578 replies to this topic

[S Phoenix]

I can't play this game anymore...minimap is killing me, not the enemy....Can't tell left from right.

Drop into a game and the map is upside down!

Why is there such an obsession for turning MWO into WoT? Doesn't anyone at PGI realize that WoT has no possibility of any depth compared to Battletech?

This game could be an entirely immersive experience if people had some actual vision of what it could be.

Sorry for bad comments, but this is just poor use of those in the community who fund this game.

[Duncan1dah0]

I'm cool with direction and moving forward, but a blatant breaking of the game mechanics for a feature coming at some future date is just dumb. Put in the change when you have something to use it. Until then let us play a game the way you have taught us to play. Change before the change has any meaning is worthless and will just result in a bunch of upset customers.

I want info warfare to have value. I love light mechs and I want them to bring it on with real scouting, but this is not it. We need to have those mechanics in the system before we can make these types of changes.

[Tiantara]

- Read the news... Sounds really great! Waiting for hot-fix!

[Icebergdx]

Alexander Garden, on 21 June 2016 - 07:07 PM, said:

Hey everyone,

The news system is currently having an issue with comment activation, but we've put up a front page post regarding the changes to the Mini Map, and where we go from here. Head over to the news post when you have a moment and check it out. I'll try to get comments activated for the post as soon as we can resolve the issue with the news editor.

Alexander,

Thank you for this update. And thank you for trying to mend the fences that Russ decided to kick down like an Altas coming through the back yard.

However, I would STRONGLY suggest that Russ go back through, listen to how he came across in the Town Hall about this whole thing (ESPECIALLY the statement about no hotfix day 2, stay with it for a month.) Frankly, he has broken any faith he may have had with the player base right now. If you listen to that speil and explanation he gave, it is basically talking down to us, and we are the people that are funding this game. Time mark 43:00 to 43:16 just about tears it, and then he repeats it later. Russ needs to come on here and make a mea culpa, he should not just be sticking you with the dirty work on this one. HE made that call about the minimap mods, he needs to come forward and take the bite out of the $h!+ sandwich he made.

I know that you, as a Customer Support Lead, are the boss of handling us, but there are times where they guy above you needs to take some of his own well deserved heat, instead of pawning his screw up on you guys. I am sure today was probably hell in the CS area, with people cancelling pre-buys, etc. I almost called today, but I figured I would see if our anger over this issue was going to get some action.

[Tiantara]

Icebergdx, on 21 June 2016 - 07:28 PM, said:

Time mark 43:00 to 43:16 just about tears it, and then he repeats it later.

- He also say here twice that he open to rollback changes if it needed. And if that really needed. Not all, but most vital parts. And that already nice. With new fix coming - i thing everything could be alright. With old cone of view and directions + new cool icons of mech weight without arrows (for making game more tactical and thoughtful). If after fix vital mechanic works well - it's already good. Isn't it?

[ZeProme]

[Duncan1dah0]

Tiantara, on 21 June 2016 - 07:37 PM, said:

- He also say here twice that he open to rollback changes if it needed. And if that really needed. Not all, but most vital parts. And that already nice. With new fix coming - i thing everything could be alright. With old cone of view and directions + new cool icons of mech weight without arrows (for making game more tactical and thoughtful). If after fix vital mechanic works well - it's already good. Isn't it?

But why did they not include those features with the original patch? Did they think it really was ready for prime time?

[Wintersdark]

CHERNO BERSERKER, on 21 June 2016 - 07:41 PM, said:

Sorry, that fix will not work you are doubling the size of the mini-map and the result is a downgrade in detail and scale. Which is our number complaint. We play your game because we like it if we wanted World of Tanks we wouldn't play this game and give you our money. We need the scale of the old mini-map back in order play!

If you are unwilling to fix your mistake. I want a refund for the mechs I purchased!

Doubling? Going from 1600m² to 2000m² is not doubling.

[Tiantara]

CHERNO BERSERKER, on 21 June 2016 - 07:41 PM, said:

Sorry, that fix will not work you are doubling the size of the mini-map and the result is a downgrade in detail and scale.

