258 replies to this topic

[SCHLIMMER BESTIMMER XXX]

Snazzy Dragon, on 08 January 2017 - 04:36 AM, said:

They are detrimental to the team on almost every single map and unless you are dropping with several friends don't bring them. Period. They cost too much weight compared to clan counterparts and clanners will dodge them at range every single time.

Just. Stop.

Even an AC2 boat is better than that **** when you're dropping solo.

love to have enemy mech locked under UAV and no one reconaisse it.Also 600-800 meters away, so no chance to fire back at me.Everybody knows the feeling how enraging it is when countless volleys/streams of lrm´s hammer against your cockpit
that you nearly go blind + no cover in sight.With the right team (dont need to be friends, just guys who use the lock target key
or better a light who calls them) they can be very effective and i still love to play them, allways trying to use them with skill
(no quarter spamming, right positioning and dont overheat with my lrm80 spamer hammer d(@_@)d

[SCHLIMMER BESTIMMER XXX]

the earlier people realize why they demand from other people to stop using lrm´s, the earlier
they gonna accept that this will never happen.Because something that pawn´s so easily and enraging is just too precious to give up.everybody knows this moment, when you take your hands of the keyboard and accept your fate with the words "well, i am ****** ;( "

[MovinTarget]

Devrij, on 06 March 2017 - 06:35 AM, said:

I hear this all the time, but a lot of the wins against clans that I've seen have been because of good coordinated LRM spam. It's one of the few weapons that IS have that is more effective than the clan counterparts (ignoring weight ofc). Yes, it's stupid if you aren't going to be working with the rest of the team, but it is a great way to keep pop tarts and snipers behind cover, chip off armour and provide area denial. The big caveat is that they have to be used properly. Generally they are a bad idea for siege maps though. In normal game modes I have no issue with them.

You know, before necro'ing a thread would behoove you to read it.

Nobody here would dispute coordinated lurms with tag, narc, uavs, and all the fixin can have its place. What grinds peoples gears are the out of touch, sandbagging, useless hiders that sit in the back and don't do anything to help themselves, much less the team. Just sit back and beg for locks.

We also touched on how this is more an issue with mentality that can be applicable to any number of weapons systems.

We also discussed the best way to alleviate any such frustration is to group up with like-minded players so you either:

1) don' have lurmers to worry about.
Or
2) you organize and plan on bring spotters/narcs/tag/etc


Basically, you are dredging up something either to troll or didn't bother reading the thread.


/golf clap

Edited by MovinTarget, 06 March 2017 - 04:41 PM.

[MovinTarget]

SHRedo, on 06 March 2017 - 02:41 PM, said:

the earlier people realize why they demand from other people to stop using lrm´s, the earlier
they gonna accept that this will never happen.Because something that pawn´s so easily and enraging is just too precious to give up.everybody knows this moment, when you take your hands of the keyboard and accept your fate with the words "well, i am ****** ;( "

Personally, and this is just my personal opinion, just like you have yours...

If you can't win duels in your mech, you have no business expecting your team to carry you when you drop solo.

I am not saying everyone needs to drop in dueling mechs in fp, but if you are dropping solo, you should probably plan on being uncoordinated and unsupported... alot....

Edited by MovinTarget, 06 March 2017 - 04:41 PM.

[Novakaine]

It's so odd to hear clanners say this and they do the exact same thing.
Snazzy your reverse psy op is terri-weak.

[MovinTarget]

Novakaine, on 07 March 2017 - 02:00 PM, said:

It's so odd to hear clanners say this and they do the exact same thing.
Snazzy your reverse psy op is terri-weak.

Its because he can't get his guys to stop bringing lurms solo so he might as well use positive reinforcement on his enemies to mitigate his lack of pug-whispering skillz...

[WVAnonymous]

Amsro, on 10 January 2017 - 12:12 PM, said:

The people who you are talking to aren't likely on the forums either.

I liked this comment before I realized Amsro is in my unit.

I blame no one for my premature death when lights loops behind and eat my LRM boats.

I have tag and BAP on virtually all of my LRM-centric builds.

DPS is strongly dependent on how many "S" you can deliver "D" and with a 850 m quirked tag range you can get a lot of "S".

