86 replies to this topic

[Zakatak]

Sorry, but the idea of no-respawn games doesn't appeal to me at all. I've played World of Tanks, and though it encourages smart play, the cons outweigh the pros. When you start out, and you have 1 mech and a poor connection, and get your *** whooped within 2 minutes, NOBODY is going to want to continue playing. MWO will have a steady influx of 0 new players per month.

So here is my idear.

When you die in the field, you can call on MFB's will come to repair you. They are invincible, for gameplays sake, but being fired upon will slow the repairing process. The repair time is 20 seconds for the CT, and +10 seconds for every other destroyed component. If your leg has been shot off, but you aren't dead, you can request MFB's too. A limited number of MFB's are on your team at a time, so if you all happen to die at once, expect to be waiting quite awhile (or just lose the match).

For the animation? The MW3 style won't work since you aren't standing up, and animating a whole ground would take too long (as well as be unrealistic time-wise). Just have some machinery like plasma-torches or ion-molecular lasers do work on the damaged areas.

[Stormwolf]

Gotta disagree with this.

There should be no MFB's or repairs on the Battlefield. The game is about tactical battles where you need to take out the enemy as efficiently as possible. Adding in respawns (or repairs as mentioned it) is gonna degenerate this into a braindead deathmatch.

People who get killed within 2 minutes are probably not playing very smart.

Edited by Stormwolf, 27 November 2011 - 01:49 PM.

[ChooChooBot]

I disagree also. MechWarrior is about being smart and crushing your opponent. You get one chance and thats it. I remember being in intense matches with friends and family hoping not to get my Mech blown apart. This game would lose its strategic value if there were respawns or repairs...

[Jacob]

Depending on the map there could be option to call a dropship or whatever with new mech for you, but only in case you or your team have one in stock, altough i think its unnecessary and might change gameplay style from tactical battle into kill em all.

[Black Sunder]

Zakatak, on 27 November 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

I've played World of Tanks, and though it encourages smart play, the cons outweigh the pros. When you start out, and you have 1 mech and a poor connection, and get your *** whooped within 2 minutes, NOBODY is going to want to continue playing. MWO will have a steady influx of 0 new players per month.

By cons do you mean the uber bad spotting and camo system? Or do you mean the romulan cloaking devices? The matchmaker? The lemmings or the lack of developer comments on issues and dedication to real problems?

Here is what respawns devolve into: Run to the enemy. Alpha them. Die. Repeat.

[Hunter McGee]

How about something in between? Possible MFB's in a distant location. Off map maybe. Or MW4 style repair bays few and far between maybe at strategic locations. Just some thoughts.

[John Clavell]

There are a lot of people who want no-respawn in the MechWarrior community, myself included. The type of game it creates, leans towards a slower, more tactical approach. Your life has a lot more meaning, and you need to work as a team. However, there are many people who like a more carefree and fast paced deathmatch, which reflects pop games like CoD or BF3. It's up to the developers to provide game match types with no-respawn, and respawn. There is no point arguing if MWO should be no-respawn or not, It should included both!

[DCleric]

Seriously, we're going to have scout and fire support capabilities and we're not going to target an MFB? that's a prime target. I'm not letting my MFB's on a battlefield I don't totally control. I'll take the hit on limited sources already engaged first. they would be too valuable to lose. I don't think the matches will run long enough to require respawning. I think everyone will get plenty of play without it. This is however just my opinion. Now I don't have a problem if people want to death match on their own and not part of a league or something. Look at the pods. However when it's for control of a planet or even just a territory, I want a fixed number of mechs I've got to destroy or drive off. Again, just my opinion.

[SGT Unther]

I believe it should be depend on the game mode, give people who want respawns a team death match game and possibly a normal conquest game however, people who don't want to play with a respawn should be able to select something similar to a hardcore mode. This could also be facilitated having respawn as an option you can turn off or on before a match is started.

[CobraFive]

You should just respawn at a designated safe zone on the side of the map. Alternatively, capturable spawn points, battlefield style.

No reason to get fancy like this, people are willing to suspend their disbelief, respawns are something we understand as gamers.

I'd also like to see respawns depend on the game mode. Without respawns, every match is simply deathmatch, and I prefer objective-based gameplay. But I have fun in both types.

[Blackfire1]

I made a small list of ideals to apply respawning in the first respawning thread. Infact there are many good ideas for implementation of respawns in that thread. I have a feeling you were too lazy to take the time and read them. Seeing as this post is a duplicate.

