126 replies to this topic

[Kaeb Odellas]

Tordin, on 12 June 2017 - 08:30 AM, said:

Wolfhound and Panthers are right sized, aka tall as they should be. They have great hitboxes and are tough. Wolfhounds especially. Not sure about the Firestarter, I imagine they should be somewhat taller than the Commando. Tallness isnt the problem, it could actually be benefical, wideness however. I bet its that many think the Firestarter is too wide, not exactly too tall.

They're only tough because they have substantial armor quirks to go with their high armor skill percentages.

[Mcgral18]

RIP light mechs


Their viability is almost entirely due to Quirks
Is the cheetah the only exception to that rule?


Then we have Potatoes asking them to get nerfed....
PotatoPlz

[Trollfeed]

Was hilarious when locust tried to leghump my Mr. Gargles, he lived for about 2s. If you get solo killed by light, you have made mistakes with your positioning, build and aim.

[Grus]

Jay Leon Hart, on 12 June 2017 - 09:48 AM, said:

Or, put weapons in your arms? Crazy idea, I know...

because putting a ton or two of Las in the arms isn't better than a ton or two of ammo (kdk-3) I mean 4 ac2 and Las in the arms could work but I'll keep my quad gauss.

[Xiphias]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:03 AM, said:

because putting a ton or two of Las in the arms isn't better than a ton or two of ammo (kdk-3) I mean 4 ac2 and Las in the arms could work but I'll keep my quad gauss.

So you are making a choice with your build and you think that light mechs should be nerfed because you aren't willing to make the build choices that would easily counter them?

[Grus]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 09:26 AM, said:

that mechanic was in back in closed beta and was wonderful. Valid tactic was to antisapate where the light mech was coming around and ram him to knock him over and then leg him. Now we have to just cal up into a wall to keep them from getting behind you, anf I hope you have arm mounted weapons because you can't aim down far enpugh with torso high mounts to hit the locus litterly in your crotch (Kodiak as reference)

the thing is with that mechanic in place Light mech wouldn't be easy mode any more in the brawl. Back in the day, if you were brawling in a light mech effectively (this may baffle a few) you became a damn good pilot. Why? Well because touching another mech was for the most part a death sentence. So situational awareness was key. But since PGI had to attract the twitch shooters they got rid of the mechanic. So now instead of light mech's being flankers and harrassers they can run into a ball of mech's with reckless abandon, hit a few kneecaps and get out with only %5 damage taken... seems fair.

[ZippySpeedMonkey]

Can we rename this, "Light mechs are too big" ?

My beloved Panther (35 T) is the same size as a Hunchback (50 T), and absolutely massive compared to a Cheetah (30 T).

[Jay Leon Hart]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:13 AM, said:

the thing is with that mechanic in place Light mech wouldn't be easy mode any more in the brawl. Back in the day, if you were brawling in a light mech effectively (this may baffle a few) you became a damn good pilot. Why? Well because touching another mech was for the most part a death sentence. So situational awareness was key. But since PGI had to attract the twitch shooters they got rid of the mechanic. So now instead of light mech's being flankers and harrassers they can run into a ball of mech's with reckless abandon, hit a few kneecaps and get out with only %5 damage taken... seems fair.

Please, record yourself brawling in a Light 'mech, I'd love to see it.
Good Light 'mech pilots don't brawl. They get in, deliver a volley or two and get out.

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:03 AM, said:

because putting a ton or two of Las in the arms isn't better than a ton or two of ammo (kdk-3) I mean 4 ac2 and Las in the arms could work but I'll keep my quad gauss.

Then accept that your build choices have consequences, just like running a really hot build is going to suffer vs Gauss or Flamers.

Edited by Jay Leon Hart, 12 June 2017 - 11:49 AM.

[Mystere]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:03 AM, said:

because putting a ton or two of Las in the arms isn't better than a ton or two of ammo (kdk-3) I mean 4 ac2 and Las in the arms could work but I'll keep my quad gauss.

Then go live with the consequences of your decisions, not demand that lights be made irrelevant.