[Carl Vickers]

Devrij, on 06 March 2017 - 06:35 AM, said:

I hear this all the time, but a lot of the wins against clans that I've seen have been because of good coordinated LRM spam. It's one of the few weapons that IS have that is more effective than the clan counterparts (ignoring weight ofc). Yes, it's stupid if you aren't going to be working with the rest of the team, but it is a great way to keep pop tarts and snipers behind cover, chip off armour and provide area denial. The big caveat is that they have to be used properly. Generally they are a bad idea for siege maps though. In normal game modes I have no issue with them.

Dunning/Kruger effect detected.

[justcallme A S H]

WVAnonymous, on 07 March 2017 - 03:21 PM, said:

I have tag and BAP on virtually all of my LRM-centric builds.

I don't.

But then I can crank 1k dmg in a LRM boat with ease anyway... It's about how you use it.

[MischiefSC]

Coordinated LRM teams work - against mediocre/bad teams. We had a half dozen drops on Polar/other LRM maps this last week with the other team being LRM heavy and bringing spotters. Result? Only takes 2 of us with ECM and since we can aim and our weapons are mostly hitscan we kill the spotters pretty quickly. Stick to low ground, move cover to cover, close and destroy them. Wave after wave, 12-1 or 12-0.

At 600-800m I can usually get 2 alphas on an enemy LRM boat and back into cover taking maybe half a volley of LRMs. S0 at range trading ~50 or 60 points of damage (almost all to a single location) vs taking 20 or so point scattered around my mech. Even if I'm taking a full volley I'm, again, trading 60 pts on a single location vs ~40 pts scattered around my mech since most the LRMs hit the dirt.

The only time LRMs are a better choice than direct fire is when you literally can't aim for one reason or another. That's it. If you can get the crosshairs on a target with even moderate accuracy you're going to be more useful with direct fire.

I could put out 2K with 4 streakboats in my deck but I'm vastly more useful to my team getting 1200 with 4 direct fire mehs, because that 1200 is effectively killing enemies while the 2-2.5k in streaks is just farming damage. LRMs are the same thing, only worse. If you are not shoulder to shoulder with the rest of your team taking just as many hits from the enemy as your teammates are then you're screwing your team by letting them get focused down while you try to farm damage.

Bring what you want, however there's no serious argument about this. When you bring LRMs you're going to lose to an equal skilled team if anyone on the field can aim. That's been proven endless times in every moderately serious, semi-competitive environment this game has. Until someone takes their "LRMs that work great if used correctly" strategy and actually consistently beats good teams with direct fire this is the proven case. As that's never happened, ever, there's no real argument. Just people pointing out facts and other people wanting to pretend it's not true. Which is fine, we'll keep farming you and you'll keep pretending it's hax or whatever, but reality is reality.

Edited by MischiefSC, 11 March 2017 - 06:10 PM.

[Novakaine]

Strange every single FW game I've played for the past 4 months.
The Clankers are running 2 or 3 lurm boats
Sometimes even more from pugs groups to their elite units.
Don't believe clanker crap-talk.
Because it's just crap.
At any rate........

[MischiefSC]

Novakaine, on 25 March 2017 - 12:20 PM, said:

Strange every single FW game I've played for the past 4 months.
The Clankers are running 2 or 3 lurm boats
Sometimes even more from pugs groups to their elite units.
Don't believe clanker crap-talk.
Because it's just crap.
At any rate........

Yes.

And they're all terrible.

It's at a point where on the Clan side you can't drop with less than 10 if you don't want to have to go full 120% CARRY MODE.

IS is running a lot of LRMs too. With Alpine and Polar in play even some units are playing with the LRMs + NARC lights stuff. Which results in 12 people shooting 1 or 2 lights, who die quickly, then just walking up and double curb stomping the rest in their dropzone.

At which point you get people raging over being spawn camped - even though they literally set up in or just at their own spawn on wave 1.

Even if matches were just huge flat featureless plains direct fire would win out. Who kills who first, who is best able to focus fire effectively and who is able to share damage inflicted by the enemy most effectively.

You do you Nova. You're on a short list, nobody is ever going to say you don't carry your weight. However the other 99.99999% of players taking LRMs? Nope. Ending the match whining that 'the team didn't support them'. The team never should support them, they should be supporting the team. That failure to comprehend, that specific disconnect, that you're there to share armor and work for the success of the team and not the team is there to help you win, that's at the crux of a lot of why most people taking LRMs are bads.

