503 replies to this topic

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 07 June 2016 - 06:10 AM, said:

I think what nitra is getting at is that while there are exceptions, much of the bile that the forum warriors exhibit in their posts is not put out there as some perverse desire to express "toxic bilge", but rather to express frustration and a sense of impotent longing for what they feel the game should be and isn't. Often that comes out as "acidity and saltyness" but what it really is: is hope. Hope for change. Hope for the game that they feel they were promised or paid for. Hope for MW5. Hope that someone at PGI would just try to engage with them a bit. Desperate but futile hope.

A well intentioned oil spill is still an oil spill. And most in question are serial offenders, regardless of good intentions.

My point is, if you are pining to recapture lost love, by doing extreme actions, really isn't considered an acceptable approach within any society, except, apparently, gamers.

Edited by Scout Derek, 07 June 2016 - 11:57 AM.

[Wan Chu Minge]

CK16, on 07 June 2016 - 06:34 AM, said:

The ****-er's who think that PGI burning down and MWO going with it as a gpod thing, are ******* morons! Cheering for such a horrible fate and some wanting PGI to lose the license needs to think, if PGI falls hard, there might never be another Mechwarrior game again, Microsoft would just sit on the title and do nothing...or do really really bad by the franchise!.....

I'm not sure who this is aimed at, but the language and bile seem to be coming from you my friend. From what I have read no one is cheering this situation and no one wants to see PGI fail.

I completely agree with you that if PGI collapses we may never see a MW title again, and no one wants that. But PGI need to state the long term strategy for this game before user numbers drop so low, the lights go out.

If anything I want PGI to address this thread and prove my posts wrong, I really really do. I'm sure many of us do.

[LordMelvin]

invernomuto, on 06 June 2016 - 12:04 AM, said:

IMVHO, the concept of having one 4-hours-long town hall a month is unsustainable. What can you discuss each month? New mech? I am no surprised that they were suspended because the questions are always the same. Developing something new for the game require time and money, some thing could not work for a moltitude of reason and could be scrapped at the final stage, so it's better not to speak too much in advance on future contents...

Warframe has a one hour stream every two weeks with the CM and 4-6 team leaders. They talk about recent developments behind the scenes, emerging trends, usually show off one or two new assets or concepts, and give away some free Platinum (their version of MC). The CM also picks a dozen or so questions from the forums and poses them to the dev team. Sometimes they give a handwavey answer but most of the time they have something legitimate to say even if it's "we're looking into it".

PGI has taken a step in the right direction with the art streams but that only shows us what we already know about. Cutting the townhall down to an hour, maybe two tops, and involving people who are actually involved in the day-to-day development of the game would improve the quality of the information given greatly. Maybe the person in charge of the resize team could show off a couple WIP pictures of the old and new Catapult scale or concept art for decals.

I agree that four hours of grilling Russ on LRMs are bad/Clams are OP/IS is OP/Everything is TDM is unproductive and unhelpful, especially since it's the end of the day for them and I'll bet all he wants to do is sit in front of the TV in his boxers with a beer.

[Bishop Steiner]

Wan Chu Minge, on 07 June 2016 - 06:42 AM, said:

I'm not sure who this is aimed at, but the language and bile seem to be coming from you my friend. From what I have read no one is cheering this situation and no one wants to see PGI fail.

I completely agree with you that if PGI collapses we may never see a MW title again, and no one wants that. But PGI need to state the long term strategy for this game before user numbers drop so low, the lights go out.

If anything I want PGI to address this thread and prove my posts wrong, I really really do. I'm sure many of us do.

No, it's past that. PGI have stated their long term goals many times. And either largely failed to deliver, or conveniently moved the goal posts, each time. Their "position at that time".

It's put up or shut up time, for many of us. Yes, communication is still vital, but actions that show you remotely are in tune with reality of your own game , let alone the community, are about all I can see really helping PGI reverse course in time to avoid that iceberg ahead.

And the last town hall, Russ told us he's the captain, he's smarter than all of us, feel free to swim if we disagree. Since then he appears to have slammed the engines full ahead, and locked himself in the bridge.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 07 June 2016 - 07:06 AM.

[invernomuto]

Wan Chu Minge, on 07 June 2016 - 06:35 AM, said:

Again, I'm not bashing the game, but I do think that the continuous Mech releases are rather disingenuous of PGI and people need to recognize that at least from what we know today, the game is pretty much at the end of the development road map.

I agree on opening some dev tools to the community: A map editor woudl be great but even a full level designer, if we have to dream, let's dream big .
While you lose control over the process, this move could provide a lot of interesting contents made by players for free.
In Red Orchestra 2 there are some awesome maps made by other players.
PGI could do "map contest" and, with some final "quality checks and mods", could introduce this map / scenarios into the game.
I understand that a similar decision could have some very big drawbacks, but I think that it could be *very* interesting for the community and could add a lot of longevity to MWO.
However, the upcoming months seem very ambitious for PGI (big rescale and balance pass, Solaris, etc), lets see what they pull out of the hat before declaring the demise of MWO...

