953 replies to this topic

[Wolfgang Grenzstein]

There is now a significant problem stemming from the engine decoupling:
Assault mechs play like **** until you unlock the agility tree tweaks then they play less like ****.

Not every player has 91 historical skill points.

Consider that an average player is lucky to get 2-3 skill points out of every match (translates to 1.6-2.4k xp each match which is a pretty high estimate) and you are looking at roughly 10 games where your mech is utter garbage.

THEN you can sink the minimum points into mobility and THEN you can get what the meta considers "must have" next week and THEN you can work on customization - oh, you have no points left? To bad then.

[Aramuside]

Gernot von Kurzmann, on 16 May 2017 - 12:30 PM, said:

This skilltrees are labyrinths with no minotaur and no escape!

I need a map too find a way through this hell.


Game over...

Will their be a money refund with an mega money bonus for all the 1000s of houers i played for nothing?

No but many of us are laughing at you which might not have been your intention.

[Zarock]

Greetings, Mechwarrior-devs

Justb want to let you know something: good work! I really like how I can skill my mechs now, very individual and cool! The only problem I have is the amount of effort I have to put into this, 167 mechs times 91 clicks.. will take a whil till I reskilled everything :/ I hope we get some cool events to sweeten this time

[Aramuside]

Gernot von Kurzmann, on 16 May 2017 - 12:48 PM, said:

Iam done - that destroyed MWO for me!

I fought in 18.000 Matches!
Killed over 15.000 Mechs in Quickplay!
Was an MDD Legend in CW!
And have 154 Mechs!

But this Patch killed all my Love for MWO.



Cu in hell!

Did you even try it?

Coincidentally why did you not try PTS 2 as you'd have seen all this already... or in fact read any of the past threads?

[ZortPointNarf]

SPNKRGrenth, on 17 May 2017 - 02:10 AM, said:

I'm amused by all these people who try to play the game from the forums, calling doom and gloom. Meanwhile, plenty of people are messing around with the new skill tree system and having a good time of it.

Is it new? Yes. Is it different? Also yes. Does it trigger people who don't like change? EXTREMELY YES.

But it also gives me another thing to fiddle with, and I love fiddling. Not to mention it buffs some of the weaker mechs when you actually go out and play them after putting some good nodes on them.

The new system needs work, it needs refinement, it needs simplification. But at the core of it, it's fun and different, and lets you have more variety be viable than with the old minimaxing system.

And to everyone going on and on about how you have to spend SO MUCH TIME going through all your old mechs to skill them out. You don't. You really don't. Just skill them as you want to play a certain one, not need to act like you have to do it all in one go or it's no good, as if you're being shortchanged by the simple fact you have mechs that haven't gotten their skilltree filled out yet. When really with mastered mechs, you have the points all there, you're not going to lose those points by leaving them unused for awhile as you set mechs how you want them. It's a new thing to learn and it looks intimidating, but once you start actually playing with it for a while things are simpler than they seem.

This is not the doom of MWO. Things are not so imbalanced that some insist on saying they are. And more importantly the game is still hella fun to play. It gives more control of what the mech is good at over to the player, instead of being made to play a mech a handful of ways or I'm doing it wrong. While still managing to have the different mechs feel like they're different from each other, rather than blending together into pointlessness.

For those that hate the new system even after giving it a real chance, playing with it for a few hours, seeing what can be done with it, I am sorry that changing this one aspect of the game has ruined it for you. That's never fun, no matter the circumstances. But have you considered all the added control that the new system gives to the player for what they want their mech to be good at?

I've seen lots of talk about how so many nodes have to be used to get back exactly how the skills were before. Well here's a suggestion, try out new things and see what's fun, what works, what's effective. We've all been given a new tool with a massive amount of options to tweak and mix together, so trying to merely copy what was there before seems like a waste of potential enjoyment when so many new possibilities are created with it.

In closing, thank you PGI for the new system, though I HIGHLY encourage you to work in streamlining and simplifying it some, as it really does need it. I'm having lots of fun discovering all kinds of new ways to use my mechs, and being surprised how effective they are at doing what I did with them before, finding they even do it a bit better sometimes! Looking forward to the energy weapon rebalance next month, and all the new tech the month after that. In the meantime, I'll be very busy with the 70 mechs I currently have, making them the best they can be, without having to get 3! of them just to maximize the one I like the most.

Well said, couldn't agree more.

Wolfgang Grenzstein, on 17 May 2017 - 02:29 AM, said:

There is now a significant problem stemming from the engine decoupling:
Assault mechs play like **** until you unlock the agility tree tweaks then they play less like ****.

Not every player has 91 historical skill points.

Consider that an average player is lucky to get 2-3 skill points out of every match (translates to 1.6-2.4k xp each match which is a pretty high estimate) and you are looking at roughly 10 games where your mech is utter garbage.

THEN you can sink the minimum points into mobility and THEN you can get what the meta considers "must have" next week and THEN you can work on customization - oh, you have no points left? To bad then.

How is this different from the old system where you needed to basic 3 mechs, and then elite one to get the bonus on the basic level. The rate of progression with the new system is dramatically faster than with the old one. I think new players would find the speed of progression much more pleasant than the old system. Granted it does look awfully complex if you have not been following the development.


For myself I have been following this since PTS1, and am very happy with the way most of the concerns were addressed. The only part missing is that the tree nodes need smart pathing and/or the ability to save templates.
As to those crying about having to re-spec their mechs, yes it may sound daunting, but when last did you play some of your x-hundred mechs? Is it really soooo critical to level them all up now? I will only be leveling the mechs I want to play for now, then slowly work my way through the system, playing learning, finding out how the new tree suits my play style before committing to a build.

Stomp you guys later

Edited by ZortPointNarf, 17 May 2017 - 02:55 AM.

