62 replies to this topic

[Kin3ticX]

So there shouldn't be any problems (there are)


If you are doing well below sub 1000 damage consistently game after game then you are just throwing yourself into the meat grinder. You get 4 tries and you only need to do 250 damage per mech to break 1000 damage. Yes its true, this game has objectives, but your robot is also dripping with guns and guns are what win games. Once you break 1000 damage consistently (which has been the global average in the past) you are no longer as terrible as half of everyone else.

Sometimes people have a bad game which is understandable, but over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over and over means you need to change things up to find something more suitable that performs well in FP. Im not saying you need a unit but you do need to dump your special snowflake dumpster 'mechs and bring real ones.

Damage isnt everything, but damage is the next best thing to perfectly coring out or legging a mech. Its very colinear with many of the contributory things that happen to make your team win.

So here is what I suggest. As you play, look for different players that put out monster numbers which tends to mean they know what the hell they are doing and emulate them. No guides or any other tutorial BS are needed. They will gladly tell you what their dropdecks are I guarantee you. Follow them around (without body blocking them) and help them kill their targets (which will teach you how to position).

If you cant hit anything then you probably have really bad mouse settings. You want your DPI x your ingame multiplier to = ~250-300. Yay now you can hit something.

For those that think their opponents are using armor hacks, its because they really do have more protection. Use 4 rear armor OR LESS because forward armor is what saves you while rear armor almost always goes to waste.

Thank you and have a wonderful time in stompy robots online.

Edited by Kin3ticX, 21 December 2016 - 03:32 PM.

[Appogee]

This week I dropped on several teams where a few people did less than 250 damage in four Mechs.

How is that even possibru?!

[Kin3ticX]

Appogee, on 21 December 2016 - 03:22 PM, said:

This week I dropped on several teams where a few people did less than 250 damage in four Mechs.

How is that even possibru?!

They are tier 5 and they do 60 damage in quickplay

[Appogee]

Kin3ticX, on 21 December 2016 - 03:33 PM, said:

They are tier 5 and they do 60 damage in quickplay

But I went to Faction Play because it's "hardcore mode" and to escape PUGtatoes!

[Tiantara]

- Hehee... yeah... Or thay take really bad mech or take trial mech - that also can make 250 dmg in 4 mech at all... Or they have high ping.

[Deckard Caine Sender]

I have seen multiple people fail to break 100 total damage in CW/FW/FP... and then went looking for a stiff drink to help the pain.

[Clownwarlord]

I pretty much disagree with one point of the OP. That being 4 rear armor. You will be very sad when you get shot in the back and die from it because you only have 4 rear armor.

[Stormie]

Best Post ever KineticX

Clownwarlord, on 21 December 2016 - 05:52 PM, said:

I pretty much disagree with one point of the OP. That being 4 rear armor. You will be very sad when you get shot in the back and die from it because you only have 4 rear armor.

If you are getting shot in the back you did something wrong. the regularity of being killed by a backshot is far lower than the regularity of having that extra armour on the front saving you.

Edited by Stormie, 21 December 2016 - 06:32 PM.

[The Clappalacian]

I would have been offended at this post a few months ago.

But now I've been taking a break from FP, using the time to learn how to play, and putting together a unit to actually coordinate battles with.

I think the point you make that a lot of newer and/or less experienced players don't take into consideration is that those that are good at this game are more than happy to help someone else hone their skills alongside them, or pick their brain. As long as they don't get in their way or spam them with the same questions over and over, respectively.

I wish I would have stumbled on a conversation like this a year ago, and had the foresight to take it to heart. Would have saved me some in-game embarassment, and real-life frustration.

[Davegt27]

Quote

which has been the global average in the past

how do you find the global avg?

do you have a link?

[Chagatay]

I agree. Let's go with a better more final solution.

Solo/group queue separation.

You no longer get potatoes (well you still get your level of potatoes). Solo queue has no map influence and is basically quickplay with 4 mechs and even can have a matchmaker put in because I am sure it would be popular enough to work with one (would mitigate some of the feared sync dropping*). Scouting is the same as now. Invasion (with the map and no matchmaker) is left untouched except that you need a group to participate.

In addition, PGI now has a very resilient way to compute IS/Clan balance once and for all. Large sets data would be theirs to analyze for free.

