99 replies to this topic

[SmokeGuar]

Lets remember that population numbers are total members in units, not active players.

What comes to Smoke Jaguars in general and loyalist units, there is currently afaik just 1 larger loyalist unit.

At time time of last reset unit had 130 members, at writing this 65 has logged in and confirmed status. So half of unit is awol and has been most of this year. Major part for this is december patch that nerfed clans. This is now creating clean up of idle members.

Of these 65 maybe 10% are active in FW, 20% play some and part during events. Contrast this to active merc units.

FW mainly now runs around merc groups, large and small. Activity is what counts not unit size.

Lastly those on larger merc units clearly have hard time grasping how bad current balance between IS and Clan is, pugs on Clan side are totally defenseless against IS, regadless if they are units or other pugs.

[Spider00x]

OK first of all I don't blame, hate or dislike MS for forming a super group I mean the level of organization these guys put into the game is amazing, hell I have a hard time even getting my guys to sync drop the right mechs in the right rounds. In terms of strategic game play the really push the envelope to the point PGI had to be like damn we didn't think of that time to nerf this and that...

That being said I don't think MS as a whole is good for FW. I wouldn't describe MS as mercenaries more like maurading group of warlords similar to ghengis khan huge army roaming around the world wrecking shop. Which is all fine and good but it's not in the spirit of the game. MS is a faction onto itself withas a larger population than most sovereign factions. The real political power should rest withe loyalists not mercenaries traditionally through history mercs were small banded units who aided in conflicts or acted as throw away shock troopers. 300 Highly trained guys just dismantled the whole way FW is designed to be played. KCOM is a perfect example of a small merc unit that can turn the tide of battle but not necessarily dominate and crush everything before them on a grind for 24 straight hours until there contract is up.

Pugs don't want to deal with that so they go back to quick play it's as simple as that.

Here's another example, let's say you have a total player roster of 400 guys 300 are all on the same team leaving 100 or so left over between smaller teams you effectivly have a hugely lopsided player base. I mean MWO just doesn't have enough competent and organized teams. I mean thats why we have a draft in pro sports to keep the wealthiest teams from gobbling up the best players.

I'm sure I'm gonna get QQ'd and mocked for this post but everyone knows it's true it's bad for the game mode. And again I don't blame MS for taking advantage of how the game is structured but what your seeing now in CW is the inevitable result.

Edited by Spider00x, 19 May 2016 - 07:38 AM.

[Stahlherz]

Karmen Baric, on 18 May 2016 - 01:40 PM, said:

Faction Play phase 3 puts all the Merc units together.


EVIL, Kcom, 228, MS, BMMU, maybe others, all went to Jade Falcons together and likely will go to next faction together & the one after that. Now i hear people talking to not bother attacking or defending against Falcons as the best units are all there. Way to ruin the game.

I am very sure that BMMU would absolutely not have switched to CJF if they had known MS and 288 would go there. We were actually looking forward to have some drops with BMMU to fight on the Steiner front.
MS and 288 switching was a total surprise and we suffer from it as everyone else. Too many people for attacks and since noo ne is attacking us there are no outlets to spread pilots to.

Despite current tin-foil-hat conspiracies about merc super-pacs we do not arrange such situations among each other.

[Moldur]

Something something, splitting the population a dozen different ways and having empty fronts. It is no wonder tons of players group together in only a few factions. There's no other way to get into a game.

[Dawnstealer]

A massively popular idea, I'm sure, would be to limit merc units to a regiment (three companies). The merc units are SO large that even if you mount a lively defense, you're going to lose because have to do those weird things like eat, sleep, and go to work. Meanwhile, the big mercs can just throw continuous waves through every time cycle because their population is so huge.

Scouting's fun, though. Having a lot of fun Scouting. Wish it was worth more loyalty points, but...eh.

[Spider00x]

We have a lot of friends in BMMU I was looking forward to dropping with them in PKRL. We trade tactics whenever they come steiner but the stint was super short this time around.

[Sinister Maestro]

simple solution --->

shakes, on 18 May 2016 - 10:22 PM, said:

......

I see several ways of fixing the problem (in order of importance):

1) Pop threshold for Mercs taking contracts. Forget about the hard limit to group sizes. If MS joined Jade Falcon, no other unit would be able to join for the duration of that contract so they’d have to join others and fight MS instead. MS being such a large unit would only be able to join factions with the lowest pops to begin with. If they want more choice theyd have to shrink their size down. Putting a threshold on would help regulate ballooning unit sizes too.
.....

[DarklightCA]

Stahlherz, on 19 May 2016 - 07:41 AM, said:

I am very sure that BMMU would absolutely not have switched to CJF if they had known MS and 288 would go there. We were actually looking forward to have some drops with BMMU to fight on the Steiner front.
MS and 288 switching was a total surprise and we suffer from it as everyone else. Too many people for attacks and since noo ne is attacking us there are no outlets to spread pilots to.

Despite current tin-foil-hat conspiracies about merc super-pacs we do not arrange such situations among each other.

Was it really that much of a suprise tho? CJF has always been 228's Clan choice and with the Kodiaks out, it was time for a Clan contract. KCom has always been CJF. I honestly thought MS would have gone Wolf. Not sure what BMMU usually contracts for Clan's.

[Stahlherz]

DarklightCA, on 19 May 2016 - 07:54 AM, said:

Was it really that much of a suprise tho?.

