315 replies to this topic

[RoyalWave]

Make them more expensive to field!
this is just the definition of p2w, all good clan pilots will just have premium accounts and mechs.

Less numerically
why would I want to play on the side where my impact is less? When I could go pilot a mech that gets more kills and overall has more fun? Most people would pick the more powerful (fun) side.

People love the look of clan mechs, they like the lore in some cases, and it's good to bring them in. At the same time I think everyone should realize, the canon of "just way better" should not be brought over to mwo.

The answer is really simple. Inner sphere, mech for mech, should be balanced with clan. This means "clan tech" needs to have drawbacks, not just faster, more firepower, and more armor. THey need offsetting heat, more critical space, etc. Thats the only way the clan vs IS choice will ever work. Zellbrigen coding will just create a "how to abuse this system" and really has never worked in a single game.

Give IS "lostech" aka all comstar stuff, while nerfing clan power/heat/range/speed a bit.


That way clans can have their iconic looking mechs etc and some distinctiveness tech wise, without having to be a balancing nightmare.

The "Just better" canon doesn't work in video games. There has to be balance and parity in games like this regardless of canon. I think it's already time to start getting people who want to go clan to understand they wont just be "better".

Also you will have people investing in legendary/mechs/unlocks/premiums/skins/faction unlocks etc. If all the sudden a new just better side shows up.. it's gonna cause a lot of remorse about those purchases as a madcat demolishes their worse in every way catapult or awesome.

Edited by RoyalWave, 28 June 2012 - 04:28 PM.

[Lightdragon]

...or we could just not have clans, all the clans attract is people with god complexes, horrible roleplayers, and ignorant noobs that dont even bother to read up on the history of the bt universe

[Corpsecandle]

As concerned as I know the community is regarding the clans, there's still A LOT to get done before we get there. We haven't even seen how they intend to introduce them, and we've received no word that they even intend to make them playable.

That said I don't think balancing them mech for mech is the way to go or else they just wouldn't be clan. There's too much lore, too much attachment to what it means to be a clanner vs innersphere, and that is all in part tied to the tech differences. Making them the 'balanced' seems too much like a coppout. (aand light dragon just proved my point! This game would no longer be for BTech fans, if they made the clanners the same as the innersphere for the sake of 'balance')


Edit: using lightdragon's post to prove my point!

Edited by Corpsecandle, 28 June 2012 - 04:37 PM.

[SinnerX]

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

The "Just better" canon doesn't work in video games. There has to be balance and parity in games like this regardless of canon. I think it's already time to start getting people who want to go clan to understand they wont just be "better".

Sure it does. Just make it a dev event. They get to stomp around in super OP mechs, and we'll try our darnedest to bring one down.

At the end of the event, they can release new equipment for IS, and make the clans playable factions.

Or whatever. I'm sure the devs are considering everything and probably already have a better plan in place. They probably had most of it planned out before they even started programming.

[BFalcon]

They'll balance it somehow.

Most likely, being outnumbered will be the way to go (and I'm talking tonnage, not just numbers) - if they can force the enemy to follow suit then they can win most times. If they get ganged up on, the IS mechs should swing it.

I don't want to see artificial boosting or nerfing of anything "just because" - some of us are looking forward to the challenge of fighting the clan mechs.

Typically, also, clan mechs don't fare so well in a close-in brawl, as opposed to at range, where the clanners seem to dominate.

[Greyrook]

Clan tech isn't literally "more powerful." Generally it is lighter, so you can fit more of it on the same tonnage mech, and has a longer range (e.g. ER lasers are usually a ton lighter and 100m increased range). But whenever there's a damage increase, it comes with a heat increase that is usually proportional to IS tech (at least if it is similar to how it was in MW4). IS does have lore-friendly competitive solutions like heavy lasers and other stuff. I wouldn't worry too much about it, or demand everything be flat equal.

[BFalcon]

Also, they can make it so that we'll lose against them most times (whoopee) but end up winning big time on the cash and XP fronts - a win doesn't necessarily need to be an actual win - dealing enough damage while losing can just be enough.

