177 replies to this topic

[Thunder Child]

... When every other mech in the game does likewise with other weapon systems.
You have Laser Boats, PPC Boats, Gauss Boats, UAC/AC Boats, SRM Boats, Short Range Boats, Long Range Boats, you get the idea.
The point is, every other weapon system in the game works best when boated, either with more of the same, or with something that has a comparable range bracket, firing profile, or damage output.
So why is it, that ONLY LRMs are considered BAD when boated. And before the Olympians descend from Mount Tryhard, I'm not referring to how bad the LRM system is in competitive play. I realize that LRMs are a badly designed weapon system (in general) and only a few can make them work in the competitive circuit.
I'm referring to the number of players that seem to think LRMs should only be a Token or "Support" Weapon. Something that they throw into a build when they have a spare 7 tons. Now, I'm not saying that is a bad thing. Being a Super Stock Lore Buff, I quite often throw a Large Laser or AC 5 onto a build that probably can't make good use of it. But that is not the point.

The TL:DR, why are LRMs the ONLY weapon that players believe SHOULD NOT BE ALLOWED TO BOAT (despite there being multiple precedents of LRM Boats in Lore), when it is considered common sense for every other weapon to be boated.

Curious to see the reasoning for this phenomenon.

Edit: The reason I ask, is because in multiple threads I've read recently, it seems to be a common consensus that LRMs should not be allowed to boat.

Edited by Thunder Child, 31 August 2015 - 02:11 PM.

[Lorian Sunrider]

False.

You shouldn't solo Pug drop with an LRM Boat. There are a few pilots who are skilled enough that I trust if I see their name in Puglandia that they are the exception to the rule.

If you are with a team and coordinate you can do whatever you like.

Edit: To be more fair its just to be polite to other pilots. There is nothing more frustrating than seeing an assault mech as nothing but an LRM boat do little to no damage on your team.

Edited by Lorian Sunrider, 31 August 2015 - 02:17 PM.

[Bilbo]

If it works for you, it's not a bad thing. Doesn't matter what the forum consensus might be.

[Gas Guzzler]

There is no winning competitive team that will use LRMs. See the loadouts of SJR and EmP when they went at it for the MWOLN finals. It has nothing to do with being skilled enough to do it, it is only that there are much more efficient ways of killing mechs.

Otherwise, there is nothing really wrong with boating LRMs. Do whatever you want to enjoy the game. You may get flack from people if you brought an LRM boat assault, because most people would prefer to have Assaults with more direct fire weapons so they can use their armor and killing power more directly. Additionally, you might have matches once in a while where you and a few of your teammates are primarily involved in the battle while half the team is sitting back waiting for locks. This is a bad situation because if the other team decides to push, they will have no problem goring you and your teammates, while the LRM boats only have a chance to get a few volleys of LRMs out before they are also overrun and wrecked by the enemy team's push.

In the latter situation, expressions that are negative and derogatory towards LRM boats are common place.

[Yellonet]

I often try to play scout and give targets for LRMs, but lately LRM boats are a rare sight...
When you don't have ECM or Radar deprivation, getting rained upon is extremely irritating...

Edited by Yellonet, 31 August 2015 - 02:24 PM.

[Chados]

Yellonet, on 31 August 2015 - 02:23 PM, said:

I often try to play scout and give targets for LRMs, but lately LRM boats are a rare sight...
When you don't have ECM or Radar deprivation, getting rained upon is extremely irritating...

Yellonet has spotted for me once or twice though I don't think he knew it was me

He's a very good spotter.

[Yellonet]

Chados, on 31 August 2015 - 02:34 PM, said:

Yellonet has spotted for me once or twice though I don't think he knew it was me

He's a very good spotter.

I didn't know But you give me too much credit, sir.

[Kira Onime]

Sub-optimal weapons system.

[DAYLEET]

To be fair, lrm boat arent bad, it's the people who drive them that tend to be. When they persist in staying 500 meters away from the group, have so much ammo they dont have 1 laser to defend themselves, use chain fire with lrm 5 or 10 to be sure to do as little damage as possible and spread it as much as possible and generally ask you to hold lock which makes them looks like it's their first day playing it's annoying to have them on your side and they have a negative effect on the the moral of their team.

I pilot lrm boat and this is what i found about using lrm ,they can be deadly and suppression fire really is a thing in mwo but you better be ready to be self reliant or you are negating other players in your team.

