155 replies to this topic

[process]

I wouldn't consider myself an anti-respawner, but I see some unique challenges applying that to MWO.

Namely, how do you create even teams with respawns? Are we talking about finite tonnage and drops like FW, or unlimited or each?

Also in most FPS games the damage/HP ratio is enormous, so a single player can turn the tide, whereas in MWO you don't have that sort of potential that would otherwise stop a total stomp. Teamwork is OP, as they say.

[Deathlike]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 18 April 2017 - 02:34 PM, said:

Some of us actually preferred NR games in MW4, I know a sizable chunk that played in the NBT leagues did. CS:GO could also be considered to have no respawn in a way (economy is basically like logistics during a multi-stage fight like you might've had in old NBT matches for Guerrilla Raids and Planetary Assaults).

I never had a problem with limited respawns in MW4. It was different. I never really tried NR leagues (it just wasn't my cup of tea).

The thing is though, no respawns in the grand scheme of things is hard mode relative to an MW game. Considering the population, it has somewhat of an adverse effect if you wanted to learn about it in the way that one would need to properly progress.

It's not a simple matter honestly.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Ghogiel, on 18 April 2017 - 02:38 PM, said:

But imo MWO really doesn't need another mode ill suited and crammed into no respawn system.

I don't disagree, I'm perfectly fine with them moving this into FW (hell they could replace the stupid Invasion mode with this). There is a reason that I find FW boring though, and it has to do with both respawns AND game modes.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 18 April 2017 - 02:43 PM.

[Khobai]

it is a simple matter. its called a compromise.

you have no respawn gamemodes for people who wanna play no respawn
and you have respawn gamemodes for people who wanna play respawn

and instead of voting, you just have gamemodes be random so you get both types about 50% of the time

[GrimRiver]

People told me that I don't know for sure how the new assault would work out if respawns got added in my "Respawns for assault" post and I told them that it's just gonna still be mostly the same, skirmish with bases.

And guess what, it's still skirmish with bases.

As long as one life is still a thing then there is literally no reason to play the gamemode because it's faster just to kill the enemy team.

Other people: But what about conquest, the gamemode gets played alot there.
Well that's because teams spawn far enough from each other and the cap points are closer and easier to get for faster mechs.

Not only is it faster to just kill the reds but you get rewarded MORE for it than playing the objectives, which is why the game needs to move away from the kill kill kill KDR CoD fest.

(((Reward players for support, team and objective actions MORE than who can just out shoot the reds with their PPFLD meta cancer.)))

This last line is how to fix the lack of objective play, by simply giving more worth to it.

Edited by GrimRiver, 18 April 2017 - 02:48 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Khobai, on 18 April 2017 - 02:43 PM, said:

it is a simple matter. its called a compromise.

you have no respawn gamemodes for people who wanna play no respawn
and you have respawn gamemodes for people who wanna play respawn

and instead of voting, you just have gamemodes be random so you get both types about 50% of the time

Or you just keep respawn game modes to FW, which is even simpler.

[Melancholia]

While ur at it increase rewards for doing the objective too!

I'm a fairly new player and play lights(LCT), so i see this mode as great opporutnity..

Did collect the powers and delivered em while my team wreak havoc.. (well 3 out of 4 games in this mode so far)
But my rewards is abyssmal like 50-100k at best, due i do no damage i just collect it and deliver it...
basicly no reward, better kill stuff for the cbills

Edited by Melancholia, 18 April 2017 - 02:48 PM.

[Khobai]

Quote

Or you just keep respawn game modes to FW, which is even simpler.

except faction play is plagued with a host of other problems that make it nearly unplayable. I still sometimes play faction play despite its flaws and despite the fact its incredibly toxic. But im not disillusioned about how bad it is.

quickplay is the only thing thats playable now and mostly what I play nowadays. but quickplay is ret arded because every gamemode is literally skirmish. there is no point in having different gamemodes in quickplay if it just ends up being 6 different ways to skirmish.

The voting system is a sham because the only option is skirmish. you have your choice of skirmish, assault which is really just skirmish, skirmish in a circle, skirmish where you sometimes lose even when you win, skirmish where both teams lose because the gamemode is so bad, and lastly skirmish with bases where the bases do nothing because its still skirmish.

Quote

Did collect the powers and delivered em while my team wreak havoc.. (well 3 out of 4 games in this mode so far)
But my rewards is abyssmal like 50-100k at best, due i do no damage i just collect it and deliver it...
basicly no reward, better kill stuff for the cbills

pretty much. not only do you not get rewarded well for completing the objectives but completing them isnt even required to win the gamemode. its easier to just kill the enemy team and more rewarding too. because every gamemode is skirmish.

Quote

Reward players for support, team and objective actions MORE than who can just out shoot the reds with their PPFLD meta cancer.

its a nice dream

Edited by Khobai, 18 April 2017 - 03:03 PM.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Khobai, on 18 April 2017 - 02:48 PM, said:

but quickplay is ret arded because every gamemode is literally skirmish.

Emphasized your opinion, because to me that is a selling point.

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 18 April 2017 - 02:50 PM.

