99 replies to this topic

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Ghogiel, on 30 November 2015 - 04:24 PM, said:

But what about all the pro CSGO players that are going to flood the game!?

#scary

Pro CSGO players not playing CSGO at all times? You are a funny, funny man.

[Sandpit]

Quote

[color=#959595]play 30 hours over the weekend to get free stuff, no thanks[/color]

When I read something like this I want to dismiss everything else said by the person.

Seriously break down that sentence and think about what you just complained about here....

Quote

[color=#959595]. Trying to grind out 3 Thunderbolts for my son to play was going to take around 50 hours in F2P mode[/color]

When you say grinding out do you mean purchasing them or get them all mastered? I earn on average 150k give or take from a match and normally from hitting launch to match finish and collecting it takes me about 6-7 minutes normally. That's solo and group. That equates to roughly 1.5 million per hour. That can go up if you have some really good matches mixed in and can go down if you blast arty and uav every match and don't do all that well most times.

A Tbolt costs anywhere from 5-6 million.

5 hours to purchase a Tbolt
15 hours to purchase 3 give or take with no premium time.

Now if you're talking about mastering them, that's a different story. I can unlock all the basic skills on a new mech in roughly an hour or so. That's 3 hours to basic 3 mechs essentially, give or take.

18 hours to earn the cbills for all 3 mechs AND get them all basiced.
Customization is going to be the only portion I see being a bit expensive for newer players. Even still, you're playing completely for free and earning the above. If you play very casually and only play 1 hour 3-4 times a week, then yes, that can seem like a long time. Note I said "seem", because to me, playing a video game for 5 hours to earn enough money to buy a 65 ton heavy mech isn't all that much. This becomes especially true when you consider you're doing this all without spending a single penny on the game.

[Felbombling]

Something that I think many people are missing here is that once you have Mastered a Mech and no longer need the variants, that you most likely will never play again, you can strip them down to their bare bones and sell them back. So, while on the surface one can say, "One Mech costs 10 million, but that turns into 30 million because I have to Master three of them." it is not entirely representative of the actual situation. You'll get Maybe 4-8 million C-Bills back to help fund your next selected chassis, plus have extra weapons, ammo and heat sinks to upgrade your next Mech. This is especially so if the Mechs sold off were Inner Sphere designs, in which case you can keep the engines.

I don't mind a grind in a game, especially a free to play game, but I also try to keep things in perspective. I remember when I first started playing, I bought a Commando 2D and played the CRAP out of it, because the repair costs were minimal. I found that I made the best inroads for time played that way. That funded my first three Mechs, Cataphracts, plus their initial upgrades and an XL 300 Engine to get them moving. Overall, I wouldn't complain at all, because I did it all without spending a dime of real money. At that point I had had so much fun in Closed Beta and the early game that I scraped up some bucks and tossed them PGIs way as a 'thank you' for letting me play in their playground.

[Sandpit]

StaggerCheck, on 30 November 2015 - 05:15 PM, said:

Something that I think many people are missing here is that once you have Mastered a Mech and no longer need the variants, that you most likely will never play again, you can strip them down to their bare bones and sell them back. So, while on the surface one can say, "One Mech costs 10 million, but that turns into 30 million because I have to Master three of them." it is not entirely representative of the actual situation. You'll get Maybe 4-8 million C-Bills back to help fund your next selected chassis, plus have extra weapons, ammo and heat sinks to upgrade your next Mech. This is especially so if the Mechs sold off were Inner Sphere designs, in which case you can keep the engines.

I don't mind a grind in a game, especially a free to play game, but I also try to keep things in perspective. I remember when I first started playing, I bought a Commando 2D and played the CRAP out of it, because the repair costs were minimal. I found that I made the best inroads for time played that way. That funded my first three Mechs, Cataphracts, plus their initial upgrades and an XL 300 Engine to get them moving. Overall, I wouldn't complain at all, because I did it all without spending a dime of real money. At that point I had had so much fun in Closed Beta and the early game that I scraped up some bucks and tossed them PGIs way as a 'thank you' for letting me play in their playground.

One thing they always seem to fail to take into account as well is that customizing mechs gets cheaper because eventually you wind up with a stockpile of equipment so you stop having to buy them.
Weapons
Modules
Engines
Heat sinks
etc.

