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Anyone Else Find Is Mechs Easy Mode?


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#21 Idealsuspect

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:30 PM

View PostSatan n stuff, on 09 May 2016 - 02:25 PM, said:

Bring fewer lasers and add some heat sinks. It's not that hard.



You do same for your grasshoppers, thunderbold, blackknight, firestarters, blackjack, battlemasters etc ?

Even with almost 30 clan heatsinks you will overheat faster than an IS mech with 20 .. open li song mechlab and just read the stats....
Also what is your point with your wise advice " take less weapons and more heatsink when the mechs on the other side can just bring less heatsink and more weapons and overheat less " ??? Posted Image

Edit: Oh you are tier 3 ok thank for advice lol.

Edited by Idealsuspect, 09 May 2016 - 02:33 PM.


#22 MechWarrior319348

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:34 PM

Direct reply to OP:

If you find IS mechs easy, that means you are an Inner sphere pilot.

Clan mechs and IS mechs require a little bit of a different play style to make them dance. Chances are that you are efficient with both techs, but you might really click with IS mechs.

Its like knowing how to fly helicopters, and airplanes. You will be better at one over the other in this scenario too.

#23 Satan n stuff

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:36 PM

View PostIdealsuspect, on 09 May 2016 - 02:30 PM, said:



You do same for your grasshoppers, thunderbold, blackknight, firestarters, blackjack, battlemasters etc ?

Even with almost 30 clan heatsinks you will overheat faster than an IS mech with 20 .. open li song mechlab and just read the stats....
Also what is your point with your wise advice " take less weapons and more heatsink when the mechs on the other side can just bring less heatsink and more weapons and overheat less " ??? Posted Image

An IS mech more often than not literally can't bring more heat sinks because they take up so much space. If they could people would do it. As far as your curiously missing stats go, how much damage can you put out in one alpha? What is it's range? I'm guessing at least one of those is significantly higher than the typical IS laserboat.

Edited by Satan n stuff, 09 May 2016 - 02:37 PM.


#24 Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:40 PM

View PostDelta 62, on 09 May 2016 - 02:34 PM, said:

Direct reply to OP:

If you find IS mechs easy, that means you are an Inner sphere pilot.

Clan mechs and IS mechs require a little bit of a different play style to make them dance. Chances are that you are efficient with both techs, but you might really click with IS mechs.

Its like knowing how to fly helicopters, and airplanes. You will be better at one over the other in this scenario too.


I've always been a Clanner at heart, but I feel like I was made to pilot IS mechs in this game. You might just be right.

View PostSatan n stuff, on 09 May 2016 - 02:36 PM, said:

An IS mech more often than not literally can't bring more heat sinks because they take up so much space. If they could people would do it. As far as your curiously missing stats go, how much damage can you put out in one alpha? What is it's range? I'm guessing at least one of those is significantly higher than the typical IS laserboat.


My IS mechs generally have higher alphas than my clan mechs. I tend to run more lasers on my IS mechs than the clan ones because its way too hot to. For lasers only Black Knight (2 LPL + 5 MPL) vs Timber Wolf (2 CLPL + 3 ERML) my Timber Wolf would have more range and would run cooler, but the Black Knight would have higher damage and would also have burn times that are half of what the Timber Wolf has. It is easy to get within range through back routes to negate a range advantage, but 52 damage in about half a second isn't something to easy to negate with something like a Timber Wolf with its massive shoulders and CT poking out.

The Black Knight would cut the main side torso off the Timber Wolf in 2 alpha strikes leaving it with just 2 ERML. The Timber Wolf would hit with 1 alpha, 2 at best before that happens and its damage would be spread over the 3 torsos of the Black Knight in that beam duration that is over a second long. Throw in structure quirks and agility and firepower boosts on the Black Knight and the negative quirks on some Timber Wolf pods and it is even easier for the Black Knight.