The point being you have to look at it from a gameply perspective. How long are the matches going to last? Whats the theme/rules applied to them?(ctf,king of the hill, assault ect) Are they large 5v5 or 30 vs 30 matches? And general stat crunching via Maximum drop weight per player/lance/star/company ect.

Depending on the answer will dictate the need and variability for respawning. If the matches are long but have short rounds respawning wouldn't be much of an issue. However if your in a 30-40 minute match with no rounds and you get kill in the first 5 minutes it would utterly suck from a gameplay and fun factor to have to wait 25-30 minutes. This would kill the game for new players and thus new income. And sorry folks but "Play smarter" is NOT a good answer. Because there is always uncontrollable variables known as luck. I don't care if your a professional game player in MLG. Those uncontrollable variables WILL eat your face when you least expect it. For a new player that wants to get use to the learning curve this is a bad thing. Since there will be no player vs AI on launch there isn't a place for Newbies to practice. Many people will disagree, but League of Legends and this game have some very similar things going on.

*One idea was to let people bring in multiple mechs as long as they fit under the drop weight requirement. If that person ejects in time they have a pick up and transport "cooldown" To get their next vehicles. If they DON'T eject in time... well the pilot is "injured" for the rest of the match.

So if the current round time is ~20 minutes. Say 5 minutes are travel time and tactical movement the rest is combat. I would say both limited number respawn and no respawn options would be viable.

Possible types of respawn:
*Search and rescue option: Eject and a light mech has to find you to get you back on the field.
*Multiple Mech option: Being multiple mechs that are under the drop weight. 45sec to 1 min respawn time to get to your next mech.
*HQ respawns: 45 second to 2 min timer on respawning back at HQ. Time depends on how close combat is and how safely salvage will get your gear. Every "respawn" give you a jury-rigged mech that's only slightly worst then your origonal. However all that jruy rigging has caused extra repair cost after the match.
OR
Normal respawning like every other game. Spawn timer is in the minutes due to balancing.

My ideas were as followed (copy and paste from my origonal post)

Should there be some sort of "respawn" in the middle of Longer 20-50 minute matches? Yes.
A) Noone likes to wait around.
B ) That would make for a boring game in longer matches.
C) It could very well be implimented with the wait timer being mid battle salvage & rescue. OR make it so your teams light mech has to play pick me up. Giving them points/xp/credits for doing so in exchange for bringing back a team mate. Think like catching a ball in Dodge ball. You put yourself in the line of fire for the slim chance of bringing back a comrade.

Heck you could even add the idea of mid mission mobile HQ/depot. Each teams base has different buildings that give different advantages. Detroy the hanger and its add +15 secounds to respawn/rearm. Detroy the communications relay and your team loses battlefield intel. This base would be defended enough a light mech or three couldn't take it out but a combo of a light and two mediums could given time.

Edited by Blackfire1, 27 November 2011 - 02:28 PM.

[SJ SCP Wolf]

I was thinking that game mode should dictate respawn availability and quantity.

[Black Sunder]

From the dev QnA:

Quote

I assume that game play will be in the form of some type of match system. If so, how long would you estimate a typical match would last?


[PAUL] Right now we’re thinking a normal match with objectives would take approximately 20 minutes. But please keep in mind, this number might change through gameplay testing.

[CG Anastasius Focht]

Jacob, on 27 November 2011 - 01:54 PM, said:

Depending on the map there could be option to call a dropship or whatever with new mech for you, but only in case you or your team have one in stock, altough i think its unnecessary and might change gameplay style from tactical battle into kill em all.

Being able to call in a Leopard Class Dropship with a new mount (if you own one) sounds like a good idea

[Semyon Drakon]

I believe that you get one ride per game for the sale of reality. The actual battles won't be that long initially, though I am hoping to see multiple unit engagements over hours in the future.

I think that dropships are the best way of giving you a base to work from AND a location you need to defend, even as the attacker. What use if achieving your objective if someone has snuck up to the dropper, TAG'd it and rained Arrow IV missiles all over it?

Semyon

[dm5k]

A death match with respawn type of game would be super boring because everyone would jump into an assault mech with some heavy's mixed in. It would be no different from a mindless shooter like call of duty.

[Kallian Ryke]

It's good that people are thinking of new ways, but this particular one...

