521 replies to this topic

[Revis Volek]

Deathlike, on 11 August 2016 - 07:38 PM, said:

That's not quite what I meant.

The "value" of MC hasn't changed in the sense that Mechbays cost more or less... but more in the sense that what you can do with it compared to the mechpack deals. That has probably gotten to a critical mass due in part of the Kodiak (CXL400 for starters) how PGI has been structuring their mechpacks. By comparison, something like the Viper or Phoenix Hawk for the same pricing isn't as enticing with the same amount of real cash. This is before we talk about "value" when it comes to mech costs in terms of MC.

Ahh yes, now i understand.

PGI does have an economy then! It just a Black Market we cant deal with and only they have the ability to ruin, which they are doing no problem.

dario03, on 11 August 2016 - 07:40 PM, said:

A lot of that sounds like stuff that is hurting lights.


Yeah so all that speed doesn't actually matter a lot of times.


Yeah so again hurting lights not helping. And how are they trolling???


Again, how are lights trolling? How is shooting a mech in the rear trolling? Is it just lights that aren't allowed to back shot or all mechs? Do you never back shot mechs?

What buffs? They just increased the size of a lot of lights and one of the few that got a little bit smaller lost half its quirks where as most that got a lot bigger didn't get any quirks added. Also the ACH just got nerfed...for the third or forth time. And have you checked the quirks on the mechs? Do I need to post the Firestarter vs Grasshopper quirks again? I'll give you a hint...The Grasshopper has much more and they are much better.

So again... How are lights trolling?



Heck I would say it sounds like he is the one trolling.

He means by shooting mech bigger then you, your are trolling him by trying to win the game in which PGI has made for us. And that is to shoot mechs to teh dirt faster then they can shoot you into it.


So we are all trolls, i think he wants us to hold hands and Amish sweep the battlefield for lights in Atlas and Maulers.


Lets pitch this as the Potatoes Game mode to Russ maybe? Doubt he will accept but maybe if we just whisper it into his ears at night hoping he wakes up on Monday morning thinking it was "his IDEA" all along?

[Drunken Skull]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 06:07 PM, said:

Face it, the problem is a lot bigger than one light mech being better than all other light mechs. The problem is in the way light mechs are used.

PGI have stuffed lights in a small swimming pool with all other weight classes and instructed everyone that" to use a light mech; you sneak behind ppl and troll the F**k out of them, then run round like a chook with it's head cut of so fast they cant aim at you, trolling the f**k out of them even further".

This game would retain a lot more new players if this "trolololol git gud" light mech mentality ceased.

As for the hotshot light pilot aces here who are all saying "nothing wrong with my mech, has to be everyone else being terribad and can't aim" and "can't help bad's".... Sometimes, when it's "Everybody Else", it's not actually them that is the problem, it's you...

No wonder this game can't retain new players, and is losing old ones day by day, the light mech trolling needs to be fixed. Nerf it into the f**king ground!

SMH

Make a choice, you want to keep running light mechs this way and trolling new and old players alike into rage-quitting eventually sealing your'e own fate(nobody is going to want to play this game against you, and eventually you will be the only ones left playing).

Or do you want to give up your crutches and allow new players and old alike to have a good time, hence retaining new players who try the game, and older players who might not be as good as you at twitch FPS gameplay?

More than once a light mech has made me walk away from MWO for a good deal of weeks or months. I like Btech so eventually I always come back, but Russ needs to think about this good and hard; How many new players will come back after a light mech has trolled them into switching off their computer?

It doesn't matter what Tier you are in, fact is that player numbers are so low now that you are dropped with ALL other Tiers, this includes the NEW PLAYERS. think about what you are doing to the game and the community.

You asked how it is trolling. If the above doesn't make it clear, and the video of the ACH PWNING a whole team didn't make it clear, then I doubt anything anyone can say will.

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 08:16 PM.

[Dino Might]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 07:30 PM, said:

Face it, light's are wrecking player retention big time, and "git gud" isn't the answer. Make all the excuses you want, but it wont change the status quo, which is people quitting because of foul play. PGI have nobody to blame for this but themselves for the following reasons;

1. Maps too Small for Speed boats.

2. No game modes for speed boats, meaning they're only goal is to troll larger mechs that are slower than them.

3. Promoting a troll mentality as "the way of the light mech pilot", with game tips instructing exactly how to troll the enemy if using a light mech during the beginning of a match.

4. Attempting to buff light mechs so that they can perform in a trollish manner against superior mechs successfully.

You know in your heart what you're doing is wrong, rely on PGI's Trolltactics rebuttal "I'm just playing the game", cause yes you are, your'e doing it just like PGI told you to....