Yes it was. Other Clans are on the brink of extinction. CJF was still doing well enough.
As Mercs we need to spread the butter more because the default reaction of opposing loyalist units is to turtle in and go for a weaker neighbor instead.
For communication among Mercs it should serve the purpose to avoid overstacking rather than super-pacing.

[Spider00x]

Honestly stalh yall should go steiner you'd have matches for days and honestly yall would probably be able to hold those planets long enough to gain some MC. It's just tough cause I'm sure everyone is anxious to play the Kodiak in CW

[General Solo]

Count Zero 74, on 18 May 2016 - 01:46 PM, said:

And again Sir, you're not allowed to whine and cry here, you're not Steiner. It is our PGI given right and I will not stand for some bloody foreigner sneaking in here doing my job !

But it is our Mission in life!

[Stahlherz]

Spider00x, on 19 May 2016 - 08:32 AM, said:

Honestly stalh yall should go steiner you'd have matches for days and honestly yall would probably be able to hold those planets long enough to gain some MC. It's just tough cause I'm sure everyone is anxious to play the Kodiak in CW

We were Jade Falcon before it was cool.

[DarklightCA]

Stahlherz, on 19 May 2016 - 08:24 AM, said:

Yes it was. Other Clans are on the brink of extinction. CJF was still doing well enough.
As Mercs we need to spread the butter more because the default reaction of opposing loyalist units is to turtle in and go for a weaker neighbor instead.
For communication among Mercs it should serve the purpose to avoid overstacking rather than super-pacing.

It really shouldn't have. 228 has always taken CJF contracts when we went Clan since beta 2 and with the Kodiaks being released should have been obvious we were taking a Clan contract and going CJF.

[Stahlherz]

DarklightCA, on 19 May 2016 - 08:43 AM, said:

It really shouldn't have. 228 has always taken CJF contracts when we went Clan since beta 2 and with the Kodiaks being released should have been obvious we were taking a Clan contract and going CJF.

I'll keep it in mind for the future, but indeed I was surprised and no amount of disbelief by your side will change that statement.

[Gotham by Knight]

AnTi90d, on 18 May 2016 - 08:54 AM, said:

So, if you're Inner Sphere, your only option is to walk forward and die against the Super Falcon Alliance.. or sit in another queue, alone, for seven hours.. or just not play FP at all.

Finding an Inner Sphere unit or group to drop with isn't an option, as House coms have been dead for three days. The in-game LFG isn't used by the community and no one responds to faction chat.

GG, PGI. Phase 3 is a smashing success.. for clan based mercenaries that want to club seals for millions of Cbills.

The only thing that has sabotaged FP is the players themselves, and their generally poor attitude. faction play is exactly that, FACTION PLAY not SOLO play.

Instead of people getting onto TS hubs and getting more social and teaming up and working together, we'll juust carry on super soloing and complain about large units until we get them split up....Thereby punishing those people who could be bothered to do something we couldn't be....

Don't sound right does it? That's because it isn't.

[Spider00x]

The issue isn't the smaller merc units like kcom and BMMU it'd the one that are larger that field multiple 12 man's at a time like 228 and MS.

[Gerwig]

The game is not big enough for massive units. PGI will realize this or die by it.

[DarklightCA]

Spider00x, on 19 May 2016 - 08:55 AM, said:

The issue isn't the smaller merc units like kcom and BMMU it'd the one that are larger that field multiple 12 man's at a time like 228 and MS.

228 is a competitive unit not a Community Warfare unit. We don't have multiple dedicated 12 man's running around Community Warfare.

[Widowmaker1981]

To be perfectly honest, i see only one way CW can ever function like an actual persistent war is if there is no faction hopping, at all basically. Merc units swapping between IS factions i can see, but no swapping between Clan and IS, period.

If you allow Merc units to flit between Clan and IS as they do now, and make CW the only way to play the longer, drop deck type game modes you force the current situation where faction superiority is a random by-product of where all the powerful merc units happen to be this week/month. It doesnt matter what you do with rewards, mercs are that way because they want variety, the option to play both types of mechs in the invasion game mode is more important than Cbills. Limiting Unit size wont help, the merc units will get smaller, but they will still dominate because on the whole the people who want to play mercs are the ones with huge garages and lots of time in game. i.e. generally the better players.

My suggestion (which will never happen) is this:

step 1) Recreate CW in a way that somewhat mimics NBT: separate mech garage, limited mech availability based on factory ownership/trade, no faction hopping beyond merc units swapping internally in IS (and maybe some form of Clan mercs, too).

step 2) Include a version of every CW gametype in a matchmade quickplay queue, preferably with some kind of rankings. Step 1 wont fly unless people are able to see the variety in the game in a worthwhile fashion, in all the game types.

[Freeman 52]

Widowmaker1981, on 19 May 2016 - 09:00 AM, said:

My suggestion (which will never happen) is this:

step 1) Recreate CW in a way that somewhat mimics NBT: separate mech garage, limited mech availability based on factory ownership/trade, no faction hopping beyond merc units swapping internally in IS (and maybe some form of Clan mercs, too).

step 2) Include a version of every CW gametype in a matchmade quickplay queue, preferably with some kind of rankings. Step 1 wont fly unless people are able to see the variety in the game in a worthwhile fashion, in all the game types.

Mission accomplished. Well done, sir.