Another example would be Banshee with 5 LPL vs Warhawk with 4 LPL, 55 vs 52 firepower, high mounts vs low mounts, 35 heat for 5 lasers vs 40 heat for 4, heat, range, duration, and cooldown quirks at 10% vs at best a 4% heat duration quirk, and half second duration vs second duration, 10 ton weight gap. The Warhawk's advantages are 0.9 kph more speed and ~200m more optimal range. Would go similar to the Black Knight vs Timber Wolf fight. Both mechs have ghost heat so they split into two groups, so Banshee has a 1-1.5 second duration and Warhawk has a 1.5-2 second duration depending on how the players manage the firing. Warhawk loses a sidetorso after 2 full burns from the Banshee, the Warhawk wouldn't even be able to burn through a full side torso if it had perfect accuracy in that time. The Warhawk would lose in any case in which it didn't have perfect accuracy hitting one side torso all the time, of course with its beam duration and the Banshee's torso twist and arm shields we know that won't be happening.

The heat issue isn't as much that one side or the other can't carry as many heatsinks, its that one side generates much less heat than the other in battle and the range advantage the clans have to make up for that gets negated battles quite easily due to cover.

Edited by Dakota1000, 09 May 2016 - 03:03 PM.


#25 Bulletsponge0

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 02:41 PM

View PostCoolant, on 09 May 2016 - 01:41 PM, said:

Clan and IS more balanced then they ever have been

Exactly...

they just have different play styles is all

#26 Felicitatem Parco

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:16 PM

View PostIdealsuspect, on 09 May 2016 - 02:30 PM, said:

Edit: Oh you are tier 3 ok thank for advice lol.


Why are you even here? Aren't you supposed to be elevated up to a higher plane of existence with your elite Tier Status? I mean, stooping so low as to have open discussion with us plebes is surely causing your ego much pain...

#27 Satan n stuff

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:25 PM

View PostIdealsuspect, on 09 May 2016 - 02:30 PM, said:

Edit: Oh you are tier 3 ok thank for advice lol.

That's what you get for spending most of your time in faction play. Do you expect me to bow down to you for having played an arbitrary number of QP matches? I regularly fight competitive level players and handle myself just fine. I've also seen you ingame occasionally and you never impressed me, so please take your attitude and blast it with your "inferior" laserboat.

#28 Idealsuspect

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:31 PM

View PostProsperity Park, on 09 May 2016 - 03:16 PM, said:

Why are you even here? Aren't you supposed to be elevated up to a higher plane of existence with your elite Tier Status? I mean, stooping so low as to have open discussion with us plebes is surely causing your ego much pain...


Lol maybe i am a darth lord of troll like PGI guys too you will put me in your signature or just feed a little sarcasm?

View PostSatan n stuff, on 09 May 2016 - 02:36 PM, said:

An IS mech more often than not literally can't bring more heat sinks because they take up so much space. If they could people would do it. As far as your curiously missing stats go, how much damage can you put out in one alpha? What is it's range? I'm guessing at least one of those is significantly higher than the typical IS laserboat.


you true for first point the thing is as clanner you can do awesome damage if you know how pilot it ..
BUT obviously most of people in this game don't know how and will never learn how ( and tier mean nothing even it could be a little explanation for some case )

A match i just did 10 minutes ago >>>
Posted Image
http://img15.hosting...010500Copie.jpg

Dont worry about my results my builds are ok and i know how use them, i can perfom nice both side and i can say >>>

Quote

IS is EASY EASY MODE.

Edited by Idealsuspect, 09 May 2016 - 03:45 PM.


#29 oldradagast

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:34 PM

Some of may be play-style preferences. Clan mechs tend to run hotter and not be as durable (based on quirks), though they have higher alphas and better range. Also, their autocannons tend to be awful unless boated.

#30 Idealsuspect

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:36 PM

View PostSatan n stuff, on 09 May 2016 - 03:25 PM, said:

That's what you get for spending most of your time in faction play. Do you expect me to bow down to you for having played an arbitrary number of QP matches? I regularly fight competitive level players and handle myself just fine. I've also seen you ingame occasionally and you never impressed me, so please take your attitude and blast it with your "inferior" laserboat.


