137 replies to this topic

[oldradagast]

Dirus Nigh, on 12 March 2017 - 08:03 AM, said:

To all the responded to me. I just got ******* sick and tired of the self righteous ******** from players who would rather through a temper tantrum on the forums than just finding some thing else to do. You are not being constructive, you are not adding any thing to the community on the forums. If you dont like MWO, PGI, or the devs that much, just go and find some thing else to do.

Says the guy picking fights with everyone on the forums. If you don't like what the people here are posting, or the facts, or anything else, just go find something else to do. It works both ways. Just don't start blaming the community when PGI's latest screw-up cripples the game permanently.

Edited by oldradagast, 12 March 2017 - 08:07 AM.

[oldradagast]

Probably Not, on 12 March 2017 - 08:07 AM, said:

We wouldn't "throw temper tantrums" (as you so eloquently put it - are you sure you're not a Russ sockpuppet or something?) if we didn't actually CARE about the franchise. Such is the peril of courting a borderline-cult fanbase like BT/MW's and then pissing on their shoes every chance you get. Maybe Russ should have picked an easier target I MEAN A LESS-DEDICATED FANBASE.

A less dedicated fanbase would have left years ago.

Still, the white-knighting is hilarious and illustrative of serious issues an increasing number of people have in their thought processes. The primary defenses we've seen of the skill maze - aside from those that just outright ignore facts - fall into one of a few groups, each suffering from horrible flaws in reasoning:
- "Change is, by definition, good."
- "If you don't like something, I like it, because I like other people's pain and suffering."
- "If most people support a position and have facts to back it up, I will oppose them because I'm smarter than everyone else, people are stupid, and facts are dumb / part of the conspiracy / impossible to prove."

All of those staggeringly bad decision making reasons are showing up in full force here MWO with regard to the skill maze, just as they've been showing up in a lot of other places in our culture in recent years - and it's only getting worse with time. It's a serious problem.

Edited by oldradagast, 12 March 2017 - 08:11 AM.

[Bud Crue]

Dirus Nigh, on 12 March 2017 - 08:03 AM, said:

To all the responded to me. I just got ******* sick and tired of the self righteous ******** from players who would rather through a temper tantrum on the forums than just finding some thing else to do. You are not being constructive, you are not adding any thing to the community on the forums. If you dont like MWO, PGI, or the devs that much, just go and find some thing else to do.

We stay because we have hope that despite all evidence to the contrary, that at some point PGI will make the game they promised to make all those years ago.

We stay because this is the only Mechwarrior/Battletech (based) game being actively developed, however negatively we may see some of that development.

We stay because PGI has a monopoly hold on this particular brand of nostalgia via their exclusive license to the IP.

We stay because some of us have literally thousands of dollars invested in it.

We stay because we want PGI to give us a reason to stay. We really do like the game and we just want PGI to stop f**king it up and pushing us and other players away.

[Johnny Z]

Time to start grinding for creds like its 2012 all over again. Party on.

[Cy Mitchell]

Probably Not, on 12 March 2017 - 07:15 AM, said:

If you'd watch the video, you'd clearly see and hear the moment Russ Bullock drops the "cheapskate" bomb.

Amazing what a little creative editing will get you. Out of context much?

1. Russ clearly said he was joking.
2. Russ was talking about people not spending C-Bills on modules but playing the switching module game.

Nothing was ever said about people spending or not spending cash on the game.

But hey, carry on with the false news. It is the new norm in this country, even the POTUS does it, so it might as well be the new norm in MWO.

[Mcgral18]

Rampage, on 12 March 2017 - 08:36 AM, said:

Amazing what a little creative editing will get you. Out of context much?

1. Russ clearly said he was joking.

Tuesday also specifically stated he was joking as well
He still didn't like the joke

[oldradagast]

Rampage, on 12 March 2017 - 08:36 AM, said:

Amazing what a little creative editing will get you. Out of context much?

1. Russ clearly said he was joking.
2. Russ was talking about people not spending C-Bills on modules but playing the switching module game.

Nothing was ever said about people spending or not spending cash on the game.

But hey, carry on with the false news. It is the new norm in this country, even the POTUS does it, so it might as well be the new norm in MWO.

If it had been a harmless "joke," it still would have been in poor taste on an official message video to the customers vs. being in a backroom meeting somewhere.

But this "joke" is attached to a massive change to the core mechanics of the game that forces a lot more grinding down everyone's throats. That, naturally, casts doubts on it being a joke, and certainly explains why people are angry.

