476 replies to this topic

[Pariah Devalis]

Navid A1, on 11 November 2016 - 12:53 PM, said:

PGI... please understand that it is not Clan LPL max range which makes it superior over Clan ERLL... IT IS THE DAMN DURATION!!!!
Decrease the DURATION of the C-ERLL and it would suddenly become viable.

Well... 70% duration. 30% range. When you sit there and can listen to an audiotape of War and Peace in the time for the laser to fully discharge, there's a problem with it.

Rampage, on 11 November 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

I appreciate the explanations which accompanied the quirk "adjustments" and explained the reasoning behind those changes.

Nova got third straight negative adjustment since its resizing which is understandable but it is currently being out performed by the Hunchback II-C, equaled by the Stormcrow and perhaps eclipsed by the new Huntsman. I hope those Mechs will also continue to be reviewed.

I believe in the absence of ED the adjustments to cooldowns, range and jam rates are the best ways to control ballistics and missiles so I am glad to see some steps being taken in that direction. Additional steps that increase cooldown or raise jam rates only when boating ballistics may be necessary. I am hopeful that Gauss and PPC pairing or boating will be addressed in the near future along with possible adjustments to heat sinks or heat threshold to keep energy boating in check.

Overall, for what was supposed to be a very light patch, I see some very good changes that will impact the game in what IMO is a mostly good way.

Thank you for making use of the PTS data so that all the time that I spent there in late August and September does not feel like wasted time.

Eh. Nova still beats the... everything... for brawling with smaller lasers. I mean, my Alphaman style Huntsman config hits harder with a 72 or 78 damage strike, but it sacrifices a lot of heat efficiency for it, and has easier legs to, well, leg. The ERSLas boating Nova is just ice cold.

Edited by Pariah Devalis, 11 November 2016 - 12:58 PM.

[SvennK]

I like the way the balancing patches are evolving. Tweak, rather than beat.
Also, I cannot disagree with any of the changes.
Make LRM20s great again!

Good work PGI.

[Pugsley]

Pariah Devalis, on 11 November 2016 - 12:46 PM, said:

Gotta set a limit, somewhere.

I get that, 6 just seems low, especially with numbers & letters thrown into the mix.

[CK16]

Words from the Bishop!

Quote

The hell?

"despite the fact the summoner is all but unused the hand full of players using it are putting up high numbers".

So because a handful of dedicated Comp Tier Players do well with the SRM Bomber or Poptart... my SMN-Prime needs to be nerfed'

**** this game. Seriously, all this "punishing Peter for Pauls actions" stupidity.

Well, CK and crew were trying to get me reinvested in this game, but after seeing them look like monkeys ******* footballs trying to fix the KDK3 snafu they unleashed (because yeah, 4 super high ballistic hardpoints with a clan XL sounded like a great ******* balance idea in the first place) and essentialyl nuke every KDK but the one that was the problem....

Now because of the ******** a lot of us projected would happen with the M/F torsos.... they remove the structure from my SMN Prime RT... ya know..the empty torso? And reduce it's accel/decel while the M/F are totally untouched. IDK...maybe their data shows SMN Prime because people are putting those pods on their Invasion models for the cbill boost?

Quote

And to add insult to injury... the Summoner Prime RT loses it's 15 pt RT structure....

While the locked behind the Pay Wall SMN Pride gets a +20 structure RT

[Dee Eight]

Wintersdark, on 11 November 2016 - 11:46 AM, said:

Yeah, I never understood why they got structure buffs in the first place.

Huge hit boxes.

[Hadrogh]

Seems like they forgot the -10% heat gen on the summoner hero ct

[ExoForce]

I dont need reduced LRM reload time. I need 0.5 sec fire delay removed.

Edit: even with missile doors opened

Edited by ExoForce, 11 November 2016 - 01:16 PM.