[grimzod]

Search is your friend. There are probably a half a hundred threads asking for the clan crap. Just wait.

[Vaktor]

The last thing I want them to do is nerf clan mechs even if it means that I am not able to pilot a clan mech.

[Insidious Johnson]

l o l o m g w t f n o

[Bluey]

Lightdragon, on 28 June 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

...or we could just not have clans, all the clans attract is people with god complexes, horrible roleplayers, and ignorant noobs that dont even bother to read up on the history of the bt universe

Wasnt that abit harsh ?

To OP
YOU CANNOT NERF SOMETHING SHOULD BE POWERFULL IN FIRST PLACE

its like nerf Baneblade for Imperial Guard .... so Orks can win *no wrong*
Orks have tankbustas *anti tank unit* if you say they are no match face to face;True
they are no match but Tankbustas have camouflage to surprise them.

I just watched a Dow2 match. Losing team said fff balance Baneblade too strong WELL duh sending 5 tanks vs a tank killer never works.

... There are alternatives for fighting... They are called military tactics and being native to the ground knowing the enviroment,turning it into your advantage which can be applied a game like this easily.

Nerf is for xbox gamers and other social games
Each time I look at a game forums are like this
Buff Aug ... Now too strong Nerf it ... No it was alright buff it back

We old school guys prefer realism over nerfes I guess
We just gotta teach old ways to new mechwarriors

Edited by Bluey, 28 June 2012 - 04:54 PM.

[Alexander Diaz]

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Make them more expensive to field!
this is just the definition of p2w, all good clan pilots will just have premium accounts and mechs.

Agree with the fact that they have to be more expensive to field. Disagree with limiting them to premium accounts. Point of Free-to-Play is that it becomes "Un-Fun-to-Play" when people can buy their victories.

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Less numerically
why would I want to play on the side where my impact is less? When I could go pilot a mech that gets more kills and overall has more fun? Most people would pick the more powerful (fun) side.

I agree that there should be less Clan mechs fielded (If Clan mechs ever get fielded). This can be done simply by making them incredibly expensive to field and repair. I disagree with your definition of fun. Getting a ton of kills in an overpowered mech might be fun for you but not to the community at large. Your kill does not equal my fun, especially when I'm the one getting trumped. Also, some players have "fun" by being challenged and discovering how to overcome the pros and cons of each mech design.

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Zellbrigen coding will just create a "how to abuse this system" and really has never worked in a single game.

Not true! Worked very well in Clan Homeworlds, a MegaMek server now long gone. But we upheld Zell for many years. Had a Circle of Equals and everything for violations. Course, That's me being a little...whats the word? Many people haven't even heard of MegaMek (It's pretty cool, look it up).

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

The answer is really simple. Inner sphere, mech for mech, should be balanced with clan. This means "clan tech" needs to have drawbacks, not just faster, more firepower, and more armor. THey need offsetting heat, more critical space, etc. Thats the only way the clan vs IS choice will ever work.

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

The "Just better" canon doesn't work in video games. There has to be balance and parity in games like this regardless of canon. I think it's already time to start getting people who want to go clan to understand they wont just be "better".

That's kinda the point with the clans. They are "Just Better". Technologically in every way. It's like... 1970's US Army vs. 2012 US Army. InnerSphere is just less technologically advanced, though they do eventually start closing the gap but, that's going to be a while down the road mate, as that 1 day in MWO will be 1 day in Battletech Universe/Lore.

I know people love their clan tech. Hell, I'm a Snow Raven, through and through, but I think we're going to have to wait on the Clan toys. And the Devs are going to have to be really careful when implementing it. Part of the challenge we faced on the old MegaMek/MekTek servers involved this very topic. "How do we balance Clan Tech". It's easier said then done but I've enjoyed your post! Some things to think about!

[Roguewolf]

RoyalWave, on 28 June 2012 - 04:27 PM, said:

Make them more expensive to field!
this is just the definition of p2w, all good clan pilots will just have premium accounts and mechs.

