97 replies to this topic

[Tezkat]

SkyDragon, on 13 July 2012 - 08:10 AM, said:

Interesting... does this have to do with Rate of Fire and lock on speed timing?

It's not usually a rate of fire thing. Artemis IV Fire Control Systems allow more missiles per volley to impact the target, so they significantly boost the average damage per volley.


Another thing that's a huge tonnage saver is double heat sinks. Not sure how they'll be implemented in MWO, since they're outright better than single heat sinks in almost every situation.

[OJ191]

WardenWolf, on 13 July 2012 - 08:08 AM, said:

What mech are you thinking - Stalker?

Nope Catapult, with the below build.

As a purely fire support mech you have a CRAPTON of fire power - rivalling that of the best of assault mechs - but you severely lack in durability and aren't exactly quick, so you rely on team-mates/counter-scouts to survive.

Edited by OJ191, 13 July 2012 - 08:19 AM.

[Verkorperung]

Since a ton of LRM ammo is a ton of LRM ammo, you are really better off staying with the LRM 15 and just adding ammo. A 25% damage increase per hit isn't really worth the almost 50% weight increase. You would do that damage anyway over time. Also, the crit space requirement increases 66% over the LRM 15. Add Artemis, and a couple tons of ammo and you would have a decent fire support mech.

[WardenWolf]

OJ191, on 13 July 2012 - 08:15 AM, said:

Nope Catapult, with the below build.

As a purely fire support mech you have a CRAPTON of fire power - rivalling that of the best of assault mechs - but you severely lack in durability and aren't exactly quick, so you rely on team-mates/counter-scouts to survive.

Ah, going glass-cannon style I see Well, the one thing to keep in mind with MWO is we don't yet know the hardpoint layout on the Catapult: it could be just a single missile spot on each arm, in which case this wouldn't work. Still, an inventive way to pack that much firepower!

[Spleenslitta]

Battlecruiser, on 13 July 2012 - 07:53 AM, said:

I heard from a little birdy that pulse lasers are great at smashing lights but are bad at long term engagements.

speed with a few medium pulse would sort out any aggressors that can catch you i would think

This thought is a good one Battlecruiser, but i see one weakness the prime Catapult has against fast mechs that it cannot fix with it's torso mounted energy weapon hardpoints.
What is it?

As you know any weapon mounted in the torso aims slower than the weapons mounted in the arms.
Whenever a fast mech gets close the LRM's will be useless due to minimum range and any laser whether it's pulse or standard will probably have a hard time keeping up.
Therefore i believe having the speed to keep such little devils at the ideal range would be more important than thick armor and brute firepower.

If you can't survive long enough to empty your ammunition then all the extra ammo and extra firepower won't do you much good.
Sacrifising just a tiny bit of the LRM's to mount some SRM's would give the prime catapult something that's fast to aim due to being mounted in the arms at close range.
But that's just an additional thought....

Edited by Spleenslitta, 13 July 2012 - 08:23 AM.

[sakkaku]

The catapault has standard chassis, standard engine and standard armor. Upgrading to an endo chassis, xl engine and ferro armor will give quite a bit of tonnage (basically the CPLT-C2 but without the useless autocannons). You don't really need crits on the mech, medium lasers are 1 each and the launchers are 5 each. Swapping the heatsinks for doubles can can probably free a ton or two.

Edited by sakkaku, 13 July 2012 - 08:24 AM.

[grimzod]

Pilotreborn, on 13 July 2012 - 07:37 AM, said:

As the title says, what is a viable build with 2 LRM-20, and still have enough ammo to **** people up at distance without running out and having solid armor.

XL engine. Will work but youll have a lot of nagging ninnys say o boy your gonna get side torso cored - well you will but not before you dump 80 missile son their head. And itll allow for more heat sinks.

[Reported for Inappropriate Name]

I'm willing to bet you can increase your torso turn speed by turning your legs in the same direction.

[OJ191]

Verkorperung, on 13 July 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

Since a ton of LRM ammo is a ton of LRM ammo, you are really better off staying with the LRM 15 and just adding ammo. A 25% damage increase per hit isn't really worth the almost 50% weight increase. You would do that damage anyway over time. Also, the crit space requirement increases 66% over the LRM 15. Add Artemis, and a couple tons of ammo and you would have a decent fire support mech.

Don't need artemis if you coordinate with someone using narcs... I agree 4 LRM15's is likely a better pub build since you can grab artemis and probably some small or even medium lasers (and/or more armour/speed), but for coordinated play that 25% damage increase will be strong, especially if they are using AMS (more hits).

WardenWolf, on 13 July 2012 - 08:21 AM, said:

Ah, going glass-cannon style I see Well, the one thing to keep in mind with MWO is we don't yet know the hardpoint layout on the Catapult: it could be just a single missile spot on each arm, in which case this wouldn't work. Still, an inventive way to pack that much firepower!

Well I don't know the hardpoints of MWO or even table tops... so I was just going off the hardpoints present in MW4 (yeah yeah get over it).

Edited by OJ191, 13 July 2012 - 08:52 AM.