[Otto Cannon]

Because although an LRM boat can decimate a team of bads who can't use cover, a halfway decent team with ECM will be on them before they can lock on or hit anything- and then they're useless at close range.

[Evan20k]

LRMs can be extremely effective weapons, regardless of if they're boated. Due to the cover-based nature of playing against them, a single good LRM mech defines what areas the enemy can and can't move relative to your team. For example, on say Crimson, an LRM mech on top of the bridge makes peaking over the hillside much riskier which funnels the enemy team to either play more conservatively from the buildings or push the fight to underneath the underpass where your team can more effectively engage them. When people are funneled into a death trap by their inability to move to other areas by LRM mechs, they don't tend to attribute the death to the LRMs, but think "Damn that OP 80-alpha DWF watching that choke" when frequently it may have been the area denial that the LRM mech created that funneled the player into the DWF.

[Jman5]

Usually it's the other way around. People say you have to boat LRMs or don't bother. I don't agree that it's necessary, but it is the conventional wisdom about LRMs.

Or do you mean pure LRMs? Pure lrms is trouble because people will beeline you and get under your minimum range. At least some back up weapons will make them consider their options a little more carefully.

[Vlad Ward]

It's not that boating LRMs is bad.

It's that LRMs are bad.

Boating them is just carrying more of a bad thing.

[Novakaine]

Well I tend to put lrms on every mech I own.
But I hardly ever boat them.
That's just dumb.
Some matches are good some are bad.


But for all the lrm haters.
And ya know I just had too

[DYSEQTA]

Thunder Child, on 31 August 2015 - 02:10 PM, said:

it seems to be a common consensus that LRMs should not be allowed to boat.

I have a personal example of why it shouldn't be done. I took out an LRM Boat Stalker on River City the other day from fresh to dead with no effort whatsoever in an Arctic Cheetah. It was easy and I took 0 damage for my efforts, walk up to Stalker, stay inside 180 and shoot while watching the endless attempts at backpedaling and rage shots doing nothing.

Easy pickings because A: no weapons to defend itself with and, B: Because it was lingering at the back so was easy to pin down with no team support.

It's just dumb. In my opinion LRMs are a supplementary weapon system that are great for harassing enemies psychologically, softening targets, and great for taking down running foes but should never really be considered primary systems unless it is a build with a specific role in an organised team where you know your teammates will be supporting you in that role. In PUGs bring another mech.... please...

Edited by DYSEQTA, 31 August 2015 - 03:04 PM.

[Soy]

is this a real thread

lol

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Why it isnt a bad thing

Because the Catapult literally wouldnt exist

Soy, on 31 August 2015 - 03:03 PM, said:

is this a real thread

lol

welcome to day two of closed beta

Edited by Mechwarrior Buddah, 31 August 2015 - 03:08 PM.

[Clownwarlord]

The issue with lrms isn't really themselves but that you rely on others to help get you locks. Otherwise you lose the bonus of being able to be in cover and do damage when you have to go and get your own locks.

Other issues is ecm is in abundant in game due to just about every other clan mech has ecm, and until they limit it to 40m bubble or smaller the issue will just continue.

[aniviron]

I think it tends to have a lot to do with the kinds of people who bring LRM boats, too.

If there's someone who knows what they're doing in a HBK-4J LRM boat or someone in a Kitfox or Shadowcat with LRMs, that's great. At 30-50 tons, bringing 20-30 tubes of quirked LRMs can be a real asset to your team- you're not great at sustained close engagement with that little armor, and you can put up some decent damage numbers with LRMs that way.

Then there's the people bringing 40 tubes of LRMs on an Atlas or King Crab or what have you. You've barely got more firepower than a medium, and you're occupying an assault slot. More to the point, heavies and assaults are supposed to take damage. A huge part of being good at heavier mechs is taking damage and staying alive so that your teammates can fire at the enemy while the enemy fires at you. If you're in an LRM assault, instead of your 600-armor assault taking damage, your lights and mediums are getting chewed up and spit out while you sit in the back, doing the same thing that a mech 50 tons lighter than you could do just as well.

[LordNothing]

its bad because you have zero defense from short range attacks. throw on some small lasers or streaks or whatever you need to defeat lights. of course then you are no longer boating lerms and are running a respectable build. boating can work if you stick with your team and have good spotters, but dont whine when a locust takes out your racks with small pulse lasers.