Having MFB's repair your mech in the field results in respawning directly where you died. In close urban fights (which the game will unquestionably develop into fairly often) it would be entirely likely that you would then be respawning behind the enemy line, which had moved past your corpse by that point. You'd get an awesome position to flank them - positive reinforcement for dieing. By the same token, they could just wait by your corpse and kill you as soon as the MFB's repair you, tying these MFB's up indefinitely and resulting you getting your *** handed to you repeatedly.

Now, being reinforced via dropship... that is worth discussing, because it actually does have grounds in the way battles work in-universe. I am still against the "no penalties" stance on dieing, which respawns virtually guarantee, but you have to admit that dropships would be an interesting addition. Even if you just pick, say, three mechs for a match and switch to the next on death. (I'm also against entirely losing the mech if it is both destroyed and you lose - the EVE theory seems too harsh to me for a free-to-play mech simulator)

Edited by Kallian Ryke, 27 November 2011 - 03:32 PM.

[Pan]

Zakatak, on 27 November 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

Sorry, but the idea of no-respawn games doesn't appeal to me at all. I've played World of Tanks, and though it encourages smart play, the cons outweigh the pros. When you start out, and you have 1 mech and a poor connection, and get your *** whooped within 2 minutes, NOBODY is going to want to continue playing. MWO will have a steady influx of 0 new players per month.

So here is my idear.

When you die in the field, you can call on MFB's will come to repair you. They are invincible, for gameplays sake, but being fired upon will slow the repairing process. The repair time is 20 seconds for the CT, and +10 seconds for every other destroyed component. If your leg has been shot off, but you aren't dead, you can request MFB's too. A limited number of MFB's are on your team at a time, so if you all happen to die at once, expect to be waiting quite awhile (or just lose the match).

For the animation? The MW3 style won't work since you aren't standing up, and animating a whole ground would take too long (as well as be unrealistic time-wise). Just have some machinery like plasma-torches or ion-molecular lasers do work on the damaged areas.

Not believable. No thanks.

[Belrick]

Zakatak, on 27 November 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

Sorry, but the idea of no-respawn games doesn't appeal to me at all. I've played World of Tanks, and though it encourages smart play, the cons outweigh the pros. When you start out, and you have 1 mech and a poor connection, and get your *** whooped within 2 minutes, NOBODY is going to want to continue playing. MWO will have a steady influx of 0 new players per month.

No respawning round base gameplay encourages smart, creative, and therefor fun gameplay. That pro can never be outweighed. Counterstrike is no respawn. Is that a bad game? Is it a small game? Nope. No respawn can work to make a good popular game, one that encourages smart gameplay, and make money.

Zakatak, on 27 November 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

So here is my idear.


When you die in the field, you can call on MFB's will come to repair you. They are invincible, for gameplays sake, but being fired upon will slow the repairing process. The repair time is 20 seconds for the CT, and +10 seconds for every other destroyed component. If your leg has been shot off, but you aren't dead, you can request MFB's too. A limited number of MFB's are on your team at a time, so if you all happen to die at once, expect to be waiting quite awhile (or just lose the match).

So the devs need to make animations and stuff for an entirely new kind of vehicle? And this vehicle is invincible? So if my Atlas dies in the thick of fighting, 20 seconds later and I am back in the fight? This is already too complicated, demanding.

Zakatak, on 27 November 2011 - 01:34 PM, said:

For the animation? The MW3 style won't work since you aren't standing up, and animating a whole ground would take too long (as well as be unrealistic time-wise). Just have some machinery like plasma-torches or ion-molecular lasers do work on the damaged areas.

So to make it not an overly complicated mechanic, you kill all semblance of immersion? Doesn't sound good to me.

I cannot say I support this idea.

[Malavai Fletcher]

I dont see the need for any respawn at all,i would hope this game evolves into a massive unit v unit scenario.I can see why people would want to be able to jump in another mech but to me it seems a bit unbelievable.

I would expect eventually that people will be playing with unit mates and friends,so if you die early its not like you are sitting there twiddiling your thumbs waiting for the match to end,you can allways talk to people,gee em on and all that.Adding an ability to see through your team mates who are still alive mechs should be used,but make the view from inside the cockpit fixed so they cant be a second pair of eyes looking behind or either side of the mech.

I played alot in a league and sometimes we would lose someone very early on but it was quite rare,but if someone is being killed quickly in games fairly often then really they should brush up on tactics a bit better or maybe play a game more suited to them.