Less numerically
why would I want to play on the side where my impact is less? When I could go pilot a mech that gets more kills and overall has more fun? Most people would pick the more powerful (fun) side.

People love the look of clan mechs, they like the lore in some cases, and it's good to bring them in. At the same time I think everyone should realize, the canon of "just way better" should not be brought over to mwo.

The answer is really simple. Inner sphere, mech for mech, should be balanced with clan. This means "clan tech" needs to have drawbacks, not just faster, more firepower, and more armor. THey need offsetting heat, more critical space, etc. Thats the only way the clan vs IS choice will ever work. Zellbrigen coding will just create a "how to abuse this system" and really has never worked in a single game.

Give IS "lostech" aka all comstar stuff, while nerfing clan power/heat/range/speed a bit.


That way clans can have their iconic looking mechs etc and some distinctiveness tech wise, without having to be a balancing nightmare.

The "Just better" canon doesn't work in video games. There has to be balance and parity in games like this regardless of canon. I think it's already time to start getting people who want to go clan to understand they wont just be "better".

Also you will have people investing in legendary/mechs/unlocks/premiums/skins/faction unlocks etc. If all the sudden a new just better side shows up.. it's gonna cause a lot of remorse about those purchases as a madcat demolishes their worse in every way catapult or awesome.

Sure, I can deal with this one, one point. You would have to wait two to three years for that to happen. Once the updated weapons systems and mods for IS mechs, not to mention salvaged tech and chassis from the clans, then yes. Before that it not only breaks the lore of the universe, but also ruins the idea of faction warfare. Faction v Faction is almost always about one side having an advantage vs one side with different advantages. Clans , better gear, better one on one warriors, better over capabilities in combat. IS , centuries of warfare, better group tactics, far greater numbers. Notice in most battles that once the forces of the IS got pulled together under commanders that knew what they were doing, the Clans got nailed. Oh, and the IS was a lot more sneaky. Hard to program that last part.

[ScrapIron Prime]

Agreed. Make clan more expensive to field, and make mixed tech available to IS by that time, and the clan advantage will be minimal.

[Akula]

Lightdragon, on 28 June 2012 - 04:32 PM, said:

...or we could just not have clans, all the clans attract is people with god complexes, horrible roleplayers, and ignorant noobs that dont even bother to read up on the history of the bt universe

Bluey, on 28 June 2012 - 04:44 PM, said:

Wasnt that abit harsh ?

There is some truth in it though...

[Blizzard36]

I think it would be interesting to bring in the Clans as CPU controlled forces, be the PvE content. I've always wanted to play out the Clan Invasion. You have to admit the Zellbrigen focus on one target philosophy would be much easier to code AI wise than normal tactics.

[Rejarial Galatan]

Balancing Clan 'Mechs and technology item for item and 'Mech for 'Mech is a good way to upset a lot of players. Making them a non player faction would be the straw that breaks the camels back. Doing anything less than staying true to canon and lore and not giving those of us the ability to play or charging us more to field or repair clan machina is going to cause a lot of players to leave the game. I am sorry if this offends the die hard IS players but you ask more than is reasoable when you say we clanners need to be dumbed down in the name of balance or demand we pay more to play how we want. We do not ask this of you, why ask it of us?

[Reported for Inappropriate Name]

clan mechs are advanced, but not unbeatabe or overpowered. If anything they are just well trained fighters in well built machines, but that won't stop a large laser or two.

[Rejarial Galatan]

ScrapIron Prime, on 28 June 2012 - 04:48 PM, said:

Agreed. Make clan more expensive to field, and make mixed tech available to IS by that time, and the clan advantage will be minimal.

And how do you explain the majority of innersphere forces having rare clan tech at the start of the invasion?

[Alexander Diaz]

Rejarial Galatan, on 28 June 2012 - 04:53 PM, said:

And how do you explain the majority of innersphere forces having rare clan tech at the start of the invasion?

Woah! That's news to me! Sources! Sources! I thumb my nose at this statement and declare it an untruth!