- Just give them a chance! From screenshots it looks much better than current map. At least you still have map detail (now it more sharp, more detailed and gray... with great visible quadrant marks). And back cone of view and mech movement direction arrow. Just lets see that. I understand frustration after patch, but give a chance to hot-fix! And zoom not so big at all. Just enormous triangle became a little smaller.

[Icebergdx]

Tiantara, on 21 June 2016 - 07:37 PM, said:

- He also say here twice that he open to rollback changes if it needed. And if that really needed. Not all, but most vital parts. And that already nice. With new fix coming - i thing everything could be alright. With old cone of view and directions + new cool icons of mech weight without arrows (for making game more tactical and thoughtful). If after fix vital mechanic works well - it's already good. Isn't it?

But he is very resistant to the idea of a full rollback, especially the first time he mentions it. And later on he says essentially that there would be no full rollback of the feature.

[Tiantara]

Icebergdx, on 21 June 2016 - 07:52 PM, said:

But he is very resistant to the idea of a full rollback, especially the first time he mentions it. And later on he says essentially that there would be no full rollback of the feature.

- Endeed... full rollback impossible with that massive changes. It's logical. But some changes back with vital mechanics parts - possible or partial possible. Take that not like "Take what we give" - but "We make that and think its cool, if you don't like that or something go wrong - we invent some other tools more compliant with our plan but with functions which you need". Fullrollback can be impossible by many reasons. Code, graphic, UI design, some unified measurement moments, fixed commands and function, part of which must work properly in future and partially be used now. Yeap - cutting off vital information about close combat and positioning of mech and mech torso was a mistake. But they not bring back old. They modify new to be comfort for play. Not all - but most vital for game. Its good in that way. Developers hear us, and our community can give proper information or good advices in right time. Not only "rage quit".

[Icebergdx]

I just gotta wonder how many thousands of dollars they lost today. I know of a couple of people who got on the phone, email and demanded refunds for pre-purchases today. I myself decided against buying the newest mech pack and the new Hero until and unless they fix this kludge. And if they do not, I may request refunds as well.

[CHERNO BERSERKER]

OMG my bad! They increased the mini-map from 2.5 grids to 4 grids sorry so. Still is too large everyone as been talking about they want old mini-map back or the at least the same scale and mechanics.

[Tiantara]

- After 3rd time listening Town Hall I understand one detail why full map in mini works wrong with command wheel. It was cool idea, but simply not for that game. It's nearly impossible to help any mech which get in trouble in range more than 900m. You can help Assault to take down light if he stay in 300-600m distance. By using proper weapon you can put down or heavy damage light mech. You can support light with LRM in battle with two heavy on range up to 850m max. After 900m you can't help. If you run there - you possible ends killed by sniper, LRM "rain" or some fast "wolf pack - 4 x light mech". Even if not - when you came close enough - your teammate lost weapons, side torso or get killed already. That info works great between 3 lances on range not more 600m. Or everyone starts run as whole group only be afraid to step aside of 1000m safety ring. So - call for help in quadrant far than 1000m would be ignored fully by whole team if no one walk closer. And that true. All maps with open places make that help impossible. But in same time pretty useful strikes command and visual contact (because it was hard to call right quadrant by memory and use range data on target)... And that should work nice in hot-fixed map.

Edited by Tiantara, 21 June 2016 - 08:34 PM.

