222 replies to this topic

[Kuaron]

I'm playing in low tiers yet. ^^ How does LRM usage differ in higher, why do you use AMS there less?
Because more people rely on radar deprivation and battles contain less peeking here and there and more major confrontations (so less time for LRM-peeing on other Mechs)? Just a guess.

[Void Angel]

Well, actually an LRM boat wants there to be major confrontations instead of peeking - that's where he shines. In general, though, many players tend to use less AMS as they progress because fewer players are using LRMs. Radar Deprivation is part of that, but the reality is that LRMs don't scale linearly with skill. As you start out, many players will be rather inept at dealing with incoming LRM fire, which makes LRMs an excellent choice for new players to feel powerful and effective while still learning the ropes. Aditionally, LRMs are very inefficient killers, so you get a lot of damage spread out over the enemy for every kill - which can get you a lot of C-bills and experience.

However, once players start getting into the middle skill levels they will begin to figure out the counter play for LRMs. They'll move under cover, bring ECM, and aggressively seek out spotters and UAVs. This is hard on LRM users, because thus far they've only had to lock a target and whale away; the only risk was straying too far from the group and getting harassed by Lights. Now they have to pick up the more difficult skills of positioning and fire discipline - which can be hard to do if they're piloting a Big, Slow Missile Boat. So the effectiveness of LRMs drop off, for reasons that are not totally obvious to the LRM user - this is where many players abandon the weapon system for direct-fire options.

At high levels, though, you can still use LRMs - usually top-skilled players use faster platforms - because the skill of the player means more than the capabilities of the weapon system. That's not to say the differences in capability are trivial, however; most players in top levels of play prefer direct-fire weapons - because those weapons are objectively more effective.

I'm Tier 2 (which does not directly correlate to skill) right now - but I still mount AMS on every mech that can fit it without borking the build. The reason I do this is twofold:

• I still see LRMs with reasonable frequency
  
• Even if I don't see LRMs, the 1.5 tons I spent to bring it are a trivial investment on most 'mechs.

Some players will try to tell you that AMS is not worth the investment, no matter how many enemies are sporting homing rockets. They'll say that an AMS system only kills a few missiles in a volley, and assume that every volley consists of massive missile swarms. I find their arguments lacking. Each individual AMS takes a small chunk out of incoming LRM fire for everyone in its range; this is exactly like the reason mass vaccinations are important. If each AMS averages only 2 missiles, and only eight people have AMS in range, you've still neutralized 16 missiles - even if the enemy 'mech fired a massive, 80-missile volley, you still have 20% damage reduction. Realistically, incoming volleys are not going to be that huge, so if you're seeing LRM boats with any regularity, vaccinate your dang BattleMechs.

Edited by Void Angel, 05 June 2016 - 09:34 PM.

[Kuaron]

OK, I'll think about it. And are there special techniques to avoid LRMs or just run to the next cover when the warning appears, as it's obvious anyway?

[Steel Raven]

Watch for spotters and UAV, it's going to be hard to find cover on allot of maps if the LRM jockey is maintaining a lock and knows how to fire over obstructions. This also makes the Radar Deprivation Module one of the best if not the best.

Other than that, study the maps. I really hate Frozen City for two reasons, 1.) bad spawning points and 2.) very few places offer good cover from LRM fire.

[Void Angel]

Kuaron, on 06 June 2016 - 03:51 AM, said:

OK, I'll think about it. And are there special techniques to avoid LRMs or just run to the next cover when the warning appears, as it's obvious anyway?

LRMs are the reason that Radar Deprivation is a must-have module (along with Seismic Sensor.) Like Steel Raven says, using cover and concealment is the primary defense against LRMs. Of course you should get under cover when you get the incoming alarm; but as you've realized, this is a very obvious and basic technique. Once you're aware that there's an LRM boat on-scene, you ideally want to either get up in his face or else move and fight in locations where spotters have a hard time seeing you. That may mean camping by a corner and just backing up behind it when the Lurmwarrior opens up - but that's basic and obvious, too. The best way is for you and your team to keep moving under covered and concealed routes in order to outmaneuver the enemy team while your lights harass the LRM boat from his rear armor arcs.

[ShadowbaneX]

Audacious Aubergine, on 04 June 2016 - 09:08 PM, said:

This is actually a great idea - thanks for the suggestion
I forgot I had a lot of c-bills racked up over the last month or so

You're welcome, but...

Void Angel, on 05 June 2016 - 07:53 AM, said:

Don't drop the leg armor - strip armor from the arms. Many experienced players have begun to leg Marauders since they're so hard to kill from the front. I'd also keep AMS on your 'mechs whenever you can afford it, at least in the lower tiers - though that depends on how often you see LRMs.