Even if Russ didn't mean it, he should know better and the new, bigger grind coming up in a few weeks makes it look like he did mean it.

[cazidin]

Bud Crue, on 12 March 2017 - 07:53 AM, said:

Agreed. On the ranking scale of Russ's insults to the community over the years, the "cheapskates" crack doesn't even make the top 3. I find the legendary "you're on an island" quote to be superior, and nothing beats the April town hall of last year with the whole "people should stop telling us how to make the game better, we know best" soliloquy. The top middle finger to the community line is from that same townhall where he said "you should be thanking me for making the game". That one is my personal favorite. Just the whole vibe was great. Lets also not forget past townhalls where Russ was drunk. Nothing says I respect my customers and community more than repeatedly holding PR events where you get drunk.

Yeah, people need to cut poor Russ a break.

You're on an island, cheapskate. Players need to stop telling Russ how to make their game because they know better and have internal data that you couldn't possibly be aware of, and no, we won't share that with or communicate any of this to you. Also. You should be THANKFUL that we have so graciously created this game for you to enjoy. Shut up and give us money... hic!

How's that? Did I miss any?

[JediPanther]

Bud Crue, on 12 March 2017 - 08:24 AM, said:

We stay because some of us have literally thousands of dollars invested in it.

We stay because we want PGI to give us a reason to stay. We really do like the game and we just want PGI to stop f**king it up and pushing us and other players away.

Pretty much the only two reasons I still play and probably a few others. I haven't broke the 1k dollar amount but it's still in the hundreds. PGI has made more **** ups with this game than I care to try and count. Literately years worth of data from the people who use their product constantly giving their ideas and going so far as to fix problems for pgi for free on the forums as well as people who would gladly make assets or "mods" as long as they received credit for the work and yet the game just gets worse by the month.

Even with a revolving door of community moderators and volunteer moderators pgi's failures in communication are abysmal by any standard. If I was in game development of any kind I surly would not want to be remotely associated with pgi for fear of what it would do to my ability to get paying work no matter how great my demo reel, portfolio, or past work experience is.

[AnTi90d]

cazidin, on 12 March 2017 - 08:40 AM, said:

You're on an island, cheapskate. Players need to stop telling Russ how to make their game because they know better and have internal data that you couldn't possibly be aware of, and no, we won't share that with or communicate any of this to you. Also. You should be THANKFUL that we have so graciously created this game for you to enjoy. Shut up and give us money... hic!

How's that? Did I miss any?

You have to also accuse players of, "jumping the gun," at least fifteen times in half of an hour, like in the NGNG shillcast.

It couldn't possibly be that actual experienced, long-term players see critical flaws in the new system.. just like they saw the critical flaws in the Energy Draw and Infowars PTSDs.

[xengk]

I chuckled at the "cheapskate" remarked.
Having about 130 mastered mechs, and owning less than 20 modules.
I module shuffle whenever I switch mech, and admit to being a cheapskate.

The strip module button was a godsend for me.

[Cy Mitchell]

Mcgral18, on 12 March 2017 - 08:38 AM, said:

Tuesday also specifically stated he was joking as well
He still didn't like the joke

So did the OP of this thread know what context the "cheapskate" joke was made in? Because by his comment to El Bandito it seems that he does not or he is purposely misrepresenting.

[Mister Blastman]

El Bandito, on 12 March 2017 - 07:09 AM, said:

I'm gonna post this as reply to every one of this "I quit cause of new skill tree" threads/posts. See ya, won't miss ya.

It is never a good thing when a sizeable portion a game quits due to bad development decisions. Unless the developers can shoulder the costs, and if they can, must be prepared for significantly less cash flow... which means laying off coders, which means... slower improvement... or worse, none.

Yeah. Bad.

[Alistair Winter]

Probably Not, on 12 March 2017 - 07:05 AM, said:

Fantastic Tuesday's out. He MIGHT be coming back at some point in the future, but he won't be bringing his wallet.

Also, Russ Bullock thinks people who spent ~700 dollars on online stompy robots are cheapskates.

Or, you know, you could just pop your usual dose of Adderall or whatever it is you use to keep your ADHD in check and watch the damn thing.

I consider myself a pretty vocal critic of PGI when they pull something stupid, like making a convoluted, poorly designed skill tree as a way to sell as much premium time as possible, or when they ignore overwhelming feedback without any kind of proper explanation.

