97 replies to this topic

[AphexTwin11]

razenWing, on 28 June 2017 - 06:09 PM, said:

Technically, a lot of things in this game can be considered broken as hell, but this retardation is beyond believe.

Remember back 3 months ago when I predicted that Stealth Armor would be the most broken OP shat ever, and 75% of the people were like, "nah, there would be some sort of balance"

Nope.

Just watched theb33f ran around for 2 minutes straight with no heat buildup. ZERO. NONE. Yup, no need to ever turn it off.

And then, I watched theb33f used a Javalin with 6 RL20 launchers and erased an assault mech.

Put 2 and 2 together... and this is probably the most ******** combination ever that will break all kind of game play.

Still don't get it? Let me explain. MWO is not a 1v1 game (until Solaris), so inherently, the ability to do a 1 for 1 trade is NOT equal. Using 1 Javalin to trade an Atlas, for example, is like using a Rook to trade the Queen.

Worst yet, the Rook is not being traded per se. Because in Comp Play, there is only one competitive mode, which is Conquest. So you get these forever stealth Rook going around trading off every Queen, Knight, Castle, Bishop on the board.

It's not too hard when the game is your Queen Knight and Bishop vs 3 Rooks. (And keep in mind, your 2-3 rooks are still running around capping all the freaking points in unstoppable rampage)

But throw all that theoretical super meta strat aside, WHY THE FOK DID PGI INVENTED A RETALIATION-FREE MECHANICS WITH THE SOLE PURPOSE OF FOKING UP ONE PERSON'S DAY? It's like in every game, 1 to multiple people is going to be unhappy. There's no other way to explain this.

And this is not even a Direstar situation. This is eligible on so many mechs. (And also, Direstar is a piece of trash that require a 10 armor Direwolf to function, and the fact that trading 100 tons away for anything is at best even but WORSE in almost every case. At best, you traded your Queen for a Queen, but most of the time... DON'T TRADE YOUR QUEEN FOR A BISHOP/KNIGHT/ROOK, it's BAD strat).

Why PGI? Why did you do this? Cause you know... just randomly making a selected few individual pissed off at your game for no raisen every drop is a great way to keep a dwindling population...

Jesus...

(Javelin = Atlas) = balanced. What don't you get? Pretty easy to understand.

Try this website: http://metamechs.com/ It will help you out, and is a good place to start for new players.

Edited by AphexTwin11, 29 June 2017 - 08:16 AM.

[Cy Mitchell]

Shifty McSwift, on 28 June 2017 - 08:57 PM, said:

New farming meta; Load up 5 suicide RL light builds, jump into a game, charge enemy location, get a kill or die in the first 15 seconds, leave game, grab next RL suicide light, jump in a game, get a kill or die in the first 15 seconds... Repeat ad nauseum, ad infinitus, and add in some childish battle cries too, because you know it'l happen.

That should increase the demand for respawn. Then it will be just like CoD!

[Sereglach]

This conversation is exactly why I was hoping and advocating for MekTek style rocket launchers. It should only shoot one rocket per trigger squeeze, with a number of shots equal to the launcher size, and with more damage per rocket but avoiding the obscene alphas.

Saying you want to improve time-to-live and then putting in suicide bomber weapons is not exactly a smart move.

[Andi Nagasia]

first off, RL have massive HitRegistration problems right now,
even if you fire them on chain fire, some times you wont even get half the listed damage,
i dont think we can Judge how effective they are wail their not reliable Hit Reg wise,

also this discussion is probably better Suited in the PTS feed Back dont your think?

[Moomtazz]

GrimRiver, on 29 June 2017 - 07:56 AM, said:

If you're talking about B33f using it then you must've not tested it yourself.

Twitch streamers usually leaves a recording of their streams, if you would link to the video it'll make you case more believable.

But testing for myself there are far more cons to stealth armor than pros, anyone that tested it will tell you the same issues that I listed.

It looks like there is no heat generated while moving on Forest Colony. Maybe skill tree effects can make it heat neutral. Overall it looks like stealth from many MMO games. Potential to be another solo non-armor sharing play style like LRM or ERsniper.

[Andi Nagasia]

Moomtazz, on 29 June 2017 - 08:43 AM, said:

It looks like there is no heat generated while moving on Forest Colony. Maybe skill tree effects can make it heat neutral. Overall it looks like stealth from many MMO games. Potential to be another solo non-armor sharing play style like LRM or ERsniper.

um, thats not on the PTS, thats live game, PTS is currently only 4v4,
TheB33F was making Jokes not about Stealth Armor but the Enforcer Hero, which has a Forest Ghillie camo,

Notice at the Bottom Right where is says(Inactive Stealth Armor)
TheB33F video doesnt have that, so its not that,

[Cato Phoenix]

Moomtazz, on 29 June 2017 - 08:43 AM, said:

It looks like there is no heat generated while moving on Forest Colony. Maybe skill tree effects can make it heat neutral. Overall it looks like stealth from many MMO games. Potential to be another solo non-armor sharing play style like LRM or ERsniper.

Haha, uhm...do you realize that footage is actually without Stealth Armor?

There's 12 v 12 mechs there so its not on the PTS.

It's just b33f using the ghillie like a .... ghillie suit.

[GrimRiver]

Moomtazz, on 29 June 2017 - 08:43 AM, said:

It looks like there is no heat generated while moving on Forest Colony. Maybe skill tree effects can make it heat neutral. Overall it looks like stealth from many MMO games. Potential to be another solo non-armor sharing play style like LRM or ERsniper.

That isn't PTS, that's live server.

Stealth armor shows up above ECM and can be toggled on and off the same way ECM is, it also has a flamer type of cooldown bar once it's deactivated there is a 10 second cooldown until reuse.