Irrevelant i play only FW too ... Check leaderboard i am in 12th rank and 7th about kills...
When i play QP i never go down in PSR even with 10 lose in a row.

Why i did should impressed you? I am an average good player...
But one thing i never noticed your name inverse isnt true it seem.. Posted Image (strange for my part i never notice average pilot good or bad in fact maybe you different)
Come duel me i want learn from you Posted Image

Edited by Idealsuspect, 09 May 2016 - 03:37 PM.


#31 VaudeVillain

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:41 PM

I like how people who run meta builds think they're awesome players. The players that impress me are the ones who do well in average or subpar 'Mechs because they use skill. Games that are about diversity stop being fun because elitists demand that you gear up a certain way and that's it.

#32 Lord0fHats

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:46 PM

Games that are about diversity stop being fun because people confuse "good builds" with "undiverse" and proceed to complain about words like "meta"* without understanding what they mean and proceed to unleash a flurry of terrible ideas* into the game and complain on the forums about "meta" rather than learning the game and realizing that some builds are just bad builds.

*yeah LRM Atlas. I'm looking at you. You started this!

#33 oldradagast

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:52 PM

View PostVaudeVillain, on 09 May 2016 - 03:41 PM, said:

I like how people who run meta builds think they're awesome players. The players that impress me are the ones who do well in average or subpar 'Mechs because they use skill. Games that are about diversity stop being fun because elitists demand that you gear up a certain way and that's it.


Thankfully, for all the bluster on the forums, MWO in game is relatively tame when it comes to people making demands on what builds one runs (no idea what goes on in big units, but you get the idea.) I agree with what you're saying, though. Some games are full of just horrible people, the types that will team-kill anyone not running a meta-build, or simply refuse to let them in their game if they aren't meta-enough. It's telling to watch how people behave in such circumstances, and it's often rather pathetic.

Edited by oldradagast, 09 May 2016 - 03:52 PM.


#34 Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 03:52 PM

@Idealsuspect:

I've been looking for different builds for CW and was wondering what it is you were running in that 3k damage match, most of my matches tend to be 1500 to 2250 damage, though my first mech usually has 900-1000 damage and I have a second mech running the same build in the deck that doesn't get as much. Either way I'm curious as to what you run to get damage numbers like that while also maintaining highest kills on the team.

#35 Idealsuspect

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 04:09 PM

Well dakota my first mech ( i did 2K with ) was ebon jag 2lpls + 4erlms + tonns of heatsinks ( satan it seem i didnt wait after your advice obviously ) + one TC 1tonn.

But i have to say in this match IS team wasn't really good, they were passive when they could just rolled us really nasty if they did push us coze my team was lol.
And this map is really nice with clan side when in sulfur or vitric well its simply impossible to perfom when you dont drop with bunch of good pilots with you coze heat suck for clan... even 1 gauss + 2lpls you overheat really fast.
Also this kind of result is pretty rare for me in clan side.

Quote

Most of my matches tend to be 1500 to 2250 damage, though my first mech usually has 900-1000 damage

Exactly same for me in clan side but when in IS side i do this only when i do a bad match ...
And good match in IS side look like more 15 kills and 2500 damage average.

IS is really EASY mode it's a fact... And i dont attack IS pilots about this i will go back to IS side.

#36 VaudeVillain

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 04:17 PM

I understand your confusion. Yes, people do need to learn to do better builds, but there's more than just the meta builds out there that can do well. And when something that is overly OP gets nerfed, a lot of people complain about it instead of acknowledging it was OP because they can't do their uber damage.

#37 Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 04:32 PM

View PostIdealsuspect, on 09 May 2016 - 04:09 PM, said:

Well dakota my first mech ( i did 2K with ) was ebon jag 2lpls + 4erlms + tonns of heatsinks ( satan it seem i didnt wait after your advice obviously ) + one TC 1tonn.