[Tarogato]

Patch notes, on 11 November 2016 - 11:45 AM, said:

Clan UAC/2
• Jam Chance increased to 17% (from 6%)
• Jam Duration reduced to 3s (from 5s)

This has to be a typo. The UAC/2 jam chance was 14%, not 6%, correct?

[FupDup]

Tarogato, on 11 November 2016 - 01:16 PM, said:

This has to be a typo. The UAC/2 jam chance was 14%, not 6%, correct?

Maybe it was 6% on the PTS? I don't remember for sure, but that would be my guess.

[Notorious Meerkat]

All looks good - but let's see how it plays out.

[Navid A1]

ExoForce, on 11 November 2016 - 01:14 PM, said:

I dont need reduced LRM reload time. I need 0.5 sec fire delay removed.

Edit: even with missile doors opened

There is no fire delay.

You need to open your missile bay doors

[Froschkoenig]

Is this the first time PGI's done the developer notes thing for patch notes? They really do help add some context.

[Aramuside]

shameless, on 11 November 2016 - 12:20 PM, said:

you removed the uac jam chance from the adder... are you that terrified of someone running the mobile UAC20 build that you felt the need to nerf the weapon twice and remove the quirk that gave it a chance in hell of being semi-viable...

I don't know that I want to play this game anymore....

Oh no you can't play a UAC 20 Adder so you're not going to play anymore .... *facepalm*

Could you be more melodramatic in that post?

[Cy Mitchell]

Pariah Devalis, on 11 November 2016 - 12:57 PM, said:

Well... 70% duration. 30% range. When you sit there and can listen to an audiotape of War and Peace in the time for the laser to fully discharge, there's a problem with it.



Eh. Nova still beats the... everything... for brawling with smaller lasers. I mean, my Alphaman style Huntsman config hits harder with a 72 or 78 damage strike, but it sacrifices a lot of heat efficiency for it, and has easier legs to, well, leg. The ERSLas boating Nova is just ice cold.

Yep, it was best at one thing. It is outdone in virtually everything else by the Stormcrow, Hunchback II-C and the new Huntsman.

I am not complaining about the negative adjustments. I played the Nova before it was good when it was the size of a Mad CAt MKII (slight exagerration because....MWO fourm). I will continue to play it.

I just want them to share the pain.

[Sereglach]

There are some nice little things in there, but not a lot to get excited about, overall.

1. Why didn't the LRM spread normalization make it to live? That was a huge improvement to LRMs and at least gave them a chance to be more viable for general use.

2. Jam times still, as many advocated, seem a bit long. 2 cycle times -at most- should be the duration that a UAC is down for, especially with such a higher jam chance across the board.

3. Smaller energy weapons wouldn't have anywhere near as hard of a time if you reset the heat values to TT levels instead of the overly inflated levels that exist in MWO. Dropping Small Lasers to 1 heat for 3 damage with the current range buff would go a long way in making them a rather desirable choice for light striker mechs. 2 heat for 3 damage is terribly inefficient for what you get out of them.

4. No love for MG's, Flamers, or LBX's. MG's need the cone of fire gone and damage returned to 1.0 DPS or .1 per shot. Flamers need the abstract mechanics removed and brought into the fold of every other weapon in the game . . . fixed flat numbers (1.0 DPS, 2.0 Heat DPS, 1.0 HPS). LBX need tighter cone of fire and/or increased damage per pellet to make them more desirable compared to their counterparts.

5. The light class is in dire straits and you nerf the Arctic Cheetah? Really? It's probably one of the only light mechs that people don't complain about seeing on their team, but they will in the future. You need to balance lights vs. everything else, not the "best" lights vs. the terribly underperforming lights. Also, the lights wouldn't be in such dire straits if you'd stop giving heavier mech chassis -like the soon to be released Linebacker- agility quirks that make them as nimble as mediums and lights.