*well some of it. You can sync drop in solo queue now but it is just as likely you will be on opposite teams from your buddy.

Edited by Chagatay, 21 December 2016 - 07:49 PM.

[Kin3ticX]

Davegt27, on 21 December 2016 - 07:35 PM, said:

how do you find the global avg?

do you have a link?

various stat dumps from past tukayid events

[Ted Wayz]

I agree. if you are part of an organized unit dropping as group and doing less than 1000 damage in 4 mechs you and your unit need help.

If you are Pugging and do less than 1000 damage where 3 of your 4 drops were spawn camped...welcome to FW matchmaking and FW map design!

Yes, this all the players problem. Why didn't we all realize this sooner?

[Wildstreak]

Due to the event, I am skipping trying new FP. I figure that is why OP sees what he does.

I don't measure by damage though last time I played FP, I was able to get 1000+ usually with Clan in any fight or IS vs IS but not IS vs Clan more often. I do know there is more to why some do not score 1000+ like the match I still remember from a year+ ago.

A PUG I was in dropped vs a 12 man of 228. Right off the bat, 3-4 guys start complaining on VOIP about how we are going to lose. I made one comment trying to encourage people to still try their best and got reamed over VOIP by my own team.
End of match, only one of those guys scored higher than me and I was #2, only 3-4 of us broke 1000.

Morale matters. PUGs vs teams results in low PUG morale in some players, end result they score low. Some will listen to no positive encouraging comments.

That match was one of several why I left for 7 months. Now I will not play FP during an event, I only tried Scouting mode in one event last month because I never did it and wanted to see what it was like.

Not worth playing FP during an event if you want certain results. Not worth the anger, frustration and all else.

[Starbomber109]

Sometimes I can do 1000-1200, but sometimes I only get like 500-700. There are usually two reasons for this. Reason A: Our team got roflstomped by EVIL. It makes me feel bad because I KNOW I should be getting 1000-1500 damage in a game. My mech builds are not bad, I visit metamechs often, and I also follow build advice in the FRR Drop Deck thread. It's just vs higher skilled players I die too quickly to play a part, or I lose my ST in the first trade and then the 2nd trade I'm dead. Reason B: We call for a push and I'm in the front. This is a recurring theme for me I always wanna be on the front line duking it out with the enemy, which usually makes me the first to die. I also tend to get shot in the back a lot when pushing through the enemy. My back armor is around 5-6 so that's gone very fast.

What are some tips for breaking past that 700 dmg wall? (Edit: It's usually ONE MECH that underperforms which puts me down. It's always a different mech though. I don't think my builds are the problem I just think I need to learn how not to be focus fired)

Edited by Starbomber109, 21 December 2016 - 09:00 PM.

[Sir Poodlington]

So I am routinely NOT doing 1,000 damage a match. I don't think I have ever done 1,000 damage a match...

I have a Battlemaster 2C which I can get 300 to 400 damage on. I am still using a trial mech in my drop deck.

What should I have in my IS drop deck? I was thinking a second Battlemaster, then some combination of rifleman, blackjack, centurion and locust.

I'm going to go back to quickplay and farm up until I have a recommended drop deck, but you should at least give us noobs a trial layout if you want us to stick to it!

[MischiefSC]

The problem isn't people getting less than 1K damage every match.

The problem is people getting less than 1K damage and always making an excuse for why they don't do a lot of damage or an excuse to justify why doing so little damage is okay.

Even worse is people who get less than 1K and respond by bringing sniper/LRM builds to farm damage from the very back and vulture the odd kill so they can occasionally break 1K damage and then pretend that playing like that is the only reason everyone else breaks 1K and everyone who plays well at the game plays like a selfish ****.

The problem isn't people being bad, the problem is people being bad consistently and not improving.

Next question is:

Is it a WILL issue or a SKILL issue?

As in, do they have reasonable, viable and accessible opportunities to learn to improve or do they just not want to?

Usually is some of both. Making friends on the interwebz in MWO can be intimidating to some people or just a flat turn-off, because most people on the interwebz are terrible people who probably shouldn't be allowed to communicate with other human beings. There's few good tools to help onboard new/inexperienced players. Just the ability to invite someone to group from the chat in a match would help. The ability to preset a TS link to give to someone so you can 'invite to TS' from chat, they click on the link, it open the client and takes them to the room.