All of those accumulate after a bit. If you're selling that stuff with mechs, I would highly suggest stripping a mech before you sell it. It will save you a ton of cbills in the long run. In pub drops you can only use one mech at a time so you can switch out components on mechs to save cbills also, this is especially helpful when starting out.

It's more convenient to have multiple components like adv. zoom modules, radar derp, etc. but it's not needed in pub drops. At that point, when you buy multiple modules like that, you're paying for convenience, not need.

[Kuritaclan]

@StaggerCheck
@Sandpit

While you are right with what you say. First of mens are collectors. Second to prepare good Drop Decks that are changeable for purpose ig atk defend heat and map specifics you most time need variation. So selling is not at all that easy. Also there could be shifts in tonnage requirements and so on. And modules are for sure usable on mechs in normal queue by simple changing in between for cw for example with the wish to be flexible you have to get "some more" then you only will have to play a bit your form in the normal queue.

[Xetelian]

The grind is real, especially if you want to get to elite with a mech.

[sycocys]

The short answer is NO, the grind isn't too long. Even without premium time, which they are trying to sell to speed it up 50%, the grind isn't too long.

The addendum to that is simply that most players refuse to learn how to earn the bonus reward objectives.
You hit first scout on 10 mechs that's 20k within the first 1-2 minutes of the match and you only have to hold W and hit R a bunch.
Counter some ecm - I've had matches that racked up 60k+ on that alone during hide and pokes.
Flanks, hit and run, protects, component destruction - adds up fast.

[Sandpit]

Kuritaclan, on 30 November 2015 - 05:46 PM, said:

@StaggerCheck
@Sandpit

While you are right with what you say. First of mens are collectors. Second to prepare good Drop Decks that are changeable for purpose ig atk defend heat and map specifics you most time need variation. So selling is not at all that easy. Also there could be shifts in tonnage requirements and so on. And modules are for sure usable on mechs in normal queue by simple changing in between for cw for example with the wish to be flexible you have to get "some more" then you only will have to play a bit your form in the normal queue.

It is though.
Notice how I also stated that we're talking pub drops. CW is a completely different animal and is not pertinent to the "grind". CW has nothing to do with the grind as it's a completely separate and optional mode that a new players isn't going to be getting into at first.
CW has no bearing on this as it isn't part of the grind. You can also buy 4 mechs for a CW drop deck with the same amount of money I listed earlier. You can actually buy them faster since you're not buying 4 heavies for your drop deck (well most people wouldn't lol)

Selling IS that easy. It really is. That's the whole point. Strip a mech and sell it. Then buy the next chassis, outfit it with the equipment you just stockpiled form the last mech, save cash, repeat until you have your hangar decked out the way you want it.

Anything beyond that is simply paying for convenience and speed.

Edit:
Also, "collecting" is completely unrelated to the grind.

Edited by Sandpit, 30 November 2015 - 06:24 PM.

[Diznitch]

There is no grind, really. But I played EQ for years. /shrug

[Mechwarrior Buddah]

Cathy, on 29 November 2015 - 01:47 PM, said:

As an example, i've mastered every mech in the game but the crabs and the wolf hounds, which are elited and half way to mastering.

Also maxed out all the weapon modules to level 5

No, this game isn't the grind people claim it is

Member Since 02 Aug 2012

only took you 3 years.

[Sandpit]

Mechwarrior Buddah, on 30 November 2015 - 09:35 PM, said:

Member Since 02 Aug 2012

only took you 3 years.

so you think 3 years to master every single mech in the game with 2 exceptions) which means she bought, modified, and owned every single mech there is is too much of a grind?
The game has only existed for 3 years. How much faster did you want her to climg through all of that exactly? Especially since some of those mechs weren't even introduced until well after the game launched (like within the past few months even)

At least be sincere dude.

As another aside, in your opinion it's too much, I get that. For her it wasn't. The bottom line is that this very argument started 4 years ago. It hasn't changed. I'd be willing to bet that PGI has looked at the stats and feedback and the majority of players agree that the "grind" isn't bad at all here in MWO

[Kuritaclan]

Sandpit, on 30 November 2015 - 06:23 PM, said:

It is though.
Notice how I also stated that we're talking pub drops. CW is a completely different animal and is not pertinent to the "grind". CW has nothing to do with the grind as it's a completely separate and optional mode that a new players isn't going to be getting into at first.
CW has no bearing on this as it isn't part of the grind. You can also buy 4 mechs for a CW drop deck with the same amount of money I listed earlier. You can actually buy them faster since you're not buying 4 heavies for your drop deck (well most people wouldn't lol)

Actually CW should be the goal to play for a new player. Sure it is rather optional and many people have no fun with the mode at all at this point in time. But what you say is like playing League of Legends without ranked games or playing wow without raiding and so on. While public games is the more popular modus i wont exclude cw at all.

