71 replies to this topic

[razenWing]

For the longest time in Mechwarrior franchise, the best mech to get are the Omnis. They will let you "specialize" (boat) anyway to Sunday. They represent pretty much the pinnacle of Clan technology that IS struggles to imitate.

However, they seem to be severely neutered in MWO. Part of the awesomeness with Omnimech is with the flexibility. However, with the numerous locks, these are more drawbacks at this point. Weapon flexbility? Well, except, battlemechs have enough variants to make them essentially Omnimechs anyways.

You want energy boat? Well, there's probably an energy boat variant. You want a missile or dakka? Probably you can find those on any battlemechs as well.

So really, there's nothing special about Omnimechs except... locked everything. How many people breathe a sigh of relief when you find out that MKII was a battlemech, not an Omni? (And yea yea, I know in the lore they are technically battlemechs... but anyone that played MW4 when they were FIRST INTRODUCED, know that they are Omnis... they have freaking Omnipods. They were just retconned into the lore)

My point is, carrying Omnimech "tag" is now viewed as more of a pest or burden than not, but it shouldn't be this way. I mean, who is the most kick@ss Transformer? A lot of people can point to OMNIcron, and thus, to me... Omni means awesome, not liability.

Yes, I know your EBJ TBF and maybe some DWF still functions pretty good and featured regularly in competitive circle. But one can argue, is that due to their "omni-ness" or their "clan-ness?" Cause tier 1 meta are the IIC mechs. Marauder IIc, Haunchback IIC, Kodiaks. So I can argue that EBJ, TBF, and DWF are good, not because of Omnis... but Clan.

So I thought, rather than keep forcing the rule of 8, which further reduce the viability of Omnis (cause everyone else gets quirked, Omnis can't get those quirk if they swap out, so flexibility is a liability), PGI can start by re-introducing pod bonuses back to parts. Yea yea, I know skill tree is coming out, but didn't PGI mention that some quirk bonuses will be INDEPENDENT from skill tree bonuses? So perhaps pod bonuses can be those "independent" bonuses.

That or... I am completely fine with battle-lizing Omnimechs... and let them have the ability to drop masc, heat sink, and engine size. I will be ok with that as well.

[Cpt Zaepp]

Some people just want to see the world burn...

also: lol

[Baulven]

Honestly what I would like to see is the option to take a full pod set and turn it into a battlemech at the expense of locking your hard points. Some tweaking would need to occur to account for battlemech inflation, but I wouldn't mind giving u0 versatility of weapon load outs if it let me play with the rest of the mech options (i.e. putting endo on my hellbringer, upgrades to my fridge, etc.)

Just flat out letting you play with free tonnage is both incorrect to lore and a bad idea. It would make it so omnimechs have the best haRd points with zero drawbacks.

[Mystere]

Cpt Zaepp, on 08 April 2017 - 11:05 AM, said:

Some people just want to see the world burn...

Did someone call me?

[Andi Nagasia]

very true, but your unable to talk about OmniMech Buffs because Clan Tech op,
sadly many of my OmniMech Topics have gone silent, i will awaken them on the Eve of IS OmniMechs,

[FupDup]

razenWing, on 08 April 2017 - 10:57 AM, said:

For the longest time in Mechwarrior franchise, the best mech to get are the Omnis. They will let you "specialize" (boat) anyway to Sunday. They represent pretty much the pinnacle of Clan technology that IS struggles to imitate.

That's not how it worked. Omnimechs in old MW games used the exact same customization rules as Battlemechs. Change armor however you want, change engine however you want, put any weapon in any location (before MW4), etc. There was no difference between them.

The only difference was that MW4 gave Omnimechs a small number of Omni hardpoints that could use any weapon type (although most of their hardpoints were still restricted to just energy/missile/ballistic like Battlemechs).

Edited by FupDup, 08 April 2017 - 02:14 PM.

[meteorol]

razenWing, on 08 April 2017 - 10:57 AM, said:

Cause tier 1 meta are the IIC mechs. Marauder IIc, Haunchback IIC, Kodiaks.

You "forgot" the night gyr.

[fearfactory]

Well, the other thing to consider is that PGI intentionally left out a lot of the good configurations. Like the Stormcrow B.

You know, balance by omission.

[FupDup]

fearfactory, on 08 April 2017 - 02:14 PM, said:

Well, the other thing to consider is that PGI intentionally left out a lot of the good configurations. Like the Stormcrow B.

You know, balance by omission.

You dun derped.

SCR-B

[Paigan]

Omnimechs were never properly implemented in the first place. And that should have had nothing to do with pervertedly balancing clan equipment via some unsuited sidedoor. It's too bad almost noone understands the princinple of Separation of Concerns.

Properly would have been things like:
- You can only SLIGHTLY modify a Battlemech, but you can modify an Omnimech to any degree you want inside the possibility of pods
- Modifying a Battlemech costs several millions CB and locks the Battlemech for hours every time. Modifying Omnimechs is much cheaper and faster.
- Every pod has different (small, including negative) quirks and you can tailor your quirks as needed by combining pods.

However in MWO, Omnis, the ""pinacle"" of Mech technology were and are nothing more than the gimped, inferior, less flexible Mech kind with a kind-of-nice pod-puzzle which is sometimes good, inferior of the time useless.

Every IIC Battlemech completely outclasses its pervertedly gimp high-tech brother.

RIP OmniMechs.

Edited by Paigan, 08 April 2017 - 02:45 PM.

