284 replies to this topic

[Prof RJ Gumby]

I agree that people get a bit too emotional about the subject.

I disagree with any suggestions about moving conquest caps and/or adding hard cover. The strenght of this map is that it is different. A breeze of fresh air. If all maps looked like this, I would be the first to want some smaller, more clustered arena-style map. However, it is exactly opposite, and any attempt to 'fix' polar by making it more like all those other maps is detrimental to overall variety and the game as a whole.

Maaayyyybeee in total comp play this map will be stale. Maybe. I doubt it, but what do I know. I don't care tbh. What I care about is in that non total comp play, i.e. 99% of the time, there is a ton of options to utilise. Any 'good' position I found can be easily made a very bad position if the enemy changes their own position. Very hard, straight impossible for non-comps to be sure about enemy position all the time, you can get jumped almost always and from many places. Flankers can keep themselves invisible to the enemy, who most often can't secure all possible approaches to their position. Long range seem to rule, but all those uphills and downhills allow 'short rangers' to jump them.

This map allows you to improvise a lot. In all those other maps there is 1 or 2 good positions and 1 or 2 ways to flank those positions everybody knows already. Nothing unexpected can happen. Too much boils to having that better high mounted alpha and more precision in aiming pixels, because everything is predictable. On polar there is always a handful approaches to any enemy position, better and worse, simply because there are no big walls and corridors you need to follow.

EDIT:

Ultimatum X, on 22 January 2016 - 05:20 PM, said:

(on sniping)

You see, the problem is, there will be always that one thing that will be mathematically and statistically the best for well-trained, flawless-in-every-way players. There will be always that team setup that gives more chance for victory, even if it is by 0,01%. And people who will find it. It's unavoidable. There is a certain skill/knowledge barrier where a game becomes a pro sport, with all evils a pro sport brings. How much diversity and fun to those "middle class" players should we sacrifice to make sure the tournament matches on that one map won't get more stale and predictable than they are on all the other maps?

Edited by Prof RJ Gumby, 22 January 2016 - 05:44 PM.

[1453 R]

I love how Gman's fixes for one of the largest maps Piranha's introduced mostly end up as "move everything closer together so most of the map ends up as unused/wasted space"

I mean, I get it. T4 scrublord doesn't know a damn thing about MWO...but I thought the point of a big large huge wide-open, old MW-style map was to have, y'know...bigger, wider fights?

[Lupis Volk]

1453 R, on 22 January 2016 - 06:13 PM, said:

I love how Gman's fixes for one of the largest maps Piranha's introduced mostly end up as "move everything closer together so most of the map ends up as unused/wasted space"

I mean, I get it. T4 scrublord doesn't know a damn thing about MWO...but I thought the point of a big large huge wide-open, old MW-style map was to have, y'know...bigger, wider fights?

sorry can't have that. All dem tier 1-2/Comps want thier murder ball fixes so all maps have to conform to them.

[Kjudoon]

I lurk outreach pretty regularly. I cringe at the prevailing thoughts and ivory tower elitism that pervades there.

[Hoffenstein]

Polar Highlands is the most fun I've had playing this game since 8-mans. We don't need fewer maps like this, we need more.

[xSleeZyx]

Only thing i can say - even after winning most of em is that conquest-mode needs to be changed.

The locations are far off, and depending on which side ull end up on - it's usualy instant loose.

Starting in the south is a huge disadvantage, whilst the north have 3 caps easily while moving forward. South ppl has to split up way to much and once the battle starts - it's game over most of the time.

Skirmish seems to work realy good for this map though, i've had many great matches when the team co-ops like they should.

[BleuDeath]

Love the terrain cover on this map.Use it or die.

[1453 R]

I mean, don't get me wrong. Everyone is perfectly entitled to like or dislike a map, and at least Gman's put up solid reasoning why he dislikes it instead of just "RARGH GNARHBLE REMOVE THIS MAP" like the staggering majority of the grognards.

I simply disagree with his conclusions. Again, it's likely my awful ***-tier Underhive play level, but the size of the map is a bonus, not a detractant. As others have said, fights actually happen in different places on this map. Move everything closer together so people can hit engagement in thirty seconds and you lose that different-places ability. The focus on concealment and a contest-of-maneuver instead of angling for a single massed rush is great, and an excellent change of pace from most regular pug matches. It's possibly just me, but people even seem communicate more in Polar Highland than they seem to everywhere else.

