96 replies to this topic

[LordKnightFandragon]

Sader325, on 31 May 2016 - 11:45 AM, said:

Guess I was half watching that at some point. I was 8m into that video whe nI clicked that link haha.

As for the PPCs, yeah, they dont move that slow anymore, its actually possible to do something with them now.

[Mystere]

The "Boom! Boom! Boom!" of chain-fired PPCs keeping enemies' heads down sound so much better than even the constant dakka of ballistic weapons.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Mystere, on 31 May 2016 - 11:51 AM, said:

The "Boom! Boom! Boom!" of chain-fired PPCs keeping enemies' heads down sound so much better than even the constant dakka of ballistic weapons.

I know its hella fun to do.

I would say they are nicer now. Scored a 1050ish dmg game with 5 kills with these new CERPPCs and mah 'Hawk.

They require lead at range, but its just a few meters, not 3 1/2 foot ball fields like before. Was scoring nice hits on a Warhammer from beyond their max range, ofc, he killed my Marauder buddy, but still, I let him have it. Managed a number of long range hits on mechs that were just barely poking over. They do things I could never do before and im not really playing it any different. Stay at range, shoot the red dots.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 31 May 2016 - 01:24 PM.

[Barantor]

Mystere, on 31 May 2016 - 11:51 AM, said:

The "Boom! Boom! Boom!" of chain-fired PPCs keeping enemies' heads down sound so much better than even the constant dakka of ballistic weapons.

Especially in an Awesome. *nods sagely*

[Corrado]

now the 2xERPPC nova is good. the 2xERPPC summoner slightly better. the 2xgauss 2xERPPC DWF/Kodiak a dream. just TC1 for a slight muzzle velocity increase and it's really accurate and easy at range.

[Lightfoot]

I have 2 PPCs on my Raven 2X. They work decently and I didn't see any mechs that seemed invulnerable=ON when they were hit by them. I changed from FXAA to MSAA, but otherwise no changes to the game config since PPCs were not working.

[Clownwarlord]

They are still slow, and that has been the only problem with them ever. It is more of an issue for ERPPCs than regular PPCs because you are less able to use the range because you have to lead by a lot which increases chance to miss.

Example of what I am talking about it 600 to 700 meters or farther.

Edited by Captain Luffy, 31 May 2016 - 02:51 PM.

[DONTOR]

They work alright, you can have 2 CERPPCs and a 2.0 / 100% heat eff. on a kodiak thanks to, removing endo ferro, and an XL400. Is it good probably not, but could be fun for a bit. firing CERPPCs and never overheating sounds intriguing.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Lightfoot, on 31 May 2016 - 02:43 PM, said:

I have 2 PPCs on my Raven 2X. They work decently and I didn't see any mechs that seemed invulnerable=ON when they were hit by them. I changed from FXAA to MSAA, but otherwise no changes to the game config since PPCs were not working.

Lol, speaking of Ravens, I 2 bursted one, who knew, hit reg worked.....40 dmg right to the stationary nose of a Raven, pop goes his weasel.

it was was fun in the battle just before the raven game where I was just unloading into a Centurion and Kodiak from above on Crimson, then a Warhammer in the tunnel...PPCs are fun when you get to just sit there and unload.

Edited by LordKnightFandragon, 31 May 2016 - 02:53 PM.

[Chados]

Juodas Varnas, on 31 May 2016 - 11:21 AM, said:

PPCs are fine on heavily quirked chassis.

They're not fine on... Anything else.

What they should do with PPCs, in my humble opinion, is significantly increase their base velocity (50% would be enough), remove any velocity quirks from mechs that have them (if the base velocity is increased, the quirks are no longer necessary and having different mechs with vastly different projectile velocities is a real pain in the arse to use). Next, they should really change the way the minimum range works for IS PPCs.
Instead of dealing 0 damage 0<90 meters. I'd argue for full damage, however if fired under 90 meters, they would deal small amounts of internal damage to the mech (that would be percentage based and not a flat amount, because i don't want to f*ck over smaller mechs).