In general, for PUG games I put AMS in every 'mech that can afford it in the build; the damage reduction it provides is sufficient to justify the tonnage, and its effects become more noticeable as you stack more AMS on the team. So you should bring AMS unless you seldom see any LRMs, for the same reason you should vaccinate your kids.

There's a bit of a point here. I suppose that's a YMMV. How the armour is allocated, AMS or no AMS, how many heat sinks are to taste. The main point is that you've got a good deal of space (11 crit slots). Getting some SimCity going on there you can add Endo-Steel which will help alot. I'd drop the AMS, but that's my preference. If you like AMS keep it, if you don't more Heat Sinks or whatever...but get that 300 STD in there.

[Raso]

Ok I'm planning on starting Marauders next. If I don't cave in and snag a BH2 this is what I have planned for my up coming builds.


For the 5D I have a single ERPPC for ranged poking, 4 medium lasers and 2 SRM4s.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...4de99bf261d76cb

For the 5M I have 3 LPLs and 2 MLas because lol lazor spam (honestly I'd love a basaltic build that works with it but the quirks seem too good to pass up.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...bfd90ed7e8f7c50

Lastly I have the 3R. I'm synergising the range of the LPL and MLas along side an AC10.
http://mwo.smurfy-ne...27539269b5d812a

I'm not entire'y sure how I'd utilize a BH2. I feel like it would need an XL to make the most out of it's hardpoints but from what I keep hearing XLs on a Marauder is a big no-no.

[NUSQUAM]

Been loving the MAD since I caved and bought the pack. My only gripe is the is the 5M; I can't find a build that wouldn't be better on the 3R. The JJ are nice sure but... That aside I'm in love with the 3R and BH2.

My 3R has two builds I enjoy. One is AC/20, 2MG, 2LL, 2ML. It's net me 12 kills in a single FP match alone. The 2LL help poke when I need to, the 2MG keep the pressure up and blend insides, and the ML support.

The current build I'm on, trying to make a full hot/cold drop deck, is 3AC/5 and 4ML. Doesn't seem too impressive but chain-firing them with the cooldown mod makes them stream shots. In hot maps against clanners I outlast them and kill them frequently. Then when needed to the alpha can finish off things. The vertical stacking is unexpectedly great. If I do want to fire all three at once at a target moving perpendicular I can. Since there's no lateral convergence I have to worry about they all hit just about anything.

THe BH2 I've turned into pure laser vomit: 2LL, 4ML, STD300 and plenty of DHS. I also bought the corresponding range mods. With those, the quirks, and target info gathering I can stalk the battlefield, disarm, leg, and kill easily. I've done the sniper version with Gauss, 2ERLL, and 4ML and it was quality, but the pure laser build always seems to get me a lot of kills.

The chassis' natural toughness is a huge factor into how I play it. If I have to, alongside clever use of environment, I know I can take down bigger foes. Especially clanners in a protracted fight. Then they have enough range to keep me off the front line while I'm wounded. Inversely their range allows me to stay relatively fresh until the end of the fight/wave and lets me go full tilt into the ending salvo against multiple or bigger foes that are in pieces.

[Steel Raven]

Have you tried the twin LB-10X build for the 5M? Been using a STD 300, 3X Large Pules Laser, 2X Med Laser for my 5D and 5M.

[Audacious Aubergine]

For laughs, I replaced the 3x AC5 on my -3R with 3x AC2 and I've actually been having a blast harassing people with it (also running 4x ML with a std 300).
ATM I have a command console for the zoom bonuses - should I swap it for more ammo instead? Current loadout has 5 tonnes of it and I think I've only run out once in three or four games

Edited by Audacious Aubergine, 12 June 2016 - 05:40 AM.

[Kuaron]

I don't think you need a command console for weapons below ~800 m range.
You can take either more ammo or heavier energy weapons, depending how fast you ran out of ammo.
One option could be a PPC in a one-sided build, s.t. you can save the armour on you blind side arm.
Why PPC? Compare it's quirked projectile velocity with that of AC2.

Edited by Kuaron, 13 June 2016 - 06:27 AM.

[Warboy]

MAD-3R

I run it with target deprivation, LPL range and LB10X cooldown, final module is your call.
the heat sinks in the torso are mostly there to pad out the crit slots, i could easily replace one of those (or one from the engine) with AMS, but i don't find it necessary.
been playing this the past week, and loving every minute of it.

damage numbers are rarely below 400 (crushing defeats aside), but i've included scoreboards of my two highest performance matches so you can see for yourselves how capable this build can be.
Screenshot 1
Screenshot 2
I'm sure a skilled pilot could push these numbers even further.