[HollowBassman]

If they add any respawn gamemode to QP they better have an opt-out checkbox somewhere and I don't mean that crap voting system we have now.

[Trev Firestorm]

Ghogiel, on 18 April 2017 - 02:26 PM, said:

I'm guessing besides MWO, anti respawners never actually played any other MW games/don't multiplayer in general. If they had their way it would just be 12v12 single spawn PvE bot farming or something.

I was anti-respawn back in the early days, I blame WoT indoctrination as that was my most played game in that time frame, despite years of battlefield and such. I have since returned to the land of the reasonable.

Edited by Trev Firestorm, 18 April 2017 - 02:52 PM.

[Shadow Magnet]

Well, first thing I would change about Incursion is to make one team defending and one attacking (without having an own base).
Then give much higher rewards for winning by destroying the enemy base or by winning by killing all attacking mechs and have as little damage to your base as possible. If winning by not just simply killing the enemy team is more rewarding, more people will try it, no?

As for respawns, why not use the already existing drop deck mechanic and apply it to all other game modes, too? Still with 15 minute match time out and bonus rewards if you achieve the objective faster and don't use all your mechs from the drop deck.

[Quicksilver Aberration]

Shadow Magnet, on 18 April 2017 - 02:52 PM, said:

As for respawns, why not use the already existing drop deck mechanic and apply it to all other game modes, too? Still with 15 minute match time out and bonus rewards if you achieve the objective faster and don't use all your mechs from the drop deck.

Because not everyone wants respawns in QP........nor does everyone want the sudden focus on objectives to shift (especially since many of the game modes don't actually force engagements with their objectives).

Edited by Quicksilver Kalasa, 18 April 2017 - 02:53 PM.

[Bishop Steiner]

Trev Firestorm, on 18 April 2017 - 02:51 PM, said:

I was anti-respawn back in the early days, I blame WoT indoctrination as that was my most played game in that time frame, despite years of battlefield and such. I have since returned to the land of the reasonable.

so not wanting every FPS game to play the same is "unreasonable" now, eh?

Good to know.

I crowdfunded a game that specifically stated "no respawns", because guess what? I unreasonably did not want them in a Mech game, and the zerg mentality it tends to spawn in the masses. Now excuse me while I go write manifestos and stuff.

[Chuck B]

Bishop Steiner, on 18 April 2017 - 02:34 PM, said:

add respawns to QP, and Bishop walks out the door. If Incursion is added to FW, then fine use up that Drop Deck.

So tired of people posting respawns as the answer to everything. This is not a respawn game. Deal with it.

Oh please add respawns, please please pretty please PGI!!??

[Accused]

I would be down for a tonnage limit on respawns like in CW. Pick 4 mechs of each weight class, etc.

[GrimRiver]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 18 April 2017 - 02:53 PM, said:

Because not everyone wants respawns in QP........nor does everyone want the sudden focus on objectives to shift (especially since many of the game modes don't actually force engagements with their objectives).

Whats the point of having objectives if they're not gonna be played?

Why not remove all the gamemode and just leave skirmish?

Isn't that the point of having objectives in the first place, to have something other than straight skirmish all the time 24/7, 365 days a year for the past 4 years?

Maybe people are just tired of that CoD gamemode and want to play the objectives like a real team based shooter but can't because they profit only off shooting each other more than the objectives?

[Bishop Steiner]

Chuck B, on 18 April 2017 - 02:58 PM, said:

Oh please add respawns, please please pretty please PGI!!??

Oh, now I have to stay just knowing that it apparently gets you butthurt.

[Pr8Dator2]

Scout Derek, on 18 April 2017 - 12:18 PM, said:

As in, a good bit of work. 2 months worth of work. Otherwise, it's just skirmish with bases.


Remember MW4, and that game mode in multiplayer where you actually had to destroy the enemy team's base to win? And there was respawns?

Yeah, I'd like it like that please. Probably should have mentioned it more back when it was in PTS, that fault is mine.


Things to be added:

- Respawns

- Actual Turrets that defend the base instead of those one shot little lostech turrets

- Spawn points (as in, add those hangars from the 1v1 map



I don't know, could be my distaste for having game modes where it's always the secondary win condition usually is killing the entire enemy team :/

Yes, incursion only works with respawns, otherwise, its just a disorganised skirmish.. in a way, I like it disorganised in a pug drop as it reduces the penalty of poor teamwork in a pug drop. Overall, I like incursion for Pug drop but I won't like it for Team drops. In fact, why can't we at least use our drop deck in Incursion??

Edited by Pr8Dator2, 18 April 2017 - 03:04 PM.

[Shadow Magnet]

Quicksilver Kalasa, on 18 April 2017 - 02:53 PM, said:

Because not everyone wants respawns in QP........nor does everyone want the sudden focus on objectives to shift (especially since many of the game modes don't actually force engagements with their objectives).

Well that means we stick with the game play as it is, just minor variations of skirmish and that's it?

I don't really get why people are so against respawns. In the end, QP is already respawning. You start just another map with the same mech, all damage magically gone, ammo fully refilled. It's respawning with some more manual clicking to launch.