However, cheapskate-gate is probably the dumbest cause of controversy in MWO history. Russ was obviously talking about people who manage their c-bills carefully (as opposed to people like me who will buy and sell the same engine 100 times and thus lose a lot of c-bills in the long run). Waste not, want not, basically.

And both the NGNG shills and Russ himself clarified what he actually meant 10 seconds after he said the word 'cheapskate', just to nip it in the bud. And yet people choose to interpret his words in a totally different context, just for the joy of being outraged.

People should worry about the stuff PGI is doing that is actually intentional and actually harmful to the game. This is like getting upset by Trump saying "Grab 'em by the *****" instead of being upset by the actual harmful changes Trump is making to America.

[Mister Blastman]

Dirus Nigh, on 12 March 2017 - 08:03 AM, said:

To all the responded to me. I just got ******* sick and tired of the self righteous ******** from players who would rather through a temper tantrum on the forums than just finding some thing else to do. You are not being constructive, you are not adding any thing to the community on the forums. If you dont like MWO, PGI, or the devs that much, just go and find some thing else to do.

Actually, you should be THANKFUL we are throwing a poo fit on the forums!

We are trying to SAVE the game from a DISASTER.

THANK US.

White knighting is destructive in times like these, reminds me of a great cartoon:

Edited by Mister Blastman, 12 March 2017 - 09:17 AM.

[Mister Blastman]

Alistair Winter, on 12 March 2017 - 09:10 AM, said:

People should worry about the stuff PGI is doing that is actually intentional and actually harmful to the game. This is like getting upset by Trump saying "Grab 'em by the *****" instead of being upset by the actual harmful changes Trump is making to America.

Please refrain from bringing politics into the open forums. Some of us might disagree with you and the vitriol could spread fast. Political discussion has NO place in General Discussion.

[Johnny Z]

Forum drama over a skill tree that everyone knew would be replaced can only mean one thing, find something to do to be entertained.

Edited by Johnny Z, 12 March 2017 - 09:20 AM.

[oldradagast]

Alistair Winter, on 12 March 2017 - 09:10 AM, said:

I consider myself a pretty vocal critic of PGI when they pull something stupid, like making a convoluted, poorly designed skill tree as a way to sell as much premium time as possible, or when they ignore overwhelming feedback without any kind of proper explanation.

However, cheapskate-gate is probably the dumbest cause of controversy in MWO history. Russ was obviously talking about people who manage their c-bills carefully (as opposed to people like me who will buy and sell the same engine 100 times and thus lose a lot of c-bills in the long run). Waste not, want not, basically.

Yes and no.

In short, it's not specifically that everything was great until Russ made a bad joke about cheapskates and THAT offended everyone, but rather that this storm has been brewing for weeks now since the utter failure of a skill maze - and the huge, new grind associated with it - was revealed. Then, when given a chance to address the situation, PGI tells everyone to "stuff it" and they are going to deploy the skill maze basically as-is, with all the failures still in place, and Russ spends his time cracking bad jokes that don't mesh well at all with holding everyone's mechs hostage behind a grind-wall.

Joking that people who've poured hundreds or thousands of dollars into the game are all "cheapskates" is stupid; doing it right before forcing all those people to regrind their mechs is just mind-bogglingly stupid.

Edited by oldradagast, 12 March 2017 - 09:21 AM.

[Alistair Winter]

Mister Blastman, on 12 March 2017 - 09:15 AM, said:

Please refrain from bringing politics into the open forums. Some of us might disagree with you and the vitriol could spread fast. Political discussion has NO place in General Discussion.

Meh. Some of us should lighten up and stop being offended by everything. Who cares.

oldradagast, on 12 March 2017 - 09:20 AM, said:

Joking that people who've poured hundreds or thousands of dollars into the game are all "cheapskates" is stupid; doing it right before forcing all those people to regrind their mechs is just mind-bogglingly stupid.

Russ is not good at public speaking. We all know that. But in this case, there was actually no malice intended, it was just a poor choice of words. I can't work up any kind of rage about that.

I'm more concerned about the actual game.

[Mister Blastman]

Alistair Winter, on 12 March 2017 - 09:24 AM, said:

Meh. Some of us should lighten up and stop being offended by everything. Who cares.

I care. Don't post about politics in Gen Disc. End of story. Please stop it, now.

Edited by Mister Blastman, 12 March 2017 - 09:26 AM.