[Ruccus]

Vellron2005, on 28 June 2017 - 11:29 PM, said:

OK, so you can one-shot an assault with a light and after that you're useless..

But let's say you bring 12 of those lights on your first wave in FP, they kill most assaults, and then you bring 12 more on second and third wave..

Cose' you know, you can bring more than just one light per dropdeck.. would make for a very frustrating one-shot kill style play.. not good.

Well, it could change up the standard 'Drop in your heaviest mech' playstyle. Instead of dropping in a heavy or assault, drop some of the first wave in lights and/or mediums centered around killing those mechs and able to suck up a huge alpha without dying. Maybe a standard/LFE Bushwacker (its long profile allows it to show its torso quickly) or zombie build Centurion that can suck up a huge alpha and keep fighting. You see a one-trick pony, you call it out and sic your anti-light mechs on it.

[Andi Nagasia]

also for anyone saying that you can get Stealth armor working with no heat buildup,... NOPE,
just did a Test, AS7-D-DC, ECM, Stealth Armor, 360STD engine, 23DHS,

5seconds after starting Stealth Armor, it started Generating heat, 1% every second or so,
having a higher Max heat will mean it will take Longer to build up the heat, but it cant nullify the Heat Generated,

[MechaBattler]

They should just hard lock how many rocket launchers you can put on a mech.

I hate to be the killer of 'fun'. But do we really need kamakazi builds in this game? One person gets his rocks off face splatting one guy and from what I saw of Beef trying, not always successfully. And then the whole team is stuck with dead weight for the rest of the match.

[GrimRiver]

Andi Nagasia, on 29 June 2017 - 09:10 AM, said:

also for anyone saying that you can get Stealth armor working with no heat buildup,... NOPE,
just did a Test, AS7-D-DC, ECM, Stealth Armor, 360STD engine, 23DHS,

5seconds after starting Stealth Armor, it started Generating heat, 1% every second or so,
having a higher Max heat will mean it will take Longer to build up the heat, but it cant nullify the Heat Generated,

Yup, got the same results with every IS ECM mech.

Stealth armor, ENDO and DHS left little room for weapons and ammo and even less room for the heatsinks to cool them down, not to mention the loss of all targeting data when active.

There is far more cons to SA than pros.

[Moomtazz]

Cato Phoenix, on 29 June 2017 - 09:02 AM, said:

Haha, uhm...do you realize that footage is actually without Stealth Armor?

There's 12 v 12 mechs there so its not on the PTS.

It's just b33f using the ghillie like a .... ghillie suit.

I obviously did not realize it was without stealth armor. The way the enemy team acted made me assume he was invisible. That enemy team.....man...

[0bsidion]

I don't see what the big deal is. If someone wants to load up a Javelin with 6 RL20s and shoot them all off in one big alpha, they'll be defenseless for the rest of the match.

RLs are one shot weapons. There should be a big pay out for using them otherwise there's no point in having them. I'll have to vote no on limiting the amounts you can carry. And ghost heat would be equally pointless on a one shot weapon.

With as much customization as this game allows there's always been the potential for silly one shot wonder builds, and yet we rarely see them. That's because they're entertaining for about one or two matches and then people move on to something more practical.

[Thorn Hallis]

Uhm...aren't RL supposed to be one-shot-weapons?

And why is there no heat on the stealth armor? In BT you get constant 10 heat points when activating it.

I'm seriously confused.

[FupDup]

Thorn Hallis, on 29 June 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

Uhm...aren't RL supposed to be one-shot-weapons?

They are, but it's a bad design that is very hard to balance in an FPS game like MWO. Also, PGI gave them a 75% damage buff, so for example the RL20 deals 35 damage.

Thorn Hallis, on 29 June 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

And why is there no heat on the stealth armor? In BT you get constant 10 heat points when activating it.

The heat points are probably being canceled out by the heat dissipation of the internal heatsinks.

[Khobai]

Quote

They are, but it's a bad design that is very hard to balance in an FPS game like MWO. Also, PGI gave them a 75% damage buff, so for example the RL20 deals 35 damage.

also in battletech you roll to hit and if you hit you have to roll on the missile hits table. so not all the rockets always hit. usually only like 60% of them hit.

and also in battletech hit locations are random, but in MWO you can aim the rockets for someones torso so a much higher percentage hit the torso compared to tabletop.

those factors also contribute to rocket launchers being way more deadly in MWO compared to tabletop in addition to the fact they upped the damage by 75%.

they really need to put a hard cap on rocket launchers

Edited by Khobai, 29 June 2017 - 11:35 AM.

[Thorn Hallis]

Phew, thanks for the answer. This civil war stuff is going to cause some headaches I guess.

[Brain Cancer]

Honestly, I expect them to simply revert to 1/missile like in TT.

That's enough to massively drop the alpha damage.

[GrimRiver]

Thorn Hallis, on 29 June 2017 - 11:18 AM, said:

Uhm...aren't RL supposed to be one-shot-weapons?

And why is there no heat on the stealth armor? In BT you get constant 10 heat points when activating it.

I'm seriously confused.

You don't build heat when standing still but builds 1 heat a second when moving and while active you heat never dissipates, it also remove all targeting data for yourself and for teammates(Meaning you could accidentally shoot teammates thinking it's enemies since there isn't any target over anybody's head when active.)

If you fire ERPPC and your heat spikes to 20% with stealth armor active it'll stay at 20% until you turn stealth armor off, pretty much stores all of your heat when on.

It's biggest con is the perma loss of 12 crit slots when installed on a ECM mech and paired with ENDO and DHS leaves almost no room to work with, so no boating weapons or taking large bulky weapons.