172 replies to this topic

[Metus regem]

Navid A1, on 17 August 2016 - 01:33 AM, said:

I believe that the clunky franken-build of the cryengine PGI is using right now is one of the biggest development obstacles atm.
Will PGI upgrade the engine?
Highly unlikely based on the future plans

Maybe we can find Russ in Mechcon and ask him in person... I have some more questions too.
Also, I'm hoping I can find paul and ask some questions.

I have many questions for them as well, but I have a feeling getting answers for them might require shock collars and water boarding....

[Peter2k]

Imperius, on 17 August 2016 - 01:19 AM, said:

Adds tons of the features the community has been asking for!

Replay function for Solairis
Vulcan and DX 12 support
VR
Performance and Optimizations
Pre-built AI
Spectator mode for tournaments and Solairs



https://www.unrealen...unreal-engine-4

I know why you still bother

But realistically speaking it's not something they can deliver any more
Under DX12 the developer has to do all the heavy lifting
Like SLI support, async compute to name a few

That's why it's faster as well
It's closer to the silicon; less abstraction
It's what we have with consoles

The first titles looking worse than a few years down the line when developers have figured out the in and out

Just look how long it took and how some had to beg for PGI to normalise the mech textures
And how easy it must be to release a 4k texture add on If the art department is actually working in real high resolution and scales it down for ingame


Edit:
If anyone is too new around
Not all mechs used the same resolution of textures, some camos where a washed-out mess

PLEA TO NORMALIZE MECH TEXTURES. (VICTORY ACHIEVED)

Edited by Peter2k, 17 August 2016 - 05:15 AM.

[BLOOD WOLF]

It would be unacceptable in an online game that can evolve, that the game is engine is not consistent with more modern engines.

[MeiSooHaityu]

Peter2k, on 17 August 2016 - 04:57 AM, said:

Not saying it's good, since it's not in the case of MWO
Can't see them not taking as long as years just to work out the bugs they would introduce

Just food for thought...

Even if IF the core engine needed very little tweaking or bug fixing for MWO, there would need to be a new front end designed and programmed for the game. Do you remember how long it took U.I. 2.0 to be developed, implemented, and then the bug fixing and tweaking after? It took a long LONG time, and that is just one part of the game.

That's not even looking at the strong assumption of the programmers having knowledge and experience with Cryengine and less or no experience with Unreal which would also slow development way down.

I'm pretty sure they don't have the time or resources to reinvent the wheel.

[Khobai]

they should just start over and make mechwarrior online 2 in unreal engine lol

this game has basically gone as far as it can on cryengine


star citizen is gonna have major problems in its development because of cryengine limitations too they wont be able to deliver on half their promises. star citizen was really dumb and shouldve just developed their own proprietary engine with how much money they had to work with. Yes it wouldve taken longer but the game wouldnt be limited by how crappy cryengine is.


cryengine might have been good at one time but it definitely hasnt kept up with other engines in development.

Edited by Khobai, 17 August 2016 - 07:06 AM.

[Deathlike]

MeiSooHaityu, on 17 August 2016 - 07:01 AM, said:

I'm pretty sure they don't have the time or resources to reinvent the wheel.

I dunno... PGI keeps trying to reinvent the wheel though...

[Tordin]

Navid A1, on 17 August 2016 - 01:33 AM, said:

I believe that the clunky franken-build of the cryengine PGI is using right now is one of the biggest development obstacles atm.
Will PGI upgrade the engine?
Highly unlikely based on the future plans

Maybe we can find Russ in Mechcon and ask him in person... I have some more questions too.
Also, I'm hoping I can find paul and ask some questions.

Hunt em down and shoot questions at them

[MeiSooHaityu]

Khobai, on 17 August 2016 - 07:01 AM, said:

star citizen is gonna have major problems in its development because of cryengine limitations too they wont be able to deliver on half their promises. star citizen was really dumb and shouldve just developed their own proprietary engine with how much money they had to work with. Yes it wouldve taken longer but the game wouldnt be limited by how crappy cryengine is.

I think Star Citizen's problems stem more from Chris Roberts hubris and less from the game engine. That's my feeling on that anyway.

[AztecD]

If we cant switch engines because its to expensive, hire some serious programing talent for the current engine we are on, i mean it would be the cheaper option

[GrimRiver]

Russ even said it'll take no more time putting the game on a whole new engine then it would upgrading to next Cryengine.

And alot of from what I heard Unrealengine is super easy to work with and why alot of indie games use it.

From what I've seen unreal tends to be more stable then cryengine too.

[Mawai]

The video makes the engine look great.