But i have to say in this match IS team wasn't really good, they were passive when they could just rolled us really nasty if they did push us coze my team was lol.
And this map is really nice with clan side when in sulfur or vitric well its simply impossible to perfom when you dont drop with bunch of good pilots with you coze heat suck for clan... even 1 gauss + 2lpls you overheat really fast.
Also this kind of result is pretty rare for me in clan side.


Exactly same for me in clan side but when in IS side i do this only when i do a bad match ...
And good match in IS side look like more 15 kills and 2500 damage average.

IS is really EASY mode it's a fact... And i dont attack IS pilots about this i will go back to IS side.


I've been noticing recently on the clan side that we are losing matches even when I look on the enemy team and see bad builds like triple AC2 battlemasters, LRM atlases, multiple urbanmechs, Vindicators, etc. I look at my own team and see Mist Lynxes and Gargoyles though. Both sides to have their few god tier mechs on them though, like one guy running 4 oxides or the load of Black Knights, against the Hellbringers, EBJs, and Timber Wolves. Clans tend to do good when they are in a full team against pugs at least, but when I faced off against full IS teams, especially on brawling maps, they could use their force to just steam roll right through enemies in a counter push on their defense missions. My memories of being on Kurita are of me in Black Knights and Banshees cutting down Ebon Jaguars and Timber Wolves or being in my Mauler defending against hoards of enemies until my ammo ran dry.

I really should take up another contract with Kurita again.

#38 Brizna

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 04:33 PM

Right now I think IS mechs are superior to clan mech by a noticeable chunk. My unit is merc and we rotate, and man this week has been rough. We tried to do something different, brawl, but clans can't brawl. IS you can pull it off, IS brawl is deadly even if risky, clan brawling is stupidly hot and almost imposible to pull off even against laser vomit IS builds, simply put IS laser vomit is at least as heat efficient at dealing dmg in the <150m bracket with laser vomit than SPL+SRM clan mechs which is dumb. Competitive clan mechs come in just one flavour laser vomit, and this needs a fix.

#39 Idealsuspect

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 04:59 PM

View PostVaudeVillain, on 09 May 2016 - 04:17 PM, said:

I understand your confusion. Yes, people do need to learn to do better builds, but there's more than just the meta builds out there that can do well. And when something that is overly OP gets nerfed, a lot of people complain about it instead of acknowledging it was OP because they can't do their uber damage.


What are you talking about?
This thread isnt about meta builds, stop be obsessed.
This thread is about: its harder to perfom with clan mechs vs is mechs or its easier to perfom with IS mechs vs clan mechs.


Is mechs are easier to drive if you are a good pilot, torso twist is better cose most of clan weapons have high duration also IS mechs durability is higher even with or without structure quirks ( of course even more better with ).


PGI have to solve at last one thing for bring balance. Solve duration problem for clan or solve clans heatsink lack of cooling effect.
For me PGI should just remove lots of durations IS quirks and maybe lower some clans laser duration or give higher duration for some IS laser ( good for increase TTK )
And rollback a bit recent clan heatsink nerf not totally but just a bit.. like they did a little rollback in gauss cooldown recent nerf.


The thing is the game isnt totally unbalanced but it is a bit and in hand of new players or bads pilots this effect is like twice or tripple when with good pilots its just a weakness balanced with XL clan engine durability, weapons range or boat loadouts,
goods pilots who can deal with this weakness by using ballistic clan or pulse/srms builds effectively...

Dakota what is your solution maybe another idea or maybe i am totally wrong ?

#40 Naduk

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Posted 09 May 2016 - 05:11 PM

quick play is the easy mode

play IS in faction play and see how quickly your thoughts fall apart

if you dont believe me , run your clan mechs as if they were IS mechs
use C-SML instead of IS-ML , dont use streaks, carry no more than 2x ERppc or LPL
load up on AC20 backed with smalls and srm
enjoy being OP





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