[dario03]

Gwei Loong, on 12 June 2017 - 06:15 AM, said:

The Locust, Commando, Artic Cheetah and Spider seem to be giving a lot of players some trouble. There may be a few others but I find these mechs in particular cause many members of our community a lot frustration.
You’ll often see a Locust or a Commando run feely through an enemy team without a care in world. I hear people in my groups complain about not being able to hit them or that the hit boxes on these mechs aren’t registering correctly.
Now with the recent engine desync, decreased torso twist, and increased TTK I see more people have difficulty aiming at such small and fast moving targets. Combine this with the ability to carry multiple arty strikes and we have an elephant in the room no one is willing to talk about.
It is true that perhaps these mechs are too small. I bet if we look at the data and we compared the lights I have mentioned to the rest of them we’d find that they are over performing.
Why are they over performing though? Is it possible that they are too small and we need to make them larger so that they are easier for everyone to hit.
I have heard many people over the past few weeks rage about the fact that they got attacked by a Locust and got killed while piloting an assault.
There is also a recent post on R/MWO about a Spider that did 1100 dmg in one match. That’s more than twice as much as any other member of his party.
I am not going to say that all light mechs are OP but a few of them are defiantly outperforming the rest and I think they need to be resized and made larger. It’s bad enough trying to focus on something so small but then when you do finally zoom in on an Artic Cheetah to get that perfect shot but it starts spamming its jump jets I see to many people who are struggling to hit what they are aiming for.
The simple solution is to just make these mechs a lot bigger. By doing this I think it will help improve the game in two ways. Frist off it will make it easier for people to see because we all know what it’s like to have a Locust run up underneath you and secondly it should help to improve hit box registration. Bigger is better, we’ve all heard that.

Now if we look here you’ll see that a Commando should be half the size of a Banshee.



However, when we look at the size comparison in game we see that a Commando is not half the size of a Banshee. Look at the Locust, according to this chart it's the size of an ant.



These mechs are in fact so small that they are able to hide behind a turret. Should a mech be able to hide behind a turret?
I have at least a hundred screen shots which I have been collecting from this past month of people raging in game. So the BIG issue here is balance and balancing the game towards a relaxed MM that everyone can enjoy.
How can you add new tech and balance a game if the things we go by are not balanced already? If the games not balanced properly then how can we consider if a win's a win.
Has it gotten to a point that being aware of the hit box registration issue and still using these mechs is in fact an exploit? You decide…

The fact that its a big deal that a spider did 1100 damage when bigger mechs do that fairly often, should tell you that the balance issue is with lights being to weak. They need buffed, not nerfed over and over again.

[Grus]

Mystere, on 12 June 2017 - 11:36 AM, said:

Then go live with the consequences of your decisions, not demand that lights be made irrelevant.

wouldnt be if you become a better pilot, or adapt, you know, what every other pilot does when the meta change..

Light mech's arnt irrelevant when the fall mechanic was in place, you just had to be a better pilot, and a lot of you refuse to get better to use that mech.

[dario03]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

wouldnt be if you become a better pilot, or adapt, you know, what every other pilot does when the meta change..

Light mech's arnt irrelevant when the fall mechanic was in place, you just had to be a better pilot, and a lot of you refuse to get better to use that mech.

You can adapt all you want, but when a weak class is made even weaker or has another counter made for it, that isn't balance.

[Kalleballe]

@OP

Try piloting a light yourself, and I am sure other pilots will be happy to show you how to handle them.

Edited by Kalleballe, 12 June 2017 - 12:08 PM.

[Mystere]

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

wouldnt be if you become a better pilot, or adapt, you know, what every other pilot does when the meta change..

Light mech's arnt irrelevant when the fall mechanic was in place, you just had to be a better pilot, and a lot of you refuse to get better to use that mech.

LOL!

[kf envy]

just need to bing back knock down

[Vordhosbn11]

El Bandito, on 12 June 2017 - 07:45 AM, said:

1. If your Assault is losing to a Light 1v1, then the issue might not be on the mech. Hell, mount some Streaks if you can't hit it. My most played mechs are Assaults, and Lights don't scare me.

2. There is nothing wrong with Light mech getting the better of an Assault mech in this Skirmish only arena of a game. Making it more of a rock-paper-scissors suits me just fine.