I think we should let this one have its run for a while, see where things shake out in, y'know, more than a week. Sure, maybe it ends up being too LRM-magnety for long-term game health, but maybe it also turns out that people figure out how to maneuver better on the map instead. One never knows. Especially not after, what? Three days?

[PholkLorr]

I agree with gman 100% here.

No cover. Lrm heaven. Or if not lrm, then the best mechs which own in every single map also own in this. Ie. High mounted lasers.

Also, fricking waste of time walking for 4 mins or more before you reach pokemon ranges.

Sucks be to you if you are short ranged. You either die early or you spend 10 mins doing nothing meaningful before you get to see some action. That means if you're a meta mech, you get to see some action 5 mins in. If you're not, you see action 10 mins in. Fricking boring

Edited by PholkLorr, 22 January 2016 - 07:05 PM.

[Escef]

Hornsby, on 22 January 2016 - 05:06 AM, said:

Right now, LRMs and ERLL are performing very well on this map because not enough people are playing the map to account for these weapons. I say: give it time, and assess the state of the game by looking at the higher tiers, where people tend to adapt more quickly.

TBH, people haven't adapted to Terra Therma yet. Some of the best matches I've been in have been on Therma, they happen when people play the map with a modicum of intelligence and teamwork. However, I will also put a caveat noting that most people do not play Therma in such a fashion. People would rather b****, whine, and complain than adapt.

[Pathos]

There is LRM cover and my unit has used it to great success earlier. Get caught with your pants down however and you will be rained on, hard.

[Livewyr]

Hearing about such a massive map almost makes me want to reinstall. I've always been irritated with the Arcade size maps where everyone just runs around as a blob.



(But then I think of the gameplay and go back to war thunder.)

[xSleeZyx]

Livewyr, on 22 January 2016 - 07:15 PM, said:

Hearing about such a massive map almost makes me want to reinstall. I've always been irritated with the Arcade size maps where everyone just runs around as a blob.



(But then I think of the gameplay and go back to war thunder.)

Then by all means go try it!

Fairly sure u'll enjoy it

I've had tons of fun fights in this map (And some not so fun...)
But you should give it a go

[Lupis Volk]

One thing i'd like to see is in the snow drifts in the "open" area be a bit more deeper.

[Livewyr]

xSleeZyx, on 22 January 2016 - 07:26 PM, said:

Then by all means go try it!

Fairly sure u'll enjoy it

I've had tons of fun fights in this map (And some not so fun...)
But you should give it a go

Eh, the gameplay just isn't fun. (But thanks for the encouragement!)

[1453 R]

This is a map which benefits greatly from movement. Well, all maps are, but this one especially.

Played a game just five minutes ago. Dropships inbound, had the usual two or three guys going "Maaan, **** this map. Hope you lurmboats are happy", all that jazz. I tell them I've been having great success on this map in fast skirmishers and that there's plenty of ways to avoid LRM fire.

"Says the boat."

I happen to be grinding out a last bit of skill for an off Jenner-IIC that match, and say so - "In a Jenner with small lasers and SRMs. Lrn 2 Manooverr." Get told to put up or shut up...but by then I had other folks listening. The lights head out, me included, we find the enemy team, start looking for flanks. They're assembled in a big blobby firing line, I tell the team over VoIP that they need to start pushing hard in, I'm going to shove some missiles up red poop chutes, sow some confusion, and give them an opening. Hear at least one blue say "You heard the man, let's get going."

I end the match with a grip of assists and a miserable 195 damage...but my team has gotten their foot firmly in the door while half the enemy squad was busy wearing down the squirrel. The match is close, brutal brawling pretty much from the get-go, with LRMs fired only in panicked snapshots. We win 12-6, after the enemy had secured an 'insurmountable' 1-3 lead. Went to 2-3, then 3-3. They got it back to 4-5 once, but after that they started losing shoulders, losing guns, and then losing 'Mechs. Had a target caller people actually paid attention to, and a Whale that managed to work himself into a flanking position and start dropping people like he was in a shooting gallery. Which, to be fair, he kinda was.