[Apollo 42]

One must take the good with the bad, try the mechs out see how they play. I normally pilot any weight class mech short of an assault, for me speed and agility are important. Everyone is different. Some good is that lights like the kitfox are no longer so large compared to other lights, which makes for a fairer fight for lights vs lights, and lights vs mediums, heavy and assault mechs. try this as a thought experiment, put yourselves in the seat of a slower mech attempting to defend against a light, now speed is a lights armor, but now when a light takes a heavy or assault down its more about a skilled pilot, rather than a mechs scale or lag shield to a lesser degree. I welcome the change as its a step towards improving the game, nothing will ever be perfect, but so long as people talk to one another in a civil manner, real work can be done with improving the game. BTW most of the time I play lights, I welcome a better challenge, and before you say I am a locust pilot, I am not, I do not own any, in fact most of the mechs that I do own are resized and the locust is a tiny mech that is best dealt with as a team. I ask players of the game to try those resized mechs out for a few days first, and remember that during an event player behavior will be different than the norm, and if after a few days of testing they are no longer viable, then seek out the devs and talk with them, but please remember they are people that work for a company, do not take it out on them, not everyone in a company is responsible for everything, so much better if one converses with them in a polite manner with calm facts and evidence to support ones own personal findings, instead of a witch hunt. This game offers unrivaled access to the development of this great game, lets help them to keep making it better, and try to remember nothing will be fixed overnight, it will take time, and if we as the community work with them, instead of pointing fingers and yelling, the smaller issues can be resolved one by one. I would talk about the mini-map, but the fix they have offered covers my concerns, but I wish they would roll back the min-map update part till they got it fixed, then we could have a fairer assessment of the resizing of mechs, as well as how the new mechs preform against other mechs, its like an ecosystem, certain mechs are better than others in regards to loadouts and roles, but the new mini-map makes it hard to gauge the real performance as they well are crippled too, and a fair fight is not possible. the best way to sum of the new min-map is information overload, it was to much to soon, esp with the lack of a map rotating with the mech, but that issue will be corrected soon.

Edited by Apollo 42, 21 June 2016 - 08:41 PM.

[Tiantara]

Icebergdx, on 21 June 2016 - 08:13 PM, said:

I just gotta wonder how many thousands of dollars they lost today. I know of a couple of people who got on the phone, email and demanded refunds for pre-purchases today. I myself decided against buying the newest mech pack and the new Hero until and unless they fix this kludge. And if they do not, I may request refunds as well.

- Hope everything would be alright. Mistakes happens. They can be fixed. Give game a chance. With all that new per-tonnage-scale system (now you can see what mech what tonnage have), Command wheel, better drawn map and so-on. I play in that game from the start (not founder, but still) and I still believe in developers team. Just lets see how fix would playable.

CHERNO BERSERKER, on 21 June 2016 - 08:16 PM, said:

OMG my bad! They increased the mini-map from 2.5 grids to 4 grids sorry so. Still is too large everyone as been talking about they want old mini-map back or the at least the same scale and mechanics.

- Proportion a bit bigger. But with that - map become more sharp and not so blurry like old one. I played FW, Quick time and even Scouting. With old cone ow view and directional arrow - all be cool. Just give them a chance. It gonna be better than what we have now anyway.

[Murcheson]

I usually go with the flow - figuring the PGI has a tough enough time trying to roll out new stuff.

BUT this new mini-map is horrible. The fixed orientation makes the map useless in battle - it was more functional oriented to the mech. Also the new scaling is horrendous - there is not enough local detail.

There is wisdom in the old adage - if it ain't broke, don't fix it.

[Dee Eight]

So they refunded money to a few babies who couldn't wait for PGI to respond... honestly the place could do without rage quitters. Overwatch dropped the ban-hammer on their rage quitter problem quite nicely a couple weeks ago.

[Darth Futuza]

Dee Eight, on 21 June 2016 - 09:29 PM, said:

So they refunded money to a few babies who couldn't wait for PGI to respond... honestly the place could do without rage quitters. Overwatch dropped the ban-hammer on their rage quitter problem quite nicely a couple weeks ago.

Agreed, a terrible minimap is no reason to ragequit the game, it'll be fixed in a few weeks, until then everyone else is just as handicapped as anyone else.

EDIT: It seems it will be even sooner: https://mwomercs.com...ng-new-mini-map

Edited by Darth Futuza, 21 June 2016 - 10:18 PM.

[Dee Eight]

Hell it'll be hotfixed this week, they've already said that. And when the rage-quitters re-install I hope PGI doesn't let them get back into the pre-order early adopter rewards.