96 replies to this topic

[Mystere]

Pjwned, on 05 January 2017 - 06:32 PM, said:

The thing is that the crying was mostly about the map being way too small for 12v12 and arguably even 8v8. I had no real problems with the map itself and don't recall seeing many complaints from other people that didn't just boil down to "the map is way too small," and I even prefer the old Forest Colony over what we have now honestly because the new Forest Colony has too many rocks and mountains that make most of the map worthless.

I liked old Forest Colony and even old River City, they were just way too small for 12v12 matches and that was the only real issue that needed to be addressed.

I never found the old maps "too small". I found them "small enough" as to make fights quick and brutal. It's that grittiness -- as opposed to the current and extremely boring peekaboo play style -- that made me like them.

[Bud Crue]

Pjwned, on 05 January 2017 - 06:32 PM, said:

The thing is that the crying was mostly about the map being way too small for 12v12 and arguably even 8v8. I had no real problems with the map itself and don't recall seeing many complaints from other people that didn't just boil down to "the map is way too small," and I even prefer the old Forest Colony over what we have now honestly because the new Forest Colony has too many rocks and mountains that make most of the map worthless.

I liked old Forest Colony and even old River City, they were just way too small for 12v12 matches and that was the only real issue that needed to be addressed.

Yeah but new forest has that archway! It must be more awesome than that old tunnel. I mean if 9 out of 10 matches on new forest take place by that arch it must be loved by all who behold it.

Also: Yub Yub!

[Pjwned]

Mystere, on 05 January 2017 - 06:35 PM, said:

I never found the old maps "too small". I found them "small enough" as to make fights quick and brutal. It's that grittiness -- as opposed to the current and extremely boring peekaboo play style -- that made me like them.

Old Forest Colony was too small for 24 mechs to make smart maneuvers that didn't end up with getting blasted apart for their effort most of the time, and I recall many a game where it boiled down to peek-a-boo with one side holed up near the cave and the other side holed up behind the cliff near the water. Not that it was always like that, and I do recall some fun & tense matches where it was fun despite the map being so small, but the size of the map for 12v12 was definitely a huge issue.

Old River City was even worse, the NASCAR on that map was just out of hand in Conquest & Skirmish and when it came to Assault both teams just camped their base because turrets would spot you if you moved practically anywhere else. Remember all the spawn rushing going from the city to the water and wiping out any slow mechs that were unfortunate enough to not immediately take cover by heading towards the citadel and/or not having any teammates provide any cover while they were getting spawn rushed? That was just dumb and it mostly had to do with the map being way too small for 12v12.

Edited by Pjwned, 05 January 2017 - 09:06 PM.

[El Bandito]

Aside from all the benefits other people had pointed out:

8v8 (at least for pug matches) = more potato computers can handle MWO = more players playing MWO.

There is no downside for 8v8 in pug matches.

[Anjian]

The problem with the 8 vs 8 is when one member in one team is lost or AFK or disconnected, it cascades quickly into a stomp.

Ideally, 12 to 16 are good for single spawn play, while 5 or 6 to 8 players are better for play with respawns.

[El Bandito]

Anjian, on 05 January 2017 - 07:26 PM, said:

The problem with the 8 vs 8 is when one member in one team is lost or AFK or disconnected, it cascades quickly into a stomp.

Ideally, 12 to 16 are good for single spawn play, while 5 or 6 to 8 players are better for play with respawns.

On the other hand, I can make much better difference in 8v8 and turn the tide in a losing game. In 12 v 12, it is way harder to carry, thus one has to be at even bigger mercy of pug lottery. Not to mention, many ammo based loadouts will run out of ammo before I can carry my idiotic teammates.

Not to mention, deathballs were far fewer in 8v8 than 12v12 and people actually used different routes, even in small maps such as the old Frozen City.

Ultimately, 8v8 allows for much better matchmaking, since the participant number per match is smaller. And that alone is worth it.

Edited by El Bandito, 05 January 2017 - 09:11 PM.

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 05 January 2017 - 07:25 PM, said:

There is no downside for 8v8 in pug matches.

There are butchers running around in the solo queue. 8v8 will be like giving them fresh meat.

