1212 replies to this topic

[Quicksilver Aberration]

LastKhan, on 09 March 2016 - 10:57 AM, said:

The clans really seemed to be more focused on better heavies then assaults.

That's because in TT the Whale was one of the best assaults, you didn't really need other assaults with it around. They had other really good assaults, but the Whale is still the best.

[LastKhan]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 March 2016 - 11:06 AM, said:

That's because in TT the Whale was one of the best assaults, you didn't really need other assaults with it around. They had other really good assaults, but the Whale is still the best.

indeed it is. though juked from the teak reduction. like ive said its like Christmas.

[Metus regem]

pbiggz, on 09 March 2016 - 11:02 AM, said:

XXLs tell me something important about engines. If a mechwarrior game standardized engine nomenclature and stats that would be a vast improvement over the current system. Consider that an XXL weighing 25% of std weight would die to a torso loss, an XL/LFE would survive a torso loss and weigh 50% and the standard would weigh full and be more durable.

Make that the same for both factions and boom you solve a lot of problems though it would break a ton of stock loadouts.

I.C.E. (interal combustion engine) = 200% Standard Engine weight
Standard = 100% weight
LFE (Light Fusion Engine) = 75% Standard Engine weight (IS only, prototypes available in 3053, 2 slots in each ST)
XL (Extra light engine, 2/3 slots in ST's Clan/IS) = 50% Standard Engine weight
XXL (extra extra light fusion engine; 4/6 slots in ST's Clan/IS. Generates 2/4/6 heat standing/walking/running) = 33% Standard Engine weight


I've been after Russ about adding the LFE, I know it would oboslete the standard engine for the IS, it's why I suggested keeping it in increments of 50, meaning not every mech could use it.

[pbiggz]

Metus regem, on 09 March 2016 - 11:14 AM, said:

I.C.E. (interal combustion engine) = 200% Standard Engine weight
Standard = 100% weight
LFE (Light Fusion Engine) = 75% Standard Engine weight (IS only, prototypes available in 3053, 2 slots in each ST)
XL (Extra light engine, 2/3 slots in ST's Clan/IS) = 50% Standard Engine weight
XXL (extra extra light fusion engine; 4/6 slots in ST's Clan/IS. Generates 2/4/6 heat standing/walking/running) = 33% Standard Engine weight


I've been after Russ about adding the LFE, I know it would oboslete the standard engine for the IS, it's why I suggested keeping it in increments of 50, meaning not every mech could use it.

Oh I know how the engine system in TT works, I just think its overly complex because XXL dies to a side torso loss, clan only, C XL survives a torso loss, clan only, IS XL dies to a torso loss, LFE survives a torso loss, IS only, and standards are standard.

3 engines with clear advantages and draw backs makes more sense to me, and makes more sense to COMPLETELY new players than 5 nebulous engine types that may or may not kill you when you use them.

[Imperius]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 March 2016 - 10:55 AM, said:

No he didn't, he said as long as the BASE VARIANT is produced prior to 3053, any future variants would be potentially viable for addition into the game provided the equipment not in the game currently could be easily replaced. Thus why you are cherry picking because you ignore that BASE VARIANT requirement.

False don't worry I'll get you his clarification he said later in the town hall cherry picker.

[Metus regem]

pbiggz, on 09 March 2016 - 11:26 AM, said:

Oh I know how the engine system in TT works, I just think its overly complex because XXL dies to a side torso loss, clan only, C XL survives a torso loss, clan only, IS XL dies to a torso loss, LFE survives a torso loss, IS only, and standards are standard.

3 engines with clear advantages and draw backs makes more sense to me, and makes more sense to COMPLETELY new players than 5 nebulous engine types that may or may not kill you when you use them.

To that I say, do your home work, or learn by experimenting.

[pbiggz]

LastKhan, on 09 March 2016 - 11:04 AM, said:

Aye, im still thinking of the next clan mech/pack they would release (debateable) without having to really sit and consider about it.

Issue is, what is better, 5 extra tons in your drop deck, or fixed jumpjets. The Nova cat is 5 tons lighter, and way cooler looking, but otherwise it does near everything the night gyr can do. Its close to strictly better than the night gyr in a lot of ways, or its otherwise identical. Thats why I say give the night gyr a skip and give the clans another 70 tonner. Currently they only have one, and russ refuses to fix it (which makes me sad because that one 70 tonner is my favourite mech, rip).

[Imperius]

Imperius, on 09 March 2016 - 11:29 AM, said:

False don't worry I'll get you his clarification he said later in the town hall cherry picker.

Here, go to 1:34:00 http://youtu.be/WgckpASXBIQ

[pbiggz]

Metus regem, on 09 March 2016 - 11:32 AM, said:

To that I say, do your home work, or learn by experimenting.

I have no particular attachment to TT rules, I also think there's alot of room for improvement. They're an important guide for anyone making a mechwarrior game but the values they give can be at best misleading and at worst destructive (they dont translate well in other words) and the system is quite old and vulnerable to system mastery. A smart designer could find a lot of ways to downplay what have become the more tedious parts and improve and exaggerate the more entertaining parts, in game and in the mechlab.

[LastKhan]

pbiggz, on 09 March 2016 - 11:34 AM, said:

Issue is, what is better, 5 extra tons in your drop deck, or fixed jumpjets. The Nova cat is 5 tons lighter, and way cooler looking, but otherwise it does near everything the night gyr can do. Its close to strictly better than the night gyr in a lot of ways, or its otherwise identical. Thats why I say give the night gyr a skip and give the clans another 70 tonner. Currently they only have one, and russ refuses to fix it (which makes me sad because that one 70 tonner is my favourite mech, rip).

