218 replies to this topic

[jss78]

OP,

First, they are not cheating. It's PGI and PGI alone who decides what's cheating in their game, and they're on record on macros being fine.

Second, they don't make weapons fire faster. They make them fire at different times.

Third, they're not particularly helpful in the game. I don't believe they are commonly used at all.

(I very occasionally use one for sh*ts'n'giggles on my Quad-AC/2 Jager. It makes a cool sound, doesn't make it perform any better. Most of the time I just stagger-fire the AC/2's in groups of two using two mouse buttons and no macro.)

[CDLord HHGD]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 03 March 2016 - 01:51 PM, said:

No, but there is not going to be much difference with macros between our unit and the rest of the comp groups. As for your second part, I see a lot of people using LRMs, does that mean that they are used by comp players too?

No, comp players are using nothing but laser and dakka boats. Maybe a PPC here or there. Honestly, I do not know why more comp teams use LRMs, in a coordinated team environment, they are good fun.

I see way too many macros in CW "comp" play. Can't change what I see regardless of your team's representation of the greater community.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

cdlord, on 03 March 2016 - 01:56 PM, said:

I see way too many macros in CW "comp" play.

That doesn't mean they are good, that just means they are used.

[Dread Render]

ChronoBear, on 03 March 2016 - 01:52 PM, said:

Oh well for me its a lazy way to put a ton of Ultra 5 ammo down range. For example
LMB Fire Group 1 - Chain Fire
Space Fire group 6 - Chain Fire

You can hold down LMB and apply space bar as needed. I almost NEVER overheat and I throw a ton of shots on target. The already built in system will skip to the next available AC and or fire the "Ultra" mode if available.

I assumed a lot of folks do this.

IC...Dude, thanks... I have not tried that yet. I will tonight.
I bet that would work great with my Cauldron Born 8 ERML laser boat.
You may have created a monster ;-) mmwahahaha

[Oderint dum Metuant]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 03 March 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

It isn't a replacement for skill because a good number of top level players don't even bother with macros at all. I've never asked many how many play with macros, but I doubt it is many because their usefulness is fairly limited to begin with.

I do not use macros either

[S 0 L E N Y A]

The only way a macro is going to speed up your fire is if you are physically incapable of squeezing triggers quickly.

Fun for auto cannons.
Have a little bit of use for certain missile setups.

That is about it.

Edited by Boogie138, 03 March 2016 - 02:06 PM.

[Burke IV]

jss78, on 03 March 2016 - 01:53 PM, said:

OP,

First, they are not cheating. It's PGI and PGI alone who decides what's cheating in their game, and they're on record on macros being fine.

Only because its appears to be such a small problem. If everytime you dropped all you seen was macro ACs with that special way of hitting you that macro ACs have, i bet the forum would be awash with macro rage and PGI would change their minds.

[627]

every 2-4 weeks we have this same thread, again and again. And everytime we fall for the troll and start to explain what macros can and can not do in this game. And still people don't understand and scream cheat and hax and what not.

And if we ask for a link then, or an example or even a video, the smallest proof of those magical macros that let you shoot faster or without heat (lol, that was new though) or drop the gauss charge, there's only silence.

So again, show us some of those macros. Don't describe what they do, don't guess, show us. And then we can talk about it.

Edited by 627, 03 March 2016 - 02:22 PM.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

Only because its appears to be such a small problem. If everytime you dropped all you seen was macro ACs with that special way of hitting you that macro ACs have, i bet the forum would be awash with macro rage and PGI would change their minds.

And what problem is that?
They do not increase velocity or accuracy.
They do not do increased damage.
They do not increase cool down.
They do not bypass ghost heat issues.

If I fire 4x AC5s on a single trigger vs. 4 of them split up by 50 milisecs on a macro, outside of sound, what do you really think the practical difference would be?

What if I set up my triggers exclusively on my keyboard, and fire at the same speed as a macro, am I cheating now? I could physically produce the same effect on my own (a quarter-century as a musician can give you some pretty quick fingers) so what is the difference?

Edited by Boogie138, 03 March 2016 - 02:27 PM.

[ChronoBear]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

Only because its appears to be such a small problem. If everytime you dropped all you seen was macro ACs with that special way of hitting you that macro ACs have, i bet the forum would be awash with macro rage and PGI would change their minds.

Please show us on the armor diagram where the bad macro mech touched you... I mean seriously come on.

[S 0 L E N Y A]

I really think this is just a typical case of people complaining about stuff they do not understand.

Ignorance is a mofo

[Lostdragon]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 01:29 PM, said:

The thing with the guass is a good example tbh and is invisable aswell You are supposed to mis time occasionally, machines may have perfect repetition time after time but humans do not. That one time when you really need it and the match depends on it you are supposed to screw up because thats a level playing field. How can a gaus macro not be a cheat?

If you use the macro then you are presumably using it to fire when the charge is complete. There are times when this is going to make you miss.

[Burke IV]

Boogie138, on 03 March 2016 - 02:25 PM, said:

If I fire 4x AC5s on a single trigger vs. 4 of them split up by 50 milisecs on a macro, outside of sound, what do you really think the practical difference would be?