Well, personally I don't like all the heavies and assaults trolling everyone by playing to their strengths. I mean, seriously, only trolls put weapons on their mechs and use them to kill mechs of other classes.

Just because you get beaten by a smaller mech you think it's trolling? Really, what is your definition of that word? And why are you playing a multiplayer game if you can't handle losing to someone who is better than you?

Also, post up your light stats to show us how easy they are to play, because they are...according to you...

[Drunken Skull]

Drunken Skull, on 10 August 2016 - 11:12 PM, said:

It's only a valid tactic against someone who is either clueless or already strung out so badly that they can't counter it. Regardless it isn't EXACTLY what they're meant to do, most of them are equipped to deal with anything from infantry to other light mechs. Using them like this is a one-trick pony that's extremely skittish and hard to ride(I don't use lights as it is because I cant be a$$ed with the effort, too much of a chore to be fun). It's also just completely demoralizing to the victim to boot, and my aim in playing is not to ruin the other persons day. TBH I find the use of light mechs in this way to be completely trollish and I won't play an active role in it.

I'm not talking about Hairbraine's new turn-based Btech here, and I think you might be on the wrong forum if you want to continue that line of discussion.

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 08:00 PM.

[Y E O N N E]

InspectorG, on 11 August 2016 - 07:20 PM, said:

Real Locust pilots are into the 'S' and 'M'....

Can confirm, true story.

[dario03]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 07:47 PM, said:

You asked how it is trolling. If the above doesn't make it clear, and the video of the ACH PWNING a whole team didn't make it clear, then I doubt anything anyone can say will.

Well yeah...its not trolling so of course you can't make it clear.
Also that post doesn't explain anything. It basically just says
lights
troll
troll
trollolololo
rage
players quit
crutches
nerf lights

No real explanation.

Edited by dario03, 11 August 2016 - 08:06 PM.

[Deathlike]

Yeonne Greene, on 11 August 2016 - 07:59 PM, said:

Can confirm, true story.

You scare me bro.

I have to wonder what you'd do with a Pretty Baby.

[Y E O N N E]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 07:47 PM, said:

You asked how it is trolling. If the above doesn't make it clear, and the video of the ACH PWNING a whole team didn't make it clear, then I doubt anything anyone can say will.

I've seen Assaults pwn whole teams more often than Lights. Assaults must be trolling, nerf Assaults.

Deathlike, on 11 August 2016 - 08:00 PM, said:

You scare me bro.

I have to wonder what you'd do with a Pretty Baby.

Edited by Yeonne Greene, 11 August 2016 - 08:01 PM.

[Drunken Skull]

Moldur, on 10 August 2016 - 11:36 PM, said:

This is not a direct counter to what you say, but I would like to posit a thought of mine: Lights are not piloted as much because MWO lacks the situational variety to make use of what lights have to offer. Speed boats are great, but they are not of much use in a swimming pool. The problem here lies far beyond the faults of the speed boat or light mechs.

All the weight classes and all the chassis are currently bottlenecked into being balanced around a 12v12 deathmatch. Some mechs are better than others in this specific scenario. Thus, they are the best mechs in the game, because the only thing that exists so far in MWO is the previously stated scenario.





What is sad, downright sad, is that it is hard to even imagine that MWO could ever be anything more than what it is now. We all argue and discuss at length the best way to play in the kitty pool while barely being able to imagine the ocean.

^ THIS.

Without PROPER utilization of the classes for their original intended role, in appropriate game modes that play to their specific strengths and weaknesses, we may as well just pick the one or two top performers from each class and remove all other mechs from the game(the way it is at the moment, that's essentially what's happening now anyway, as it is reflected in the choices people make in what mech and loadout they drop with).

This problem is greater than just light mechs, it is why hardpoint-starved mechs can't compete, it's why we have stupid things like ghost heat, heat sink nerfs, and quirks(de-nurfs). All we have right now is a Solaris arena shooter, and all the game modes we have so far are just different flavors of Solaris arena shooters, even CW.

For us to get anywhere from here, we are going to have to do a total re-think of the game. We got to stop alienating and trolling new or handicapped players, we need to have game content that can cater to things other than direct PVP confrontation. EG crafting, murching, PVE, exploration, etc...

We need more game content than a mechlab, some cardboard cut-outs of a drop ship, and some 12x12 arena shooter maps.

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 08:44 PM.

[Deathlike]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 08:05 PM, said:

^ THIS.

It doesn't really excuse the poor existence of the Spider-5V. Try to build something decent out of that and not be considered trolling the team.