Yeah thats in terms of CW so yes, NC is the better choice for a drop deck being all energy with one version all missiles with good speed and space. In say the regular que games and comp i lean to the Night Gyr. The summoner can manage (and by hell's fury i can with it). But it needs things more then just slapping on a few quirks as a band-aid.

Introducing the Nova Cat along with the MK2 Russ would really have to sit down and consider it as well talk it over alot with the PGI crew regardless of him saying half drunkenly cusps.

note not saying its not going to happen but im likely sure its how it goes down when the time to pick comes.

Edited by LastKhan, 09 March 2016 - 12:04 PM.

[Metus regem]

pbiggz, on 09 March 2016 - 11:36 AM, said:

I have no particular attachment to TT rules, I also think there's alot of room for improvement. They're an important guide for anyone making a mechwarrior game but the values they give can be at best misleading and at worst destructive (they dont translate well in other words) and the system is quite old and vulnerable to system mastery. A smart designer could find a lot of ways to downplay what have become the more tedious parts and improve and exaggerate the more entertaining parts, in game and in the mechlab.

That was half the fun, using the mech construction rules, and making the most out what you could do, with a set budget for the mech.

But that is an aside, I've been working on a document to sent to CGL, about an updated rule set for CBT, to try and make it a little more friendly to new players, yet keep old ones more or less happy, as well as bring a little more parity between Clans and IS... one of the biggest ones, is making 4 engine hits needed to bring down a mech, it's up one from the old three, and it really helps IS XL engines, making it so you have to crit out the CT, or one ST+1 engine crit out of the other ST/CT.

How ever, as we lack a proper critcal system in MWO, it's not a system that translates well to a shooter... And I am aware that some rules do not translate well to a shooter, yet some, with some careful planning could.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Imperius, on 09 March 2016 - 11:34 AM, said:

Here, go to 1:34:00 http://youtu.be/WgckpASXBIQ

Alright, it seems I misheard him.

Bring on the Nova Cat then.

[pbiggz]

Metus regem, on 09 March 2016 - 11:43 AM, said:

That was half the fun, using the mech construction rules, and making the most out what you could do, with a set budget for the mech.

But that is an aside, I've been working on a document to sent to CGL, about an updated rule set for CBT, to try and make it a little more friendly to new players, yet keep old ones more or less happy, as well as bring a little more parity between Clans and IS... one of the biggest ones, is making 4 engine hits needed to bring down a mech, it's up one from the old three, and it really helps IS XL engines, making it so you have to crit out the CT, or one ST+1 engine crit out of the other ST/CT.

How ever, as we lack a proper critcal system in MWO, it's not a system that translates well to a shooter... And I am aware that some rules do not translate well to a shooter, yet some, with some careful planning could.

Im not saying it isnt already fun, im saying its not the be-all-end-all. It could be MOAR fun.

[Metus regem]

pbiggz, on 09 March 2016 - 11:53 AM, said:

Im not saying it isnt already fun, im saying its not the be-all-end-all. It could be MOAR fun.

And that's the tricky part, what I consider more fun, maybe different from what you would consider more fun...

my, I'd like more simulation, less twitch shooter

[Gas Guzzler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 March 2016 - 11:47 AM, said:

Alright, it seems I misheard him.

Bring on the Nova Cat then.

No dual gauss though I don't even think it can do 3 UAC10s like the Night Gyr.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 09 March 2016 - 12:23 PM, said:

No dual gauss though I don't even think it can do 3 UAC10s like the Night Gyr.

It can do Dual Gauss, go check SSW again, I think a left arm has 3 ballistics on one variant and the right arm has a 1B/1E arm.

Nevermind, it was the D I was looking at, so yeah, no dual goose.

It can't do 3 UAC10s, but the Night Gyr can only do it if you like badly placed ammo.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 09 March 2016 - 12:40 PM.

[Gas Guzzler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 March 2016 - 12:38 PM, said:

It can do Dual Gauss, go check SSW again, I think a left arm has 3 ballistics on one variant and the right arm has a 1B/1E arm.

Nevermind, it was the D I was looking at, so yeah, no dual goose.

It can't do 3 UAC10s, but the Night Gyr can only do it if you like badly placed ammo.

2 tons in CT, 1 ton in each ST, up to 4 in the arm with the UAC 10, shield with the other arm, it will be fine. 1 ton in the head too. Who needs backup weapons?

[pbiggz]

Metus regem, on 09 March 2016 - 12:12 PM, said:

And that's the tricky part, what I consider more fun, maybe different from what you would consider more fun...

my, I'd like more simulation, less twitch shooter

Then you want modifications of a certain kind, but you WANT those modifications/extensions of the system. The BT system alone doesn't actually lend itself well to sims. 2 and 3 did it well because they did make certain extensions but at the same time those games were not balanced for multiplayer (or at all for that matter).

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Gas Guzzler, on 09 March 2016 - 12:49 PM, said:

2 tons in CT, 1 ton in each ST, up to 4 in the arm with the UAC 10, shield with the other arm, it will be fine. 1 ton in the head too. Who needs backup weapons?

I suppose that works, the 4 UAC5 variant sounds more enticing though.

[Gas Guzzler]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 09 March 2016 - 01:31 PM, said:

I suppose that works, the 4 UAC5 variant sounds more enticing though.

Definitely, I would run that one as well, you can set up to have a dead arm with that one as well. There is an arm with 3 Ballistic hps but 1 slot shy of letting you put 3 UAC5s on it. Doh! I guess that would be the Nova Cat's staple, 3 UAC5s in one arm and ER ML spam? Would there be tonnage for 2 LPLs and 3 UAC5s? Maybe just barely...

Honestly, both mechs sound great. Why not both?? #pgiplz

Edited by Gas Guzzler, 09 March 2016 - 01:35 PM.