[Radbane]

It's the least grindy F2P title i know of, that's why I still pop-in now and then. I've stopped playing all others I've tried so far (Including but not limited to: Survarium, Star Conflict, War Thunder, World of Tanks and a bunch of F2P MMORPG's)

[TWIAFU]

It is only a grind if you make it one.

Personally, I do not worry about 'grinding', I just play. With that mindset, no problems at all.

MWO, like nearly all games, is what you make of it. If you make it into a grind, it will be.

Breakout of the hamster wheel grinding mentality and just play. Makes for a far better experience in the long run...

[Jeffrey Wilder]

I wouldn't even consider MWO to be 'grindy' in nature. Compare that to Korean MMOs and you'll know what's grinding.

[Ghogiel]

Jeffrey Wilder, on 01 December 2015 - 04:56 AM, said:

I wouldn't even consider MWO to be 'grindy' in nature. Compare that to Korean MMOs and you'll know what's grinding.

Even compared to other F2P and even western paid subscription MMOs there is less grind.

How long it takes level to max and crafting some legedary armor> which woud be the equivalent to getting and xping 3 TBRs, getting radar derp and a few other modules.

[Mister Blastman]

Grind is over.



They are handing out fistfuls of c-bills now.

Edited by Mister Blastman, 01 December 2015 - 08:23 AM.

[Sandpit]

Kuritaclan, on 01 December 2015 - 01:42 AM, said:

Actually CW should be the goal to play for a new player. Sure it is rather optional and many people have no fun with the mode at all at this point in time. But what you say is like playing League of Legends without ranked games or playing wow without raiding and so on. While public games is the more popular modus i wont exclude cw at all.

That has nothing to do with the "grind"

Sorry, CW has been stated numerous times that it's not intended for the feint of heart or uninitiated.

LoL?
How about Heroes of the Storm? You can't even play ranked matches with a team until you've hit level 30 (no small feat I might add) AND bought a certain number of heroes.

Now I understand where you're going with this. The longer a new player grind is, the longer it is for them to get into CW. I'm not going to debate the whole "That should be a new player's goal, to make it to CW", because that quite simply isn't the case, there are plenty that want nothing to do with CW, it's not their cup of tea, so using the whole "CW" thing isn't relevant to this particular discussion. There's no natural progression nor is there any kind of perk or extra reward for CW so that's not an "end goal" of any kind, which is why I say it's irrelevant to this particular topic.

[Jetfire]

The grind used to be a bit better, it needs a moderate buff. I am more annoyed that even with premium time it is still rather grindy. If I pay you $10-15 a month it should significantly lessen the grind but I can't remember the last time I had earned enough CB to actually buy a mech. I can barely make enough CB to outfit the mech packs I bought as I level them.

I think there needs to be a 30% boost to general cbill earning through increases to existing rewards and addition of new ones.

I would like to see the premium boost increased to double the current boost.

Compared to F2P's that I enjoy such as Heroes of the Storm this game is super grindy. Compare to Lol which I don't even bother with it may not be, but then that is the reason I don't bother with it when Dota and Hots exist.

Edited by Jetfire, 01 December 2015 - 09:48 AM.

[Almond Brown]

Foxwalker, on 29 November 2015 - 02:13 PM, said:

Start an alt account and see how tuff the grind is. It is insane. Yes, the goal for PGI is to get new players to spend money on mech packs and such, but the problem as I see it, is new players will quickly tire of the grind, and more likely quit before the game becomes fun enough to make the decision to buy anything.

Just my take. Try an alt first and let me know if you have a similar experience.

Thus a NEW Increase in the Cadet Bonus and with the additions of the New Training Academy monies, New players should have sufficient funds for a great start.

Besides, name a game that provides new players with all the same Gear/Tech and Perks as a player who has been around fo2-3 years. Please.