[Karl Streiger]

Bishop Steiner, on 07 June 2016 - 06:52 AM, said:

And the last town hall, Russ told us he's the captain, he's smarter than all of us, feel free to swim if we disagree. Since then he appears to have manned the engines full ahead, and locked himself in the bridge.

But he is the captain.... things would be different if we wouldn't be in the position of mere customers.

Just imagine if PGI would have been an incorporated company and every Mech package or MC you buy is like holding stocks.

I admit I don't know how bad or destroyed MWO would have been when more people would have been able to have input on the course. On the other hand it should be neither or everybody. Just to pick some players and ignore the rest isn't a smart move

[Rattazustra]

If PGI wants positive feedback, a pat on the back and a happy player base, perhaps they should just do a better job then.

So far they have proven themselves to be ignorant of the most basic concepts of game balancing and game design.

So far they have shown an incredible disinterest in their player base. They have done little to nothing to address key concerns.

Adding content to a structurally broken game mode like FW with phase 3 was a very bad idea. Trying to hammer out a world championship at a time where almost every facet of the game is at least half broken was even worse.

Russ even thinks that Twitter is the proper way to communicate with his customers, when he has a perfectly good forums to do better. On top of that he has mostly used Twitter to showcase an ignorance of his, so massive that it could sink the Titanic all over again. I have read him on Twitter and I have heard him on the town halls. I must admit that I was shocked more often than I was even remotely impressed. If he wants to sink this game he is on the best possible course and based on the very things that he has said himself it is very much evident that he is to blame for it personally.

[Johnny Z]

The drama is way over the top and starting to get offensive. First time I have said that ever on these forums. Get real.

[Bishop Steiner]

Karl Streiger, on 07 June 2016 - 07:05 AM, said:

But he is the captain.... things would be different if we wouldn't be in the position of mere customers.

Just imagine if PGI would have been an incorporated company and every Mech package or MC you buy is like holding stocks.

I admit I don't know how bad or destroyed MWO would have been when more people would have been able to have input on the course. On the other hand it should be neither or everybody. Just to pick some players and ignore the rest isn't a smart move

The consumer should NEVER steer the ship. But a smart captain listens to the consumers and weighs what they say, and a wiser person gleans good ideas from any source they find.

The issue with gamers is the immature entitlement mentality, where people seem to believe all ideas somehow have equal merit.

You have a mission statement. You sift through the ideas presented and adapt the ones that work with said mission statement.

Problem is, PGI had demonstrated no solid course or plan since Closed Beta, and because their course keeps shifting, too many previous ideas have become dead weights, dragging the entire ship and threatening to scuttle her.

If there is no set, solid and inflexible baseline, you can never have sustainable success.

Edited by Bishop Steiner, 07 June 2016 - 07:24 AM.

[Bishop Steiner]

W E N D I G O, on 07 June 2016 - 07:08 AM, said:

I always knew somebody like you is bound to be insane.




So he didn't respond to your last two tweets? I'm shocked.

Wow what meaningful contributions.. If it's any consolation, I don't know You from Adam, so your opinion of my mental health, really not important to me. Your inability to grasp simple concepts, even less so.

[Johnny Z]

During the 3rd person view fiasco there were some bad comments and maybe drama was high, but there were also comments like "3rd person view is like standing behind someone sitting in my chair eating my salad." There is no fun in this topic at all.

[Bishop Steiner]

Johnny Z, on 07 June 2016 - 07:21 AM, said:

During the 3rd person view fiasco there were some bad comments and maybe drama was high, but there were also comments like "3rd person view is like standing behind someone sitting in my chair eating my salad." There is no fun in this topic at all.

So go elsewhere.. I don't recall advertising this thread as a comedy. Don't like it, you are free to depart, at any time.

I don't like reality tv shows. I solve that issue by not watching them. Novel concept, I know.

[TKSax]

CK16, on 07 June 2016 - 06:34 AM, said:

if PGI falls hard, there might never be another Mechwarrior game again, Microsoft would just sit on the title and do nothing...or do really really bad by the franchise!.....

I think you are almost 100 % wrong there. No matter what you think about PGI you cannot say the MWO has not been a success for them. HBS Battletech kicstarter was also a huge success, I am sure there are plenty of developers/publishers who looking at the numbers from both games and see that Battletech/Mechwarrior games can be successful and would love to develop it. There is a good chance that depending on how much I enjoy HBS's Battletech Game, I may never play MWO again, who knows. I know someone is going to say with the "toxic" community why would they want to make a game. Personally knowing several people in the games industry, I can tell you all they really care about is how much a game can make. Battletech/Mechwarrior games make money , it has been proven twice now, I am sure if/when PGI stops MWO another game will come along much quicker than last time.