Sure, my own personal performance was butt. But I got my team going the right direction, we overrode the whiners that just wanted to sit somewhere near spawn 'until the boats run out of ammo', took the fight to the enemy and shoved it in their faces until they choked on it.

Polar Highlands is a great map. You just have to get your gluts in gear, pull your scheiss together, get your team on board, and use it.

[Vaegir Raiden]

Adiuvo, on 22 January 2016 - 01:22 PM, said:

The amount of strawmanning in this thread is funny.

Competitive players don't even post on the forums. 99% of you don't post on Outreach, and thus have zero interaction. You've somehow made anybody in plays in a league a boogeyman. That's pretty sad and honestly makes me wonder how you act in real life.

Anyway regarding Gman's post, he has a few good points but I don't agree with a lot of it. The map does lend itself heavily to a certain playstyle and using something like a brawl Atlas is just an exercise in annoyance, but that's not too much different than the rest of the maps in this game.

'peekwarrior' also is very effective on Polar Highlands, contrary to what one intelligent individual posted in this thread btw

EXACTLY the reason, you JUST have PROVEN so many points why PGI shouldnt listen to COMP players.

Including you.

CONGRATULATIONS of thinking this game is competitieve at all. WHICH in fact is very poor to think of you.

Edited by Vaegir Raiden, 23 January 2016 - 12:42 AM.

[Vaegir Raiden]

Aresye, on 22 January 2016 - 11:07 AM, said:

Your comment may have had validity 2 years ago when Lords were at the epitome of doucheness, but that's one phrase from one team. Other than some occasional playful banter, what exactly has SJR, AS, 228, S RS, EmP, or MM done to you? Hell, from playing IS CW on my alt account, the worst I've seen has come from lore-based units, who are like the exact opposite of comp, and who like to talk trash to teams of solo players they stomp.

The SJR vs. 228 exhibition match had over 300 viewers on Twitch (nearly as much as a town hall), and some of the most popular streamers are members of top competitive teams.

You may not agree with the concept of metamechs, but that doesn't negate the fact it's an invaluable resource for new players, especially when it comes to understanding mechlab customization. EmP invites players of all skill levels to join them every Sunday to learn how to play better, and work as a team. One of the most in-depth new player guides was written by a comp player.

Btw, saying that someone who wins the majority of the time has, "little to NO understanding of the game," makes absolutely no sense. Should probably reword that to, "little to NO understanding of the way I think the game should be played."

Blah, blah blah, more blah?

Just that THESE PLAYERS have GOOD REFLEXES and AIM doesnt make them have UNDERSTANDING of the game or hell even TT/BT universe. BET most of them don't know anything about it.

YOU say they DO KNOW about the game. WHICH i agree on SOME POINTS. BUILDING, having idea's of cover, tactics and more but that's something you see in EVERY OTHER GAME.

About mechanics or hell even gameplay? N.O.P.E.

Some COMPs units are TOTAL TOOLS. I saw enough Quickdraws with unit names above them pressing JJ bar alot and boating/build ON/NEAR QUIRKS.
I rest my CASE

Quote

Btw, saying that someone who wins the majority of the time has, "little to NO understanding of the game," makes absolutely no sense

You dont make sense. Because winning majority of the time equals SKILLS? Eh...OK.

Edited by Vaegir Raiden, 23 January 2016 - 12:49 AM.

[Adiuvo]

Vaegir Raiden, on 23 January 2016 - 12:40 AM, said:

EXACTLY the reason, you JUST have PROVEN so many points why PGI shouldnt listen to COMP players.

Including you.

CONGRATULATIONS of thinking this game is competitieve at all. WHICH in fact is very poor to think of you.

YOU sound a LITTLE bit ANNOYED

As for competition...

http://mwomercs.com/...500-cash-prize/
https://mrbcleague.com/
https://www.reddit.c...charity_series/

[XX Sulla XX]

Adiuvo, on 23 January 2016 - 12:47 AM, said:

YOU sound a LITTLE bit ANNOYED

As for competition...

http://mwomercs.com/...500-cash-prize/
https://mrbcleague.com/
https://www.reddit.c...charity_series/

You for got to mention the $100k PGI tournament that is coming this year.