then theyd only go up

Not so; why would you jump to that conclusion? You're reasoning from incomplete and false premises: if it takes hundreds of losses to go down, people would only rise inevitably toward the top if it took less to go up. There's no reason to suppose this. Also, as the system was explained in the patch notes thread, you would only go down if you lost and did poorly. If your team manages to carry you, they'd go up, and you'd go down. Likewise, if you did well and the team lost it for you, you would not fall. This may be an oversimplification, since they're wisely not giving us the formulae, but that's the explanation.

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Void Angel, on 22 August 2015 - 07:01 AM, said:

Will Alexander Garden do?

anyone would, yes at least now we know lol

GI JOE...

Void Angel, on 22 August 2015 - 07:01 AM, said:

Will Alexander Garden do?

Not so; why would you jump to that conclusion? You're reasoning from incomplete and false premises: if it takes hundreds of losses to go down, people would only rise inevitably toward the top if it took less to go up. There's no reason to suppose this. Also, as the system was explained in the patch notes thread, you would only go down if you lost and did poorly. If your team manages to carry you, they'd go up, and you'd go down. Likewise, if you did well and the team lost it for you, you would not fall. This may be an oversimplification, since they're wisely not giving us the formulae, but that's the explanation.

well its borked, given that Im bad at this game as already proven and Im being matched against not bad ppl lol

[Kira Onime]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 22 August 2015 - 06:35 AM, said:

I like challenge but against teams (like last night) where the second we make enemy contact we lose a whole lance?

yeah..... 'bout that....