Edited by Mystere, 05 January 2017 - 09:26 PM.

[El Bandito]

Mystere, on 05 January 2017 - 09:26 PM, said:

There are butchers running around in the solo queue. 8v8 will be like giving them fresh meat.

And 8v8 means we will see less of them per match.

[Mystere]

El Bandito, on 05 January 2017 - 09:30 PM, said:

And 8v8 means we will see less of them per match.

Really? Because according to some people, they meet and get pummeled all the time every time in the group queue by the 12-man bogeyman. How will this be any different?

[Y E O N N E]

Mystere, on 05 January 2017 - 09:26 PM, said:

There are butchers running around in the solo queue. 8v8 will be like giving them fresh meat.

Sssssh, no dreams, please. Only tears!

[RestosIII]

Mystere, on 05 January 2017 - 09:40 PM, said:

Really? Because according to some people, they meet and get pummeled all the time every time in the group queue by the 12-man bogeyman. How will this be any different?

You do realize there's a difference between a group on comms in a 6-8 man coordinating and a the normal "good players" in a match, right?

[Mystere]

RestosIII, on 05 January 2017 - 09:45 PM, said:

You do realize there's a difference between a group on comms in a 6-8 man coordinating and a the normal "good players" in a match, right?

Sheesh! It's supposed to be a new bogeyman! Get on with the program and don't be like Dutch and Co.:

Edited by Mystere, 05 January 2017 - 09:50 PM.

[El Bandito]

Mystere, on 05 January 2017 - 09:40 PM, said:

Really? Because according to some people, they meet and get pummeled all the time every time in the group queue by the 12-man bogeyman. How will this be any different?

Different modes, different numbers.

[Drakenn]

In 8v8 more of the map gets used, brawling is a legit strategy, bringing back the usefulness of all of the weapons that can't just peakaboo. This also brings back the usefulness of slower assault 'mechs like the Atlas which, in this meta, just gets focused down ASAP.

The role of the gritty assault brawler is one I miss.

I mean really, who didn't like a good brawl?


edit: also, with fewer 'mechs, lights are heavily needed to secure points... giving them more importance as well.

Edited by Drakenn, 05 January 2017 - 10:13 PM.

[l33tworks]

I feel this sum BS. Its nothing but praise for 8vs8 evrytime its brought up and this is no exception. Why isnt the community pestering PGI about it because I really think its not on even their minds.

Leave 12v12 for CW and make quickplay 8vs8 youd be crazy not to its nothing but positive.

Edited by l33tworks, 05 January 2017 - 10:16 PM.

[Drakenn]

l33tworks, on 05 January 2017 - 10:15 PM, said:

I feel this sum BS. Its nothing but praise for 8vs8 evrytime its brought up and this is no exception. Why isnt the community pestering PGI about it because I really think its not on even their minds.

Leave 12v12 for CW and make quickplay 8vs8 youd be crazy not to its nothing but positive.

If this topic constantly coming up in their forums and always being met by comments agreeing doesn't get their attention, then how?

[Y E O N N E]

Drakenn, on 05 January 2017 - 10:22 PM, said:

If this topic constantly coming up in their forums and always being met by comments agreeing doesn't get their attention, then how?

Twitter.

[GoatHILL]

Try to remember the mechs we had when it was still 8v8 35 point alphas were considered game breaking. Now we have mechs that easily double that all over the place.

On top of that another reason 8v8 was bad the stats showed that the first team to lose 2 mechs lost @85% of the time. Look at scouting at only 4v4 in med mechs once the fight starts its over in 30 seconds. Throw in people running potato mechs dropping on your team and your done.

8v8 is fun in theory but falls short in practice for public drops if, you are really wanting to 8v8 use the private lobby.

[Beaching Betty]

Damn, brings back memories of when the game was still in BETA and only has 8 vs 8... Good old time

[RestosIII]

GoatHILL, on 05 January 2017 - 11:41 PM, said:

use the private lobby.

Can we all agree that almost every time someone spouts this out, it's completely idiotic? Why yes, I will go hunt down 17 friends capable of playing at the exact same time to do combat drops that give zero rewards and will never have the same variety in builds and player skill as QP.