Mostly though it's most people not wanting to put forth the effort to improve, because if you try then you run the risk of failure. Failure without trying is nice and safe. Making excuses is a lot easier and safer and there's the illusion that 'practice makes perfect', which isn't true. It just makes you very, very practiced at being bad.

The guy above? That's a SKILL issue person. They want to improve. Now the question is how do we get them the opportunity consistently?

Sir Poodlington, on 21 December 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

So I am routinely NOT doing 1,000 damage a match. I don't think I have ever done 1,000 damage a match...

I have a Battlemaster 2C which I can get 300 to 400 damage on. I am still using a trial mech in my drop deck.

What should I have in my IS drop deck? I was thinking a second Battlemaster, then some combination of rifleman, blackjack, centurion and locust.

I'm going to go back to quickplay and farm up until I have a recommended drop deck, but you should at least give us noobs a trial layout if you want us to stick to it!

The Battlemaster is a great choice. It's a solid mech and you've got the right one for FW. You only want 1 Assault in your deck though or you'll be too light in later waves. Best to run 2 heavies and the last spot a light/medium. Warhammer 6D is a great choice; 3 Large Pulse and 3 Medium Lasers and play it similar to the BLR. A Grasshopper can be a good option too. 5P has the best quirks for it. If you like running lasers those are the strong choices.

Blackjack is another solid choice. The Centurion and Rifleman are iffy and the more mechs you get the more time you'll spend leveling stuff up. Better off trying to keep the list as short as possible.

Locust is a bad choice. If you're getting a light, get a Firestarter with 5 MPLs or 7 SPLs. Maybe a Raven 4X with 2LPLs.

Staying in QP until you get a deck is a good choice, however if you can get in with a team and drop with them in FW you'll learn a *huge* amount about how to play very quickly and get a lot of immediate help with your deck. You'll also make tons of XP with the team helping carry you.

[Kin3ticX]

Sir Poodlington, on 21 December 2016 - 10:03 PM, said:

So I am routinely NOT doing 1,000 damage a match. I don't think I have ever done 1,000 damage a match...

I have a Battlemaster 2C which I can get 300 to 400 damage on. I am still using a trial mech in my drop deck.

What should I have in my IS drop deck? I was thinking a second Battlemaster, then some combination of rifleman, blackjack, centurion and locust.

I'm going to go back to quickplay and farm up until I have a recommended drop deck, but you should at least give us noobs a trial layout if you want us to stick to it!

As someone new to CW you kinda want to have an equal strength dropdeck rather than a front loaded dropdeck. This gives you more tries with a strong mech rather than getting to your 4th and being in a tiny mech.

So basically, 70-70-70-55 rather than perhaps 85-85-60-35

Centurion is not a great invasion Mech but the AH is alright in the scout queue as a pure brawler. You want three Warhammers and then make the 4th mech your wildcard mech. Grasshoppers are nice too. There are others, but just to keep it simple Warhammers Warhammers Warhammers

[MischiefSC]

Kin3ticX, on 21 December 2016 - 10:15 PM, said:

As someone new to CW you kinda want to have an equal strength dropdeck rather than a front loaded dropdeck. This gives you more tries with a strong mech rather than getting to your 4th and being in a tiny mech.

So basically, 70-70-70-55 rather than perhaps 85-85-60-35

Centurion is not a great invasion Mech but the AH is alright in the scout queue as a pure brawler. You want three Warhammers and then make the 4th mech your wildcard mech. Grasshoppers are nice too. There are others, but just to keep it simple Warhammers Warhammers Warhammers

WHR 6R and 6D are some of the best mechs the IS has right now.

However BLR, 2WHR/GHR and a CDA isn't bad at all. The BLR he's already got and the 2C is one of the best trading mechs and works pretty well on every single map.

[Kin3ticX]

Clownwarlord, on 21 December 2016 - 05:52 PM, said:

I pretty much disagree with one point of the OP. That being 4 rear armor. You will be very sad when you get shot in the back and die from it because you only have 4 rear armor.

If you did an experiment where after each time you die you increase your armor in the direction you died from by 1 point, you would eventually have 0 rear armor.

Edited by Kin3ticX, 21 December 2016 - 10:35 PM.