[Ulvar]

Well i like the new system a lot more than the old one. there are bugs, usabillity issues und balancing problems but i think it has potential given some time.

[Dee Eight]

CadoAzazel, on 16 May 2017 - 09:00 PM, said:

Going to convince myself not to touch the forums except to read PGI announcement posts / tournaments and not bother playing after today except tournaments/events. LPL's with less range now are useless, even if i did manage 1k damage in my 1st QP game with them after patch it was potatoes on other team not a decent loadout like it used to be.

PPC'S now take longer to recharge with max nodes =(

Lemme guess... TDR-9SE remorse ? Because I myself see see +15% to all weapons fron 15 range nodes being better than a single +10% range module for one weapon type.

[DevlinCognito]

Ok, so I had a decent nights sleep and woke up all eager to give this another shot and see what I could do with this new system. Logged in, went to one of my favourite Mechs took another look at the skill tree for 5-6 minutes, logged out and booted up Steel Division.

PGI, making things needlessly complicated and complicated is not adding depth, you have so many helpful experienced players of this game (not just Islanders) telling you this was a bad idea and giving you alternatives, but you ignored them all and went ahead anyway. This game is your creation, and I personally have enjoyed it spending WAAAAYY to much time in it. I have mostly ignored the dumpster fires you have created and plodded along anyway finding new ways to have fun, but adding something that makes your most dedicated playerbase boot up other games isn't going to make you money, unless I really messed up how business works.

[Tronword Furey]

I can't believe you've done this..

[MovinTarget]

Devlin, if it helps at all, visualize every skill unlock as a direct strike to the back of a fellow IDI's mech...


Better still:
Weapons tree: improves ability to shoot fellow IDI pilots
Survival tree: improves sais pilot's ability to withstand your shenanigans.
Agility tree: allows you to better dodge their return fire.

There, that should incentivize Devlin!

Tronword Furey, on 17 May 2017 - 03:15 AM, said:

I can't believe you've done this..

I KNOW RIGHT?!?! ISN'T IT GREAT?

Edited by MovinTarget, 17 May 2017 - 03:57 AM.

[johnwolf]

DevlinCognito, on 17 May 2017 - 03:09 AM, said:

PGI, making things needlessly complicated and complicated is not adding depth

Complicated....i couldn't beyond disagree here, it's very straight forward and easy to understand. It only LOOKS complex from the start and a new player may be intimidated. that being said, there's a LOT of depth here, especially if you think about what you have to start compensating in order to have skills in everything.

[Aramuside]

Ed Steele, on 16 May 2017 - 01:38 PM, said:

Yes, but those same players no longer have to buy and level two additional variants that they don't want. Basically you will spend the same amount of time levelling one variant as it did to level 3.

Ummh thanks for making any collector utterly hate this game as you just implied its now treble the time to level a mech.

[Terrastras Rex]

I don't mind it.

All my mechs play a little different now (without skills), and with skills I can customize them.

Edited by Terrastras Rex, 17 May 2017 - 03:26 AM.

[-Quiet-]

wow pgi .. I just had fun .. good update
I just wander - because we the users having fun ..so I wander when you start nerfing us again !!

[Aramuside]

Horseman, on 16 May 2017 - 03:12 PM, said:

We didn't. Both PTS instances consistently received overwhelmingly negative feedback for the UI, UX and new player experience - feedback that has been almost entirely ignored.

Not actually true at all which makes me wonder if you even tried it there?

Have to say I certainly never saw you and I tried PTS 1 and 2 heavily including each variant.

But hey... I'm sure your "alternate facts" are useful in preaching to the crowd.

[HeresWhy]

SPNKRGrenth, on 17 May 2017 - 02:10 AM, said:

I'm amused by all these people who try to play the game from the forums, calling doom and gloom. Meanwhile, plenty of people are messing around with the new skill tree system and having a good time of it.

I'm amused by all these people who'll eat any old bullpoop up just because they haven't tried it. You know it's still poop, but just because it's poop from a different species doesn't mean you need to eat it to find out if it's any different.

Edited by HeresWhy, 17 May 2017 - 03:35 AM.

[goatreich]

Patched, logged in, noticed I was 100M C-bills and 1000 MC richer. Off to a good start.
Skilled 3 Javelins with General SP. Played a game with each. Cute little mechs.
Skilled Atlas DDC, had a 700 damage game. Still slow and ponderousbut now with extra armor and structure.
Skilled Atlas D. Like wise.
Skilled KIng-Crab 0000. Still sucks.

So basically, it's business as usual and the sky didn't fall.

[MovinTarget]

Aramuside, on 17 May 2017 - 03:33 AM, said:

Not actually true at all which makes me wonder if you even tried it there?

Have to say I certainly never saw you and I tried PTS 1 and 2 heavily including each variant.

But hey... I'm sure your "alternate facts" are useful in preaching to the crowd.

On top of that we all know that voices tend to be louder and more vociferous when people don't like something.

Tons of people play this game without playing the forum warrior mini-game so the more accurate statemate is "alot of people that use forums expressed dislike over the skill tree implementation and threatened to rage quit."

[Dee Eight]

After about 8 mechs skilled I have basically cut the time down to under 2 mins to do a complete 91 nodes. Unless you've had a stroke or impact based head trauma and are unable to connect short term to long term memory... it should take no effort at all to learn the sub-trees and know exactly where to go to get the nodes you want for a particular build you already enjoy playing.

[BzP]

All I can say in the topic about new skill tree is - you have MURDERED THE FUN of playing this game with all LOCUSTS,
I have tried to rebalance this mech with new skills in any possible way - it moves like a piece of WOOD NOW !
RIP Locust - RIP FUN - RIP MWO !