[FireStoat]

Baulven, on 08 April 2017 - 11:25 AM, said:

Honestly what I would like to see is the option to take a full pod set and turn it into a battlemech at the expense of locking your hard points.

I would cheerfully lock the pods of my Viper-C to its original 8/8 combo permanently if it would allow me to then treat the mech in all ways as a Battlemech. Re arrange my endo / ferro slots, rip out jump jets, change engine size?

Yes. Yes please. I'll take you up on this offer with my Huntsman variants too.

Edited by FireStoat, 08 April 2017 - 03:12 PM.

[Baulven]

FireStoat, on 08 April 2017 - 03:11 PM, said:

I would cheerfully lock the pods of my Viper-C to its original 8/8 combo permanently if it would allow me to then treat the mech in all ways as a Battlemech. Re arrange my endo / ferro slots, rip out jump jets, change engine size?

Yes. Yes please. I'll take you up on this offer with my Huntsman variants too.

Lore wise it would be accurate, since those changes simply forced the omnimech back into a battlemech. It would also highlight the glaring problems between Clan and IS tech so it might actually be addressed at some point (pipe dream but one can hope.)

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Unlocking customization options would only serve to buff underperforming omnimechs, while leaving the ones that were gifted a perfect combo by the hand of fate alone. I mean just look at the mist lynx with its locked in CAP and compare it to the likes of the Jenner IIC.

I'm sure people will beg for omnimechs to be able to be edited once IS ones come out with locked single heatsinks, locked low speed XL engines, locked standard structure, and other locked equipment.

All I have to do is wait for those IS only players to get a taste of their own medicine, and maybe by that point after new tech comes out and IS mechs are dominating and the Kodiak has finally been nerfed out of existance then people will be less likely to stick to the "Clans OP" narrative.

[R Valentine]

Given that there are a zillion underperforming IS mechs, no. Clanners don't need more buffs.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Kiran Yagami, on 08 April 2017 - 03:29 PM, said:

Given that there are a zillion underperforming IS mechs, no. Clanners don't need more buffs.

"Don't buff underperforming mechs of the faction I dislike because there are underperforming mechs of my favored faction"

Do you not believe that all underperforming mechs should be brought up and that there is much to be gained by both sides working together to ask for buffs on weak mechs instead of both of them cutting each other down any time one asks for buffs?

[Andi Nagasia]

Kiran Yagami, on 08 April 2017 - 03:29 PM, said:

Given that there are a zillion underperforming IS mechs, no. Clanners don't need more buffs.

this is the Problem, its always Clan has Stronger Toys so no Weak Clan Toy should be Buffed no matter how weak,
all weak Mechs should be Buffed, reguardless of which Faction they belong to,

[R Valentine]

Dakota1000, on 08 April 2017 - 03:43 PM, said:

"Don't buff underperforming mechs of the faction I dislike because there are underperforming mechs of my favored faction" Do you not believe that all underperforming mechs should be brought up and that there is much to be gained by both sides working together to ask for buffs on weak mechs instead of both of them cutting each other down any time one asks for buffs?

No, more like "don't buff what isn't underperforming". Most of the IS mechs have been underperforming for a lot longer than any omnimechs. Even quirked all to hell, a lot of them are totally worthless. So no, you don't get to be faction selfish.

[Champion of Khorne Lord of Blood]

Kiran Yagami, on 08 April 2017 - 03:50 PM, said:

No, more like "don't buff what isn't underperforming". Most of the IS mechs have been underperforming for a lot longer than any omnimechs. Even quirked all to hell, a lot of them are totally worthless. So no, you don't get to be faction selfish.

I have no intentions of being faction selfish, as I wish for buffs to both IS and Clan mechs, as I have a garage full of both. I advocate oftentimes to bring back the buffs that were removed around the time of the rescale, and await LFE engines to boost many underperforming IS mechs. However, I am not blind to the weak clan mechs either and see just how little the weakest get and how they always get hit by blanket nerfs to weaken the over performers. I've had many IS mechs be underperforming for long periods of time and rather than making clanners suffer the same fate I'd like to actually start fixing the problem instead of perpetuating it.

[Andi Nagasia]

Kiran Yagami, on 08 April 2017 - 03:50 PM, said:

No, more like "don't buff what isn't underperforming". Most of the IS mechs have been underperforming for a lot longer than any omnimechs. Even quirked all to hell, a lot of them are totally worthless. So no, you don't get to be faction selfish.

this has been debated to death, and most people feel that balance is pretty good,
yes there are still weak mechs, but they exist on both sides, its not all DWFs NTGs TBRs,
each has its place, the NTG or TBR cant do everything and cant beat out everything,

yes you can do more with a Single TBR because its an OmniMech,
but a Ranged TBR vs a Ranged GHR will still be a close fight,
a Brawl TBR vs a Brawl BL KNT will still be a close fight,

the thing is you need 4 mechs bays with BattleMechs,
where as you only need 1 mech bay with an OmniMech,
(assuming your OmniMech has the Right Upgrades(Engine / Endo)

[Tarl Cabot]

Andi Nagasia, on 08 April 2017 - 02:00 PM, said:

very true, but your unable to talk about OmniMech Buffs because Clan Tech op,
sadly many of my OmniMech Topics have gone silent, i will awaken them on the Eve of IS OmniMechs,

ROFL, IS Omni.. death with the loss of one side torso isXL.. ROFL...ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL ROFL

Russ and Paul should really stop their 69er events...

Edited by Tarl Cabot, 08 April 2017 - 04:26 PM.