This. The mechs with 40-50% PPC velocity quirks are the ones to put PPCs on. Up that velocity!

Frankly, PPCs ought to be hitscan weapons like lasers. They're particle beams. They travel at the speed of light. Like lasers. It ought to be like getting hit with a bolt of lightning. Super-short duration, unmasks ECM, heavy damage, drawbacks being much more heat and slower recycle time than lasers have. In the absence of the old poptart meta good PPC mechs would be a counter for ballistic boats like the Kodiak and SRM scooters like the Jenner. Of course, TTK would be just as bad as always.

The real problem is hardpoint inflation. No mech ought to be able to boat *4* uAC10s. There has to be somewhere to put all the machinery, and the ammo, and consider all the other equipment that any mech would need. And no 30 tonner ought to be able to throw a thirty-point alpha strike. A lore-build 3R Marauder throws 35 points and can't use its biggest guns inside 90 meters. Hardpoint inflation is the real problem.

Edited by Chados, 31 May 2016 - 03:02 PM.

[wanderer]

Quote

The real problem is hardpoint inflation. No mech ought to be able to boat *4* uAC10s. There has to be somewhere to put all the machinery, and the ammo, and consider all the other equipment that any mech would need. And no 30 tonner ought to be able to throw a thirty-point alpha strike. A lore-build 3R Marauder throws 35 points and can't use its biggest guns inside 90 meters. Hardpoint inflation is the real problem.

Using a 3025-era stock build is a bad way to win an argument. For that matter:

The Annihilator Clantech version packs exactly what you dread -stock-, quad UAC/10s. And quad ERMLs, for that matter, putting it rather close to some KDK-3 weapon layouts. And on top of that, it's cake to make a Dire Wolf with the same layout in MWO.

Stock Kit Fox D's can dump 35 damage and not even worry about overheat, never mind customized ones. Or the Hellion, which actually manages to alpha up to 42 albeit heating itself up considerably.

Even TT laserboats like the Flashman can outdo the Marauder at 75 tons- the 3025 version throws 41 damage and doesn't care about minimum range, even. Or the Black Knight downteched...which gets off a 49 point blast. Even the 3025-era Orion manages a 43 point alpha!

And let's not forget the classic Hunchback-P, the original laserboat of MWO. Stock 43-point alpha and it's all of 50 tons.

The problem is, was, and will continue to be putting all the damage into one precise spot. Even MWO's finest aren't doing much that doesn't exist stock already.

[Aiden Skye]

Laser vomit is super boring. Most clan ballistics feel weak unless boated. Missiles could be fun on the right chassis..but My PPC shadowcat and PPC adder keep me coming back.

Wish PGI were as generous with the PPC quirks for clans as they are for IS....but thats a rant for another day....

[LordKnightFandragon]

W A R K H A N, on 31 May 2016 - 04:26 PM, said:

Laser vomit is super boring. Most clan ballistics feel weak unless boated. Missiles could be fun on the right chassis..but My PPC shadowcat and PPC adder keep me coming back.

Wish PGI were as generous with the PPC quirks for clans as they are for IS....but thats a rant for another day....

Yeah, PPCs are alot more fun then lasers. The only thing that sucks if when you rake a guy over and look at the paper doll and see yellow, instead of orange, red and stripped. Id still like to see CERPPC bumped up to like 13 dmg.

[Mystere]

LordKnightFandragon, on 31 May 2016 - 04:30 PM, said:

Yeah, PPCs are alot more fun then lasers. The only thing that sucks if when you rake a guy over and look at the paper doll and see yellow, instead of orange, red and stripped. Id still like to see CERPPC bumped up to like 13 dmg.

Just make it the full 15 damage as it's supposed to be.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Mystere, on 31 May 2016 - 04:40 PM, said:

Just make it the full 15 damage as it's supposed to be.

Yes please? BUt the more likely outcome would be 12 or 13 or something less. I mean, I would love to gut punch someone for 30 then 30 more, but yeah....not likely.

[Trauglodyte]

Juodas Varnas, on 31 May 2016 - 11:21 AM, said:

PPCs are fine on heavily quirked chassis.