Dude what are you talking about? Saying "the issue might not be the mech" like assaults have some huge advantage over lights.

Assaults make the easiest targets for light mechs hands down. I salivate in my locust when I see a Dire or king crab waddling about all by himself - it's literally the easiest solo kill/KMDD you will find. I'd say the in light vs assault, the light mech has a substantial advantage almost every time when the fight is up close and not ranged, maybe except for the Urbanmech

Edited by Vordhosbn11, 12 June 2017 - 12:36 PM.

[Mystere]

Vordhosbn11, on 12 June 2017 - 12:33 PM, said:

Dude what are you talking about? Saying "the issue might not be the mech" like assaults have some huge advantage over lights.

Assaults make the easiest targets for light mechs hands down. I salivate in my locust when I see a Dire or king crab waddling about all by himself - it's literally the easiest solo kill/KMDD you will find. I'd say the in light vs assault, the light mech has a substantial advantage almost every time when the fight is up close and not ranged, maybe except for the Urbanmech

Yeah! Yeah! That's what they said about my Pretty Baby ... until they started eating SSRMs, followed by ERPPC shots to the back.

[Weeny Machine]

Tordin, on 12 June 2017 - 08:30 AM, said:

Wolfhound and Panthers are right sized, aka tall as they should be. They have great hitboxes and are tough. Wolfhounds especially. Not sure about the Firestarter, I imagine they should be somewhat taller than the Commando. Tallness isnt the problem, it could actually be benefical, wideness however. I bet its that many think the Firestarter is too wide, not exactly too tall.

They got their armour quirks after the resizing. So it is safe to assume that they should compensate for the huge size. Too bad that they still feel fragile, even after speccing heavily in the survival tree. I peeked up a hill - on the other side was a stationary Atlas which therefore didn't show on seismic. One alpha and my arm was gone and the ST took some severe damage - and I reacted immediately and turned while moving backwards down the slope. So much for agility and thoughness...

Mcgral18, on 12 June 2017 - 09:50 AM, said:

RIP light mechs


Their viability is almost entirely due to Quirks
Is the cheetah the only exception to that rule?


Then we have Potatoes asking them to get nerfed....
PotatoPlz

Pretty much this. Especially when the class has a hardcounter: streaks. Which is hilarious in itself as a game mechanic

Those people who still complain or just say lights are fine should ask themselves following questions:
1. Why is the light mech queue so short outside of events if lights are good or even op?
2. What role have lights which cannot be performed or even better performed by a fast medium...or the Linebacker?
3. You can do fine in a light mech? I can do that as well. Now as yourself, though: how much effort do you have to put in reaching that score compared to a medium/heavy/assault?

Grus, on 12 June 2017 - 11:50 AM, said:

wouldnt be if you become a better pilot, or adapt, you know, what every other pilot does when the meta change..

Light mech's arnt irrelevant when the fall mechanic was in place, you just had to be a better pilot, and a lot of you refuse to get better to use that mech.

Coming from the guy who cannot cope with the weakest mech class in game and wants it nerfed even more...now, that is comedy gold

Edited by Bush Hopper, 12 June 2017 - 01:33 PM.

[Weeny Machine]

Vordhosbn11, on 12 June 2017 - 12:33 PM, said:

Dude what are you talking about? Saying "the issue might not be the mech" like assaults have some huge advantage over lights.

Assaults make the easiest targets for light mechs hands down. I salivate in my locust when I see a Dire or king crab waddling about all by himself - it's literally the easiest solo kill/KMDD you will find. I'd say the in light vs assault, the light mech has a substantial advantage almost every time when the fight is up close and not ranged, maybe except for the Urbanmech

Generalization for the win.

A locust or commando have a rather easy time. Now try that with a 35t vs a Battlemaster specced into mobility. And please, no T4-5 potato but one of the guys we have to play in the upper tiers. Then come back and tell us how it ended.

Thanks in advance

[r4plez]

This is MWO, we have ghost heat, 1.4 dual heat sinks, charged gauss and small lights - deal with it.

Edited by r4plez, 12 June 2017 - 01:44 PM.