[Voodoo 6]

Battlecruiser, on 13 July 2012 - 07:43 AM, said:

I'm going to try and fit 2 lrm 20 and 2 medium pulse but i'm not sure yet. I may drop jumpjets and play it like I intend to drive my stalker, just with more focus on the fire support end

This guy is on to something.
Even PGI came out and said pulse lasers are for light mech killing because you can strafe an area. 2 Medium pulse will REALLY help, 2 LRM 20's, XL engine to save on weight.
Then what I would do is drop a heatsink or 2 (because you do NOT spam! You place your shots!)
drop the jump jets (because you have an XL engine, goes faster and you have to give up some weight, this is 4 tons!)
Grab a CASE and stack up on LRM 20 ammo like crazy!
**EDIT: You will have some bad shots and wasted ammo, you might want to go double LRM15's and get an extra 1-2 tons of ammo. More shots, saving 10 missiles a salvo, with more ammo. If you go Artemis IV you would need to fire 2 20's or even 2 15's at that point because Artemis increased accuracy. so 2 LRM10s (or 1 LRM20 and some SRM6 for light mechs maybe?) Artemis IV, stock some ammo, blow **** up. Holy crap this is what I'm doing with my Cat...**

(I'm pretty bad at knowing how much things weigh, it's just a shot in the dark, I don't claim to know that this would work 100% due to tonnage, but it's a good start)

You would REALLY have to watch your back and positioning though. With 4+ tons of LRM20 ammo you'll be firing a lot longer than they'll know what to do with and the 2 med pulse are great to fend off some lights (you are a heavy, don't skimp on armor). Depending on the map you may want to swap the 2 med pulse for 1 large pulse for the extra range and you can be a long/med-long engagement mech.

On the other hand if you grab a K2, max out the armor (in exchange for not needing ammo), stick some ER PPC's on them, you can do almost the same thing except you need the right map for it. Again, situational.

Edited by Voodoo 6, 13 July 2012 - 08:36 AM.

[Arikiel]

Catapult CPLT-OMGWTF
Tons: 65
Speed: 4/6/0
Engines: XL
Structure: Endo Steel
Heat Sinks: 12 Doubles
Armor: 160 (unchanged)
Weapons: 6 LRM 10s (6 tons of ammo), 1 Small Laser

Getting rid of the small laser and a ton and a half of armor would allow for Artemis IV as well.

Overall LRM load is double standard 60 vs 30 (6x10 vs 2x15). Sure it's not the maxed out 80 (4x20) like shown above but then it's also not instantly dead the moment a Scout sneaks up on it.

Edited by Arikiel, 13 July 2012 - 08:50 AM.

[Reported for Inappropriate Name]

Voodoo 6, on 13 July 2012 - 08:30 AM, said:

You would REALLY have to watch your back and positioning though.

I intend to buddy up with either a scout or a medium, and stay on the constant move to keep teammates between me and the enemy. It's not like the stalker where you can walk in and out of the battlefield but it should skirt just about the same

that said though when I get my stalker there's a good chance I'll have a loadout fitted for fire support in roughly the same fashion

[OJ191]

Verkorperung, on 13 July 2012 - 08:17 AM, said:

Since a ton of LRM ammo is a ton of LRM ammo, you are really better off staying with the LRM 15 and just adding ammo. A 25% damage increase per hit isn't really worth the almost 50% weight increase. You would do that damage anyway over time. Also, the crit space requirement increases 66% over the LRM 15. Add Artemis, and a couple tons of ammo and you would have a decent fire support mech.

LRM15 build. You could swap to pulse lasers if you wanted to strip the extra tonnage needed from armour. Although with the armour stripping needed to swap to pulse

EDIT: I will repost the image in a bit, somehow it got reverted to standard engine.

Edited by OJ191, 13 July 2012 - 08:40 AM.

[Tsig]

If it's 12v12, how many of each weight class/role would be ideal? Maybe 2-3 scouts, 4 medium mechs, 3 Heavy/Assault mechs, 2-3 Fire Support mechs?

[Spleenslitta]

Battlecruiser, on 13 July 2012 - 08:25 AM, said:

I'm willing to bet you can increase your torso turn speed by turning your legs in the same direction.

Yes. That might be true. But will it be fast enough? The torso mounted weapons aiming speed disadvantage is still there.
But with the pulse lasers the aiming problem won't be quite so high as the std lasers since pulse are not DoT weapons.

Things are going to be tough for the Catapult prime no matter how one looks at it....
Unless one sacrifices half the LRM's to mount 2x SRM 6 or something like that.

I'm not saying this with some kinda malice in mind.
It's just an observation made by someone who will only pilot fast mechs with a minimum speed of 97Kph.

[OJ191]

OJ191, on 13 July 2012 - 08:37 AM, said:

LRM15 build. You could swap to pulse lasers by dropping speed or armour, or get more armour by dropping some speed.

EDIT: I will repost the image in a bit, somehow it got reverted to standard engine.

*bump*

Edited by OJ191, 13 July 2012 - 08:51 AM.

[Reported for Inappropriate Name]

I'm sure I'll figure out how to manage. the great advantage of videogames is unlimited tries

[DoctorJest]

Bookmarked thread and I'm following designs with interest - great contributions all

[Johnny Kerensky]

You would have to remove armor and possibly also install a lesser engine... it's really not worth it.

[OJ191]

Hmmm.... That LRM15 build of mine costs 2mil cbills more.

The increased engine + armour + artemis is damn expensive.

Edited by OJ191, 13 July 2012 - 08:58 AM.