Leaving out that you coulndnt fire perfectly wihout the macro. Off the top of me head.... Your taget was ducking back into cover. Because of the macro 1 single shell landed that would not have had you been fring manualy because it needed that perfect 50 ms to do so. Ok thats small. Lets imagine that 1 shell killed yoru target, leaving that team without what ever weapons the target had... and then his team lose....and then his team lose by ONE mech!

Any result you can get without using any crutches are of course perfectly acceptable


ChronoBear it wasnt in this game i loath scripters as they were called

Edited by Burke IV, 03 March 2016 - 02:39 PM.

[Revis Volek]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:17 PM, said:

Only because its appears to be such a small problem. If everytime you dropped all you seen was macro ACs with that special way of hitting you that macro ACs have, i bet the forum would be awash with macro rage and PGI would change their minds.

Well if we are gonna fix the game on theoretical problems then i will just quit right now.

If and buts are not facts or proof and you argument is getting weaker by the minute it seems.

[Lostdragon]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

Leaving out that you coulndnt fire perfectly wihout the macro. Off the top of me head.... Your taget was ducking back into cover. Because of the macro 1 single shell landed that would not have had you been fring manualy because it needed that perfect 50 ms to do so. Ok thats small. Lets imagine that 1 shell killed yoru target, leaving that team without what ever weapons the target had... and then his team lose....and then his team lose by ONE mech!

Any result you can get without using any crutches are of course perfectly acceptable


ChronoBear it wasnt in this game i loath scripters as they were called

Just stop... you clearly do not want to understand and wish to remain willfully ignorant.

[Revis Volek]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:35 PM, said:

Leaving out that you coulndnt fire perfectly wihout the macro. Off the top of me head.... Your taget was ducking back into cover. Because of the macro 1 single shell landed that would not have had you been fring manualy because it needed that perfect 50 ms to do so. Ok thats small. Lets imagine that 1 shell killed yoru target, leaving that team without what ever weapons the target had... and then his team lose....and then his team lose by ONE mech!

Any result you can get without using any crutches are of course perfectly acceptable

I can fire my Luxe paintball gun over 20 BPS without a MACRO, that just my fingers....

Tell me some more about how Humans CANT do stuff machines can.




Here is an example of some nimble fingers at work, i think this guy had it capped at 25bps in Semi mode, the luls or stops you hear in the shooting are from the EYE in the gun not seeing a paintball and stopping him from firing. Outside of that he hits some pretty sweet rhythm and dumps 150 balls in a matter of 15 seconds with NO MACROS and again its in SEMI AUTO MODE so each trigger pull is ONE paintball fired.

Edited by Revis Volek, 03 March 2016 - 02:45 PM.

[Burke IV]

oh well name calling and paintball guns. That really disproves what i said

[WarHippy]

While I find the entire concept of macros in games to be distasteful they really are a non-issue.

[Revis Volek]

Burke IV, on 03 March 2016 - 02:48 PM, said:

oh well name calling and paintball guns. That really disproves what i said

Its more info then you have brought to light in over 3 pages now and it has a lot more to do with this thread then ti seems you can understand.

Muscle memory is a thing, hence why most of us practice. Weather it getting good at shooting a paintball gun or a mouse button is irrelevant. You said HUMANS CANT FIRE THAT FAST, my video just showed you they can in fact fire faster with just their fingers.

[Jables McBarty]

Macros are most useful in two major situations:
1. Charging up a gauss
2. Timing shots so you don't incur ghost heat while firing at maximum threshold. This is what people mean when they say "fire faster."

Benefit of the former is debatable; Benefit of the latter is pretty significant, as it essentially creates reliable high alphas while circumventing ghost heat. So there's no risk of choking in a high-intensity situation, which is what everyone who doesn't use macros risks.

Sandpit, on 03 March 2016 - 12:49 PM, said:

It's not cheating.
That's a factual statement because it's not against the factual rules.

Your opinion is that it is cheating.

Now, which do you think has more authority in regards to declaring what cheating is.
You?
or the company the developed the game?

C'mon Sandpit. You have nearly 20,000 posts. You're saying that you've never tried to ask PGI to change their policy on anything?

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 03 March 2016 - 01:34 PM, said:

It isn't a replacement for skill because a good number of top level players don't even bother with macros at all. I've never asked many how many play with macros, but I doubt it is many because their usefulness is fairly limited to begin with.

Top-level players are probably good enough not to need them. What really matters is not the advantage they give you over other players, but the advantage they give you over your baseline performance. Player X performs at 45% efficiency. Player X + Macros performs at 50% efficiency. The scale difference is less important than the fact that it exists.

LORD TSARKON, on 03 March 2016 - 01:35 PM, said:

How would you feel if lasers had a charge mechanic or regular PPCs or even EVery weapon in the game? how ******** would that be...

Honestly, I think it'd make the game more interesting, if each type of weapon had a different firing mechanism.

jss78, on 03 March 2016 - 01:53 PM, said:

Third, they're not particularly helpful in the game. I don't believe they are commonly used at all.

Anecdotal, but I sort of agree with this point. I'm sure that PGI either could or has pulled numbers on this, but it's their prerogative.

OP, I feel you. It feels dirty to me. It feels dishonest, and I think in the end, your own sense of honor for not using macros is the best remedy to the situation.