I could go on, but it feels like those of us advocating for regular equipment balance iterations have been banging our heads against the wall for ages. It's nice that PGI is actually adding explanations to their thought process, but PGI is still so far behind on gameplay balancing, that players have been advocating for ages to get, that it's ridiculous. I hope we see a serious change to this trend in the future. There should at least be large swaths of small monthly iterative changes until things feel right . . . and whenever something enters the mix that throws it out of whack the iterative changes should pick up again. We shouldn't be waiting months, if not years, to see something like "Small Laser range buffed to 150 meters".

Edited by Sereglach, 11 November 2016 - 01:40 PM.

[Aramuside]

Rampage, on 11 November 2016 - 12:52 PM, said:

I appreciate the explanations which accompanied the quirk "adjustments" and explained the reasoning behind those changes.

Nova got third straight negative adjustment since its resizing which is understandable but it is currently being out performed by the Hunchback II-C, equaled by the Stormcrow and perhaps eclipsed by the new Huntsman. I hope those Mechs will also continue to be reviewed.

I believe in the absence of ED the adjustments to cooldowns, range and jam rates are the best ways to control ballistics and missiles so I am glad to see some steps being taken in that direction. Additional steps that increase cooldown or raise jam rates only when boating ballistics may be necessary. I am hopeful that Gauss and PPC pairing or boating will be addressed in the near future along with possible adjustments to heat sinks or heat threshold to keep energy boating in check.

Overall, for what was supposed to be a very light patch, I see some very good changes that will impact the game in what IMO is a mostly good way.

Thank you for making use of the PTS data so that all the time that I spent there in late August and September does not feel like wasted time.

Interestingly I'd have laughed at the huntsman comment then I dropped in my 4 ASRM6 + 3 SPL Pakhet in scout mode today... 2-3 of our 4 kills in each match...

Of course elsewhere in the solo and invasion side I'm still going to disbelieve that.

[Desintegrator]

Yeah, the nerf of the Kodiak-1 is great !

This Mech performed far ahead of the other 100 ton mechs, and hit the 1000 points-of-damage border in nearly every quick-play game. So it would be great if we would see an additional nerf with the december patch.

And the Summoner nerf was not necessary.
This Mechs are completely crap and you will never get a single kill with em.

So please boost it again with the next patch.

[Appogee]

+50% AC5 and UAC5 heat?

Ouch.

[Zoose]

Ok I would like to start off with a positive comment. I thank PGI for taking the extra time to explain why some of the changes were made. It is appreciated. In the end I will state my different opinion to some of your ideas but you are the developer and obviously have the final say. My only passing remark will be I am willing to let history prove who is right...

I agree the UAC and in particular the UAC5 is a staple to hold off the Clan mech superiority. I am happy to see that your comments have re-inforced some of my sentiments over the past year/s and my comments on the KDK3 although I tend to agree with the above comment about the mech being an overperformer against ALL MECHS! A part of my definately wants to quote back to the various people who have straight up told me the KDK is not OP.

One (not all) of the reasons the UAC5 is a staple for IS is the lack of decent weapons systems and in which we are outranged and out damaged by clan tech. Further, Clan mechs cooldown quicker and carry more hardpoints which increases the ability to design different fitouts. Speaking as one of the more successful drop callers against OP clan tech in CW the changes you have just made would appear on face value to be devastatingly bad for our ability to compete (and this is already an issue if you look at the CW map.... go green or go home anyone?)

You have improved the Clan Streaks, Improved the Clan LRMS (this will cause you so much pain im loling now as for soon I will not be able to see the sky), and decimated our main weapon against OP clan mechs the UAC 5. my concern is that you have sealed the fate of IS with one move. You need to provide us with the next level of IS tech if you want to make this change to the UAC5.

I also note you made positive changes to the Timber, Crow and Direwhale. I will leave you with this.....

WOW just wow!

Edited by Zoose, 11 November 2016 - 02:26 PM.

[Jables McBarty]

Thank you for the design notes on the quirks