[FreeFragUK]

Both sides are equally guilty of bringing, arguably, excessive amounts of LRM's. This is not limited just
to the Inner Sphere as many have mentioned. If anything from my experiences I'm more likely to see
Clan mechs equipped with a substantial amount of LRM's because there is no minimum range, unlike
their IS counter-parts.

The reality is simply that, unless you're participating in a full unit drop, you're facing the roulette table.
Some times you may drop and there could be no LRM's on either side, other times they may be stacked
in the Clan team or the IS team and then on other occasions both teams will be carrying so many LRM's
that you'll be wishing there was someone carrying some AC's or PPC's.

On one final note. A major issue with some of those bringing LRM's to the fight is that they simply fail to
understand how to use them effectively, these are the players who damage a team and it's unfortunate.

So yes... being on the receiving on massive amounts of LRM's sucks but having people on your team who
simply fail to comprehend how to use them effectively sucks just as much, if not more.

Edited by FreeFragUK, 26 March 2017 - 04:58 PM.

[justcallme A S H]

There are some units out there that just bring LRMs anyway and get accordingly slapped within 10mins for doing so.

It's pretty funny when they say "We bring LRMs cause we know we can't win against you guys"... Odd thing is though, they don't actually know who they are against, until you hit the game screen... So there was never 'playing around cause they can't win', they were always gonna LRM and assume they could just roll PUGs with potato cannons.

[Solkar]

Notice that *most* of the people telling IS to stop using LRMs are clanners? (just food for thought)

There are 2 ways to be effective with LRMs, and both ways require a mobile mech and a LOT of ammo.

If you are a barely mobile missile turret you will die to light mechs. If you fill up on launchers to have "big volleys" and have under 1k ammo you will not be as effective as you should be.

You can play sustained damage or push to cover and help your team. You need a mech doing 100+ kph and carrying around 2000 missiles so you can spend them without worry. You need to be able to launch 20+ at a time (to break through AMS) or 5 just at a time (for scaring people) so at least 1 LRM5 launcher.

"push to cover" tactic: when you see mechs at max range pop on radar throw 5 missiles at them... they probably do zero damage, that is OK. the enemy has no idea if it is 5 missiles or 40, they have no idea how close they are, they probably take cover... they are now out of the fight for a few seconds. Keep doing this, keep the enemy hiding as much as possible. This lets your team have the numbers advantage in the brawls. You can spend 1500+ missiles and do under 200 damage and still tremendously help your team if you are making 2-4 people hide all the time... BUT for the love of god don't stay in one place. Remember i said 100+kph? MOVE! Always move. and never be too far from friends so little locusts don't core you.

"Sustained damage" tactic: Stay right in the center of your team, provide mid-short range support (200-500) and then depending if the enemy has AMS or not either chain fire or burst fire your missiles. Shoot like crazy, don't conserve ammo, blind the enemy with chained LRMs (unless AMS is a problem). Shoot the enemy that the team is direct firing, help keep the pressure on because even if he gets behind the hill that barely blocks lasers you can finish him off.

DO NOT bring a 50 kph missile turret, you will be isolated.
DO NOT bring something with only 600 ammo because you will try to conserve it and only take good shots (600 ammo is only 12 shots if you have a pair of LRM20s after all).

[justcallme A S H]

Solkar, on 26 March 2017 - 07:02 PM, said:

only 600 ammo because you will try to conserve it and only take good shots (600 ammo is only 12 shots if you have a pair of LRM20s after all).

Umm...

[theUgly]

I have abv 1k games by now for sure in CW .
Have dropped with pure pug teams all the way to top units in a 12 men .

The only successful LRM boats that i have seen so far is the one
that is been carried .

[Marquis De Lafayette]

Solkar, on 26 March 2017 - 07:02 PM, said:

Notice that *most* of the people telling IS to stop using LRMs are clanners? (just food for thought)

Oh no!...they have seen through the ruse of our "helpful advice"....

[MovinTarget]

It could also be that he's not noticing that many of us are Mercs and perhaps made comments when we were IS...

[Marquis De Lafayette]

MovinTarget, on 28 March 2017 - 06:01 AM, said:

It could also be that he's not noticing that many of us are Mercs and perhaps made comments when we were IS...

Shhh....hush...