If the potential loadout (and pilot) isn't good enough to even hold its own weight nominally, you're considered a "waste of a slot". That's how this game rolls unfortunately.


Adventures in trolling the event (identities not hidden due to laziness, but this is PUG Life™):
http://imgur.com/a/AoXo8

Doing work isn't easy in a Light. The hard part is when someone is actually competent. You simply cannot engage them on their terms. Even then, the average player isn't very capable. Despite giving them to the tools to "get even" (more like be totally lazy/skill-less with Streaks), many players simply don't practice shooting Lights (with non-Streak weapons). They get overwhelmed (in random matches with Light swarms) and then declare them OP. That's where all the nonsense truly comes from.

[Y E O N N E]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 08:05 PM, said:

We need more game content than a mechlab, some semi-useful drop ships and some 12x12 arena shooter maps.

Sure, but we don't have that and until we do, I'd rather every class be equally combat-effective in their own ways. Right now, Lights are way too easy to kill. None of them provoke any feelings of dread on sighting, but I can name at least two chassis from the rest of the classes that do.

[Drunken Skull]

Yeonne Greene, on 11 August 2016 - 08:42 PM, said:

Sure, but we don't have that and until we do, I'd rather every class be equally combat-effective in their own ways. Right now, Lights are way too easy to kill. None of them provoke any feelings of dread on sighting, but I can name at least two chassis from the rest of the classes that do.

Light mechs aren't supposed to strike fear into the hearts of anything larger than they are, theyr'e "Light", they ARE called that for a reason. They are small, don't weigh very much, hence don't carry very much armor and don't have space for very much weaponry.

It really sounds like you would like this to be "Call of Duty, Mechs" Where a Light mech is equal to an Assault mech, just as a sniper is equal to an engineer or medic in a Battlefield game. This isn't suppose to be how Battletech or Mechwarrior is, and I hope it's clear as to why; 1 weighs 20 tons 1 weighs 100 tones, do the math... one's the equivalent of a jeep or quad bike and the other is the equivalent of an M1 or T90 tank. So you would like to have the Jeep be as tanky as the M1 or T90?

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 09:19 PM.

[dario03]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 09:16 PM, said:

Light mechs aren't supposed to strike fear into the hearts of anything larger than they are, theyr'e "Light", they ARE called that for a reason. They are small, don't weigh very much, hence don't carry very much armor and don't have space for very much weaponry.

It really sounds like you would like this to be "Call of Duty, Mechs" Where a Light mech is equal to an Assault mech, just as a sniper is equal to an engineer or medic in a Battlefield game. This isn't suppose to be how Battletech or Mechwarrior is, and I hope it's clear as to why; 1 weighs 20 tons 1 weighs 100 tones, do the math... one's the equivalent of a jeep or quad bike and the other is the equivalent of an M1 or T90 tank. So you would like to have the Jeep be as tanky as the M1 or T90?

This isn't TT
And very early on we were told that all mechs would be useful so that you would want to take any mech, not just take it because you had to.

[Sigilum Sanctum]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 09:16 PM, said:

just as a sniper is equal to an engineer or medic in a Battlefield game.

I'm going to pull this funny statement out because its fundamentally wrong. If you honestly believe that, I don't think you have any honest clue about Battlefield, let alone this game.

MWO =/= Battltech Table Top

Your mentality for light mechs is unhealthy for this game and it's balance. You're allowed to have your beliefs, that is your right. You however do not have the right to try and dictate this games balance on what YOU believe should be right. That is not reality.

Edited by Sigilum Sanctum, 11 August 2016 - 09:54 PM.

[Revis Volek]

Deathlike, on 11 August 2016 - 08:34 PM, said:

It doesn't really excuse the poor existence of the Spider-5V. Try to build something decent out of that and not be considered trolling the team.

If the potential loadout (and pilot) isn't good enough to even hold its own weight nominally, you're considered a "waste of a slot". That's how this game rolls unfortunately.


Adventures in trolling the event (identities not hidden due to laziness, but this is PUG Life™):
http://imgur.com/a/AoXo8

Doing work isn't easy in a Light. The hard part is when someone is actually competent. You simply cannot engage them on their terms. Even then, the average player isn't very capable. Despite giving them to the tools to "get even" (more like be totally lazy/skill-less with Streaks), many players simply don't practice shooting Lights (with non-Streak weapons). They get overwhelmed (in random matches with Light swarms) and then declare them OP. That's where all the nonsense truly comes from.

SO you are saying the existence of Streak (on the clan side only) is the reason Clan lights (really the ACH) are deemed OP?

I think you might be onto something sir....