However, there are two key features that MWO requires. It needs good netcode and it requires server authoritative support. Hit detection and other functions have to be server side to prevent cheating. It is irrelevant in single player games but it is crucial in an online multiplayer game like MWO (it is either that or a constant high level war against hackers trying to subvert the client).

The video didn't actually address those features ... mostly just nice pictures and ease of use for development.

[Imperius]

Mawai, on 17 August 2016 - 08:49 AM, said:

The video makes the engine look great.

However, there are two key features that MWO requires. It needs good netcode and it requires server authoritative support. Hit detection and other functions have to be server side to prevent cheating. It is irrelevant in single player games but it is crucial in an online multiplayer game like MWO (it is either that or a constant high level war against hackers trying to subvert the client).

The video didn't actually address those features ... mostly just nice pictures and ease of use for development.

Unreal Engine 4 has built in server net code and spectator modes. See paragon

[Khobai]

Quote

I think Star Citizen's problems stem more from Chris Roberts hubris and less from the game engine. That's my feeling on that anyway.

his hubris is part of it sure. but cryengine cant do half of what he wants anyway

[Johnny Z]

MeiSooHaityu, on 17 August 2016 - 07:24 AM, said:

I think Star Citizen's problems stem more from Chris Roberts hubris and less from the game engine. That's my feeling on that anyway.

It may turn out amazing. Imagine Star Wars Mos Eisley Star Port but in that game? Could be amazing anyway.

That's going to be a largely single player game though. While MechWarrior will be team/faction based largely.

Edited by Johnny Z, 17 August 2016 - 09:36 AM.

[xe N on]

This are tech demos of the cryengine MWO currently using.






MWO only uses a fraction of it's power. And is not well optimized.

Edited by xe N on, 17 August 2016 - 09:42 AM.

[Cy Mitchell]

Imperius, on 17 August 2016 - 01:54 AM, said:

Russ said and upgrade will be as much work as switching engines and it was possible but it was resting on one thing that he never elaborated on. The benefits is we get a solid engine. Not our current state of the engine that is limiting development at this point.

MWO should have stayed what it was supposed to be. A CryEngine mod with BATTLETECH theme. The moment they stopped excepting updates from CryTECH and started programming their own code we went down a dark path.

Yes, he did say any chance of upgrading the engine rested on on thing. He did not elaborate on that but I strongly suspect that it is the negotiations with Microsoft over the continued use of the MechWarrior license. I do not know what length of time the original agreement was for but I doubt that it was for more than 5 or 6 years. That would mean it is due to expire and must be extended or renegotiated. Without that they will have to stop development and there will be no need for a new engine. If Microsoft wants more money then it may no longer be economically feasible to renew the license based on the games declining game population and decreased revenue intake. Spending the money for a engine upgrade would be out of the question.

Of course, this is just me speculating about what Russ' comments might have meant but that was the first thing that crossed my mind when he made that comment during the town hall and it does make sense.

[TKSax]

Rampage, on 17 August 2016 - 09:54 AM, said:

Yes, he did say any chance of upgrading the engine rested on on thing. He did not elaborate on that but I strongly suspect that it is the negotiations with Microsoft over the continued use of the MechWarrior license. I do not know what length of time the original agreement was for but I doubt that it was for more than 5 or 6 years. That would mean it is due to expire and must be extended or renegotiated.

They renogtiated in 2014 "So now they could start doing real work on MWO" Till 2018 with an option to extend it to 2020

[A Shoddy Rental Mech]

Also remember that MWO is NOT based on the latest version of Cryengine.
Russ has stated it will take 6 months of work to port to a new engine(or updated cryengine)
He also stated that he doesn't think the current engine has a shelf life of another 5 years,which is what he is looking at.

Direct X 12 engines will not be on the list. PGI would lose a considerable part of their player base since not everyone runs windows 10.

[TKSax]

The Nerf Bat, on 17 August 2016 - 09:59 AM, said:

Direct X 12 engines will not be on the list. PGI would lose a considerable part of their player base since not everyone runs windows 10.

You realize in Unreal4 and Cry5 that Direct 12 can just be an option, just like we have DX9 and DX11 now.

Edited by TKSax, 17 August 2016 - 10:03 AM.

[Cy Mitchell]

TKSax, on 17 August 2016 - 09:59 AM, said:

They renogtiated in 2014 "So now they could start doing real work on MWO" Till 2018 with an option to extend it to 2020

Thanks for the info. Maybe that is what they have to do in 2017 that he mentioned ie exercise the option to extend to 2020. It certainly would take an additional two or three years of income to justify the expenditures on a new engine and the 6 months to a year of work that it would take to migrate to it.