CK16 simply pointing what pgi is bad at is not salt, some of is facts. They are bad at communicating and managing expectations. My own belief is they need better management. MWO is a fun Arena Game, it could be much much more, PGI even wanted it to be much more, but then have been unable to deliver.

[CK16]

Wan Chu Minge, on 07 June 2016 - 06:42 AM, said:

I'm not sure who this is aimed at, but the language and bile seem to be coming from you my friend. From what I have read no one is cheering this situation and no one wants to see PGI fail.

I completely agree with you that if PGI collapses we may never see a MW title again, and no one wants that. But PGI need to state the long term strategy for this game before user numbers drop so low, the lights go out.

If anything I want PGI to address this thread and prove my posts wrong, I really really do. I'm sure many of us do.

Maybe, but also it was not direct at just one but the people that are in riot mode and wanting to burn down PGI regardless, Ill informed people who think PGI is this evil being who does not listen. PGI honestly is one of the most open and flexible companies I have ever had to deal with in terms of digital goods. They are very willing to help refund ect and fix user errors usually. Compared to other giants out there in the F2P market, even their dev team is very easy to get to!

Trust me if anyone knows my name from WoT I was on a crusade there for months just trying to get WG to LOOK at a thread, and only through finding friends in the right places outside of WG did I manage to get a wisper through, but found the ears of the right people in Minsk after grueling months of trying to get through and working on my idea. ..

TL:DR I get annoyed and angry with stupid trollish, people who say PGI is not doing good with the game, when in reality they are very good about customer service if you show respect, they are very easy to reach out with ideas for the game if you know where to look to find them...PST they don't hide really at all!

Ranting while at work is not easy....so later!

[Gas Guzzler]

Yeah I don't know what is up with PGI. I wonder if we will even have a mech announcement tomorrow.

[Hydrocarbon]

Scout Derek, on 06 June 2016 - 05:38 PM, said:

Should they have to deal with Toxicity? No.

What is this, 1st grade? Of course they have to deal with an angry player - this is LIFE! Go stand at any retailer's return counter for a day, you'll see that it's not internet anonymity that makes people talk big - the fact they're ANGRY does.

If PGI was one of many companies selling an MWO variant, then yes the anger would be unwarranted. However they're the ONLY company that can work on this IP, of which a large chunk of the player base (particularly their "whales") have an borderline obsessive love for. When they piss in the proverbial punch bowl (so often & so publicly), what would you expect to happen??


BTW the only thing that needs to be said is "Phase 3". If PGI knew what the playerbase wanted, why is FW so dead???

[Metus regem]

Hydrocarbon, on 07 June 2016 - 07:54 AM, said:

BTW the only thing that needs to be said is "Phase 3". If PGI knew what the playerbase wanted, why is FW so dead???

Too many factions, not enough players?

[Bud Crue]

CK16, on 07 June 2016 - 07:45 AM, said:

...when in reality they are very good about customer service if you show respect, they are very easy to reach out with ideas for the game if you know where to look to find them...PST they don't hide really at all!

I agree. PGI has great customer support. But that isn't the issue here.

PGI also has a president who has acted as the public face of the company and the only real person via the town halls with which the community can even pretend to interface with. In the last town hall he essentially told a significant segment of the population to mind their own business, and in the one before that he got drunk.

Being respectful to PGI to get good customer service is not the issue. Having PGI show some respect to its customers and its product is.

I want this game to succeed and I want it to be great. I have too much time and $ invested to want anything else. But I would sure like to know that there is more potential for the future of the game than what we have gotten since P3 dropped; and I am not seeing/hearing ANYTHING from PGI to suggest there is much more than the impressions provided by their public face, and those impressions have not been good.

I don't want to steer Bishop's ship (see his metaphor above) but I would like SOMEBODY to do it.

[Gas Guzzler]

Bud Crue, on 07 June 2016 - 08:00 AM, said:

I don't want to steer Bishop's ship (see his metaphor above) but I would like SOMEBODY to do it.

Captain to the sea men, assume crash positions, we're sure to take on water.

[Bishop Steiner]

Bud Crue, on 07 June 2016 - 08:00 AM, said:

I agree. PGI has great customer support. But that isn't the issue here.

PGI also has a president who has acted as the public face of the company and the only real person via the town halls with which the community can even pretend to interface with. In the last town hall he essentially told a significant segment of the population to mind their own business, and in the one before that he got drunk.

Being respectful to PGI to get good customer service is not the issue. Having PGI show some respect to its customers and its product is.

I want this game to succeed and I want it to be great. I have too much time and $ invested to want anything else. But I would sure like to know that there is more potential for the future of the game than what we have gotten since P3 dropped; and I am not seeing/hearing ANYTHING from PGI to suggest there is much more than the impressions provided by their public face, and those impressions have not been good.

I don't want to steer Bishop's ship (see his metaphor above) but I would like SOMEBODY to do it.

Ain't my ship. Don't be blaming me for this mess, no sir, lol.

We're it my ship, we'd have a distinctly different set of problems and reasons to nerd rage.