[Drunken Skull]

I don't think you realize how close things are to the brink for this game, as is it's a MVP Arena shooter that reaks of claustrophobia and stale gameplay, and I fear that as soon as someone(looking at hairbrained here) makes something with even remotely more game content than a mechlab and some 12x12 arena test maps, then that will be it(will be like Kerensky's exodus, just look at the forum, people are already lining up and buying their shuttle tickets).

PGI told the community a lot of things very early on, are you really sure you want to re-open that particular can of worms?

I never said this was TT, not quite sure what tree your'e barking up at there.


As for your balance, 20 tonnes on one side of the scale and 100 tonnes on the other, hmm wonder what the scales will say? Reality is hard to grasp I understand, but numbers as clear as those don't lie.

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 10:26 PM.

[dario03]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 09:59 PM, said:

I don't think you realize how close things are to the brink for this game, as is it's a MVP Arena shooter that reaks of claustrophobia and stale gameplay, and I fear that as soon as someone(looking at hairbrained here) makes something with even remotely more game content than a mechlab and some 12x12 arena test maps, then that will be it(will be like Kerensky's exodus).

I never said this was TT, not quite sure what tree your'e barking up at there.

As for your balance, 20 tonnes on one side of the scale and 100 tonnes on the other, hmm wonder what the scales will say? Reality is hard to grasp I understand, but numbers as clear as those don't lie.

This isn't reality.
Understand that, and then you can figure out game balance.

[Mcgral18]

Drunken Skull, on 11 August 2016 - 09:59 PM, said:

I don't think you realize how close things are to the brink for this game,

Which has nothing to do with making Lights viable robots, and more with repeated disappointments.


You're a very special unicorn when it comes to your opinion, and I daresay wrong.
You refuse to see reason, however.


The 20 ton robot takes the same slot as a 100 ton robot. You cannot take 5 for 1. You need to take 1 for 1. And 1 for 1, currently, the Assault wins almost every time, assuming the pilot isn't a Potato...which you seem to be, I'm afraid.

[jjm1]

GrimRiver, on 11 August 2016 - 12:29 PM, said:

When the ACHeater first came out I made a post about how broken and borked the hitreg and hitboxes were on it and people said I was full of BS and that I need to "git gud"

But I posted video showing half enemy team trying to take down a lone ACH running around in the middle at 69%, overheats while getting blasted but still lives on to fight a bit more.


And yet people were still in denial about.

Then later Russ confirmed that the ACH hitboxes were indeed borked.

But now it goes down like any other light.

I still haven't got a "I'm sorry you were right" lol

Wow, I forgot just how bad It used to be. So many flashbacks of ACHs making a come back for their team in 1v4+ scenarios. I haven't seen that in a while.

[Drunken Skull]

Mcgral18, on 11 August 2016 - 10:14 PM, said:

Which has nothing to do with making Lights viable robots, and more with repeated disappointments.


You're a very special unicorn when it comes to your opinion, and I daresay wrong.
You refuse to see reason, however.


The 20 ton robot takes the same slot as a 100 ton robot. You cannot take 5 for 1. You need to take 1 for 1. And 1 for 1, currently, the Assault wins almost every time, assuming the pilot isn't a Potato...which you seem to be, I'm afraid.

Resorting to personal insults is surely the last resort of a desperate person. So I am a "very special unicorn" and also a "potato" now am I? Clearly a desperate ploy to derail the conversation, defamation is also evident.

Do you really think the only problem this game has, is that a 20 tonne mech can't throw as much pain out as a 100 tonne mech? PGI dealt with this(poorly) by balancing the teams FYI, there are an EVEN number of mechs of DIFFERENT weight classes placed on EACH side in a match(essentially each lance has a maximum drop weight, Charlie Lance being for Assaults/Heavies, Bravo Lance being for Heavies/Mediums, and Alpha Lance being for Mediums/Lights).

That would be great... If the map were the size of a Continent, or at the very least, a State. However the maps are the size of a swimming pool, and you now have Alpha Lance (light mechs) racing round the pool to the other side to get up the jacksies(backsides) of the opposing team's Charlie Lance (Assault Mechs). Let the trolling Light mech fun begin... Where not only are you speed tanking, for the extra kick of it, your'e also picking on the mechs with the slowest speed and aim(torso twist and asimuth movements) in the game.

Even that advantage alone isn't enough, you are now saying you want a Locust to be able to 1 vs 1 an Atlas, and there be a 50/50 chance on the outcome, face to face... why?... who'd want to play that, other than a locust pilot?

Edited by Drunken Skull, 11 August 2016 - 11:36 PM.