[Shockwave214]

should I get this guy (3R ver) as my first heavy? or get other IS heavy?

[Steel Raven]

Shockwave214, on 17 September 2016 - 10:04 PM, said:

should I get this guy (3R ver) as my first heavy? or get other IS heavy?

Depends on your play style and weapon preference. I currently use a 2X LB-10X, 4X ML build and it's a great brawler (though the big guns are a easy target for snipers) others prefer the 2X Ultra 5 builds or 3X AC/5 sniper build (not enough punch for myself)

If you prefer energy weapons, the 3D or 3M may be the way to go. Jump Jets also give you little more maneuverability.

[Wedge Red Leader]

Shockwave214, on 17 September 2016 - 10:04 PM, said:

should I get this guy (3R ver) as my first heavy? or get other IS heavy?

I like the 3R, especially for FW. Makes a descent tank, just avoid using XL engines.
You could do a lot worse, that said warhammers are just as good and 5 tons lighter.

Just keep in mind any mech is a PGI brush stroke away from being the favored child.

[krevLL]

Almost done mastering my 3 standard variants (didn't get BH2) and this is what I've found; I cannot get used to dying from a single ST loss so I don't use XLs on these period. It makes me way more conscious of positioning due to the slow speed compared to my MDD's, and the tankiness of a MAD with a standard engine makes me feel like an assault.

Also a huge fan of triple AC2's. It's just so glorious at range.

[Darkhorse13Golf]

I've found the Marauder to be tough and nasty. Just picked up the 5M and am trying a just for fun build. 5 MPL, 1 AC/20 with 7 tons of ammo to start with a STD 300. Just for laughs really but might be a fun brawler. Just have to see.

[BulletSix]

hi there

first of all: i love my Marauders!

second: they got hit by the nerf-bat in June and July. On Paper especially the mobility quirks seem to hurt...

Since i am much too biased and stubborn to shelf my Marauders and too bad of a player to have a feeling for the changes, i wanted to ask your opinion as experienced pilots:

How vialble are the Marauders now compared to "pre-nerf"?
Is bringing a Marauder to the table really bad (for my team) or just not as "badass" as before?
Is the "efficiency-drop" to be seen differently in Faction play than in Quickplay?
(please no discussion on gerneral faction-play-viability )

[Mister Bob Dobalina]

BulletSix, on 24 October 2016 - 01:45 AM, said:

hi there

first of all: i love my Marauders!

second: they got hit by the nerf-bat in June and July. On Paper especially the mobility quirks seem to hurt...

Since i am much too biased and stubborn to shelf my Marauders and too bad of a player to have a feeling for the changes, i wanted to ask your opinion as experienced pilots:

How vialble are the Marauders now compared to "pre-nerf"?
Is bringing a Marauder to the table really bad (for my team) or just not as "badass" as before?
Is the "efficiency-drop" to be seen differently in Faction play than in Quickplay?
(please no discussion on gerneral faction-play-viability )

Like you I'll never give away my Marauders although I have to confess I am using only two of them fairly regularly. My MAD-5D has 3x ERLL (RT, LA, RA), 2x ML (LA, RA) and 2x SRM6 Artemis (LT) nad is used mainly in CW/FP (when I play at all that is). My absolute Pet-Marodeur, the MAD-3R(S) "FrancisDrake", is equipped with 2x LBX10 (RT, 5t Munition) and 4x ML (RA, LA). I had my first 1k dmg match in this one and got me through a couple of rough fights:



I had always pretty decent matches in this one and had very regularly 400-500+ dmg. When they nerfed the Marauder and the LBX10 it was about the same time I came into Tier 3. So me having way more problems to get the same ammount of damage has probably more to do with having better opponents assigned to me by matchmaker. But in the meantime I have to admit that this Marauder feels a little less effective and more relying on specific circumstances to be able to really shine.

Nevertheless, the Marauder is still a very very good and iconic Mech and tanky as hell. Don't be afraid to use it. Unless you play it really daft, you are not a liability just because you are using one.

I just stumbeled over this:


He always has some good tips for builds and they really deliver. Take a look, I think it’s worth it.

Edited by Thomster, 24 October 2016 - 02:43 AM.

[Darkhorse13Golf]

I like all of mine but my 5D is becoming my favorite. 5 MPL and 2 LRM-15's with a 300XL and 2 JJ. This is the 'Mech I finally broke 1000 dmg with. This and the venerable Catapult are my favorite heavies with an honorable mention to the Thunderbolt.