They're not fine on... Anything else.

What they should do with PPCs, in my humble opinion, is significantly increase their base velocity (50% would be enough), remove any velocity quirks from mechs that have them (if the base velocity is increased, the quirks are no longer necessary and having different mechs with vastly different projectile velocities is a real pain in the arse to use). Next, they should really change the way the minimum range works for IS PPCs.
Instead of dealing 0 damage 0<90 meters. I'd argue for full damage, however if fired under 90 meters, they would deal small amounts of internal damage to the mech (that would be percentage based and not a flat amount, because i don't want to f*ck over smaller mechs).

I challenge that line of thinking because PPCs have been fine from day 1 of this game and still, even unquirked, are fine. I run a PPC on my CDA-2A and there isn't a problem.

I really think that the community has turned into a bunch of freaking sissies because their toys aren't as shiny as they used to be. I hate to sound like a jaded veteran but most of you would have balled up into a fetal position run away crying on the interwebs if you had to have used the PPC back in Beta. It was 10 heat, DHSs weren't working, 800 m/s velocity, and zero HSR. Nobody complains about the AC/5 being bad but the PPC is a pure piece of garbage.

[LordKnightFandragon]

Trauglodyte, on 31 May 2016 - 05:28 PM, said:

I challenge that line of thinking because PPCs have been fine from day 1 of this game and still, even unquirked, are fine. I run a PPC on my CDA-2A and there isn't a problem.

I really think that the community has turned into a bunch of freaking sissies because their toys aren't as shiny as they used to be. I hate to sound like a jaded veteran but most of you would have balled up into a fetal position run away crying on the interwebs if you had to have used the PPC back in Beta. It was 10 heat, DHSs weren't working, 800 m/s velocity, and zero HSR. Nobody complains about the AC/5 being bad but the PPC is a pure piece of garbage.

Well, AC5 isnt 10 heat for starters, that alone would make it better then the PPC in the situation you describe. At least it would have a good refire rate. Though, yeah, what the crap, that is a terrible PPC, 800ms? useless much?

[LowSubmarino]

Im no fan of is ppcs. I cant recall how often I managed to surive brawls well into the game when xl mounting mechs were already dmged or when lights thought a cerppc mech is defenseless. Not doing any dmg below 90 meters with ppcs just sux too hard. Id never use them.
But 2 cerppcs with a tc 5 + works fantastic. But I wouldnt use then in immobile heavies or assaults. Ppcs are the perfect no face time weapon. Thats an awesome strength. Even their weaknesses of bad heat is absolutely worth it. To make most out of this weapon you play into that strength. You use mechs that allow you to actually play the no face time style. And for that you need hardpoints and decent mobility. Lights cant atm boat 2 cerppcs + tc 5 effectively atm. You need heat dissipation of at least 1,40 or better 1.43 to be able to fire them reasonably often.

On clan side this leaves medium mechs. They are atm the best choice for cerppcs. That combo is great though. Without a tc 5 + or if you depend on armor rather than no face time they arent half as great.

[Kubernetes]

Captain Luffy, on 31 May 2016 - 02:50 PM, said:

They are still slow, and that has been the only problem with them ever. It is more of an issue for ERPPCs than regular PPCs because you are less able to use the range because you have to lead by a lot which increases chance to miss.

Example of what I am talking about it 600 to 700 meters or farther.

IS mechs w/ 50% velocity quirk or a Summoner w/TC4 gets you 1950m/s with ERPPCs. That's just a tad under Gauss speed, with no charge time. Not "slow."

And to the other guy, no, PPCs were not fine after the velocity nerf. Slow PPCs are only effective at close range, which is awful because they're too high heat to use as brawling weapons. PPC use almost disappeared and laser vomit became the meta--you think that happened because people suddenly discovered the joys of big laser alphas?

Edited by Kubernetes, 01 June 2016 - 12:34 AM.

[Chuck Jager]

If you want BIG damage PPC == BAd
If you want to kill sh